@unclepulky: In that interview it is also stated by Tynion that he sees this setting as Batman's workplace explaining why we dont see Damian and why he wont bother with the Bat/Cat engagement, diplomatically leaving it to Tom. So if Tynion isn't willing to acknowledge actual important things in Bruce's life then do you actually think the other writers will acknowledge Tynion's changes to Bruce's life?

Bat/Cat will get married in 50 out in July, Cassandra's adoption will likely take place in June if it does happen at all, so either it wont happen because that's too much happening simultaneously in Bruce's life upsetting the status quo or it will get swallowed by the behemoth that is the Bat/Cat wedding and no one will care except for Tynion himself.

Either way the Bat/Cat wedding is where its at and funnily enough Bruce might die again or something as hinted in Batman 6 so Cassandra's adoption will get screwed over again just like it did back in the Pre FP Continuity thanks to R.I.P and Bruce's "death".

I love how DC rebooted their universe only to fill it with pale imitations and trying to recapture vastly superior moments from their earlier continuity. Cass and Bruce had an organically developed bond pre-FP. Now who even cares?

DC should get King off Batman ASAP

I still don't understand how someone who made Mr. Miracle and The Vision could make such a garbage book

@morpheus_: to be fair, DC isn't really doing that, Tynion is with his retelling of every single character on that team's stories. It's all nostalgia. But is that any worse than the alternative? King's brand new direction and ideas that are sometimes flat out ludicrous? Honestly superman is where it is at these days. Mix of old and new.

@unclepulky: I doubt the adoption will happen. Theres no point or lead up to it now. And more character focused arcs? That's not what I want Tynion just rinses and repeats his stories with different people at the front. If it could be a cass solo then great, I want that, but a cass focused storyline in THIS team book means the rest of the cast are gonna look like incompetent idiots once again, like every other character focused arc. Can't this man takes cues from other team books?

@causeimbatman: honestly. I don't flat out hate it, but its gotten to the point where I don't see myself continuing it anymore. my batman books will now come from mini series and ogns. cauae the main ones suck.

@entropy_aegis: his workplace? that's a terrible excuse, batmans workplace is basically everywhere the man goes. Plus damian and Selina are active members of his "work". So far Tynions book has always existed in it's own corner, and I'd like it to stay there.

I agree about the adoption though, it won't happen. I'd think it would be nice for it to happen now, but it won't not because of the wedding, they could just do it after. It just makes no sense now, why the hell would he adopt her? He BARELY knows her at this point. If he does adopt her after the spring cass storyline (another one for her) it would just be pandering to nostalgia (again). But he said he's not thinking about it for now. A few years down the line, for sure I'd like that but it has to be earned.

@eto: have you read seeleys green lantern? how was that? I'm really liking jess and simon so far. more so than hals book. what they did to soranik turned me off that.

@jameswayne: There should be a balance between the two and I can't find myself caring for a character that might or might not be adopted now because I used to like a version of them from another continuity altogether. Let's be honest: almost no one cares for Cass due to her current portrayal, they like her because they've read her series pre-FP. Tynion is cashing on nostalgia while offering distorted, inferior versions of the originals. It is probably serviceable for readers that never read anything involving those characters before hand, but it is otherwise a very poor substitute, really.

@jameswayne: I know right?!?!

Green Lanterns is way, waaaaay better than Hal Jordan and the GLC tbh. Ironic, because I was rooting for Hal and thought the rookie Lanterns wouldn't excel at all. I was wrong, so wrong lol.

Anyways, as for your question, yeah we've only had one issue thus far and it was good imo but what I don't get: Seeley was great on Nightwing and Sam on GLanterns, why the damn switch?!?!

I guess Seeley wrote all that he wanted to write in the first place or he just got bored.

Either way I respect that. Seeley has been working on the Batcorner of DC for years now so if he realized that its simply time to move on then its a praiseworthy decision.

Now if only Tynion and King could get that memo.

Yeah Seeley was on fire, but like you said, maybe it's for the best vefore his stories starts getting dull and tedious.

I swear even Snyder said he's moving on from Batman. Why vant Tynion and king do the same smh.

Especially Tynion, the number of Bat issues he's been involved in number in the hundreds now. Its ridiculous how how they keep this guy around.

Look at his body of work:

Co wrote various backups in Snyder's Batman.

Co wrote 2 issues of Batman and wrote one.

Co wrote 52 issues of Eternal

Co wrote 26 issues of BRE

Has been on Tec for 33 issues

Co wrote the first Batman annual and wrote 3 and 4.

Wrote Batman/TMNT 6 issue series

Wrote 2 issues from villains month

Wrote 8 or so issues of Outlaws and an annual.

Co wrote the first 7 issues of Batwoman.

Talon for 16 issues, some with Snyder.

Will write Batman/TMNT 2, Tec Annual, Batman Who Laughs one shot in addition to being regular on Tec.

Will co write Batman Lost and Dark Knights Rising.

Writers would kill for one issue of Batman, this guy just keeps getting issues by the dozen.

@unclepulky: I wasn't aware of that interview...man, that would be just perfect! :))

@entropy_aegis: Do you think Metal will be collected in a TPB with all the tie-ins or will there be another TPB for the tie-ins?

I want to read em in trades so yeah.

Tradewaiting.

No idea tbh

Since Tynion has no interest in Bruce and King is just killing time (seriously minus the marriage there is no hype or teases for storylines) we might as well discuss The Shadow/Batman crossover out next week. There's an advance review I managed to get hold of, now there are no major spoilers but I'm not posting it here regardless. Still there was one thing that caught my eye and should be fun to talk about.

Meanwhile, some of the mob have left New York behind to return to their masters - two of the most notorious villains in comic book history

Who could they be? speculate away.

The original Silent Seven was a throwaway concept with throwaway characters and unless I'm mistaken none of Shadow's rogues could be considered 2 of the most notorious villains in comic book history.

So they have to be Bat villains and Bat villains who know Bruce's secret and Damian so my guesses are:

Dr Hurt

Ra's al Ghul

Bane

relaxing the secret identity stipulation:

Black Mask

Penguin

EDIT: Upon further research I discovered the identity of both the the villains, one is a Shadow villain and the other is a Batman villain and I hate to brag but one those guys I listed is the Batman villain in question. Still 5 more to go, wonder if they'll be no name villains with the first 2 guys being the actual villains or if we're legit getting big villains teaming up. Either way Orlando just beat Tynion to the punch with this story.

@entropy_aegis: It's sad that we have to endure Tom King's writing.

OT : Would you recommend Shadow/Batman?

@jameswayne: I'm more exicted by the new Batman Dark Prince Charming mini series. So far it looks good. Seems that Enrico Marini is far better writer than those slobs at DC :P

Joker and Batman actually looked like themselves in only 20 pages, than in whole 30 issues from the main "comics". Maybe King needs to take some notes?

Not to offend the Bat/Cat shippers but honestly I really hope this stupid "wedding" never happens. Is just so f**** cheesy and we have seen that plot over and over and over and over again in comics. The same stupid story in every "wedding arc". How the forces of the universe will conspire to keep our heroes apart but their "love" will prevail bla, bla, bla, bla. Even though Bat/ Cat is much better than Twilight, or at least its only a hair above that **** because is Batman.

Man, I even prefer Batman/Joker romance. Not really a shipper but, at least that one is actually different!!

@assassinb: I'm hoping that there are no universal forces, but bruce and Selina being too screwed up to actually be married and happy. Even the way he asked " I love you cat, I HAVE to love you"....Geez, desperate aren't we Bruce? I can't believe a healthy person would say yes to that. But Selina is also screwed up. Honestly I'd enjoy the story more if it was just written better. As of now, I'm keeping it until after supes, so until December. If supes can't redeem the comic with a kick ass story, then I'm dropping it. I'll just add more image to my pile.

Also do you notice how subdued the advertisements and panel info is for the batbooks today? Snyder and Morrison would get entire panels about their books at cons while Tynion is always part of some larger group when talking about Tec and King just doesn't talk about his stuff period. It's very weird. We really really need new writers on the bat books

Ha! Well, it seems that only the "favorite" autors that have given DC more market can have their own interviews. Morrison and Snyder have been writting Batman for years now. Tyinon too, but he hasn't left his "mark" yet. Maybe that's why he screw over with Tim Drake.

I have given up the Batman main book a long time ago, I just keep comming to see if its actually going to get better...and it hasn't. I can't stand that dialogue for retards. Is as bad as Geroge Lucas cheesy and cliché Prequels dialogue, but Mr.King earns the retard redundancy prize.

Cat, Bat, Cat, Bat, Cat, Bat, Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat,Cat, Bat...I just can't stand that ***** anymore. I used to like the pet names, but now I absolutely abhor them.

Well on really unexpected news:

I am definetly going to get that book.

@jameswayne: I think King doesn't have hype because in ordee to hype something you need that something in the first place. Batman has been filler since I am Bane with Button being a tease to Doomsday Clock. The BatCat wedding is the only hook for the book going forward and therefore hype will only be generated when the wedding happens. Till then King is killing time. Just read Mr Miracle, that's where King puts actual effort.

On to Wildhunt 4 writers on one book doesn't exactly fill you with confidence. Hmmm lets see.

The Bat Cat thing by itself doesn't bother me. Its the rest of the shit they say that pisses me off.

@black_arrow:

Oh, great. The two writers that adds many over convulted and exaggerated nonsense to Batman bands together.... -__-

Do you guys think Tim Drake Batman will own Bruce and the Robins so that Tynion can make Tim look cool?

place your bets here

Yes. Most likely thatwill happen.

@entropy_aegis: yeah for sure that will happen. Tynion ALWAYS lowers Bruce for his favorites

Yep you guys called it, Future Tim does own Dick, Jason and Damian along with Titus in a fight and then outpreps Bruce by activating Brother Eye. Tynion couldn't help wanking Tim to a ridiculous level.

Tec Spoilers

LOL, it was hardly unexpected. Everyone is incompetent in Tec' except for the characters Tynion wants to highlight on each storyline. But apparently future Tim is Deathstroke now.

However, it is gratifying to see Morrison involved in Metal, even as a subtle nod. The whole concept essentially spins out of his idea, regardless of how Snyder altered it.

@morpheus_: I dont think even Slade without IKON suit could casually just whip Dick,Damian and Jason like that.

Now I'm praying that adult Tim gets owned in the Super Sons of Tomorrow crossover. No Tynion force to save him there.

@entropy_aegis: I fear he's not going to be owned in the Super Sons of Tomorrow crossover until the very end. If anything, Future Tim is probably going to incapacitate Superman since Jon and Damian go on the run for the next two issues of the crossover and we know Future Tim has synthetic Kryptonite bullets -_-

@lvenger:

the rest though, I agree. Tynion should get off 'Tec, the Tim wank needs to end

Which Crossover? I don't recall seeing "Continued" at the end of the issue, Just "Eye Command".

@all-father: it's a crossover between Super Sons/Teen Titans/Superman

@causeimbatman: Involving Tim Drake Batman?

@all-father: I think so

Brother Eye is just becoming the stock "shocking Batman reveal" now, they did the same thing in a recent issue of Injustice.

Yes in December and January

Superman 37-38

Super Sons 11-12

Teen Titans 15 (maybe 16)

I guess they feel like they haven't milked it enough with Futures End and Batman Beyond.

Not even Tomasi could make the Merciless too interesting, even though Manapul was terrific, as usual.

It was much better than all save Murder Machine and I think this Bruce had both a personality and a legit hook plus it was completely different from the formulaic one shots but yeah not much depth overall. It was written with the purpose of getting the job done, you can tell from all the exposition. I dont have any hopes for Devastator at all. The one who laughs seems to be the pet character so lets see.

@entropy_aegis: I just find that most Knights are not so much distorted versions that seem plausible, but rather rely on completely out of character moments of either Bruce or Batman to become functional. You know as well as I do that post-Crisis Batman or even the N52 one wouldn't murder a friend because a silly helmet told them to. It's difficult to portray a gradual descent into darkness in just one issue but I feel they could have accomplished more with practically all of them except, perhaps, Murder Machine.

Still haven't read the Drowned, though.

@causeimbatman: that's the thing. Future Tim okay, it would be annoying but alright. But tynion writes CURRENT Tim as smarter, which is preposterous. Tynion is an absolute hack of a Batman writer. Also having adult Tim take in doomsday was absurd. Cause he's naturally prepped for anything? Superman couldn't even do that.

On topic, he didn't really outprep anyone here, he used future knowledge to get a leg up on a Batman who had no idea adult Tim was even a thing. But NEXT issue, oh boy. Tynion needs to go and needs to go now. I swear he gets by on nostalgia and the book sells causw of classic characters AND batman. So why the hell does he make the biggest cash cow look like a fool?

The only good origin of the Dark Knights was Murder machine, Red Death was mediocre.

Dawnbreaker , The Drowned, Merciless were all awful.

@morpheus_: In the case of the Merciless I found him to be the most pure Batman even after his transformation. He didn't seem to like the Batman who Laughs either. What's different is that he realized that his code is inefficient, the helmet showed him that. Ultimately it all boils down to the fact that these scenarios are a figment of Batman's imagination. The war and code theme worked. With Drowned and Dawnbreaker I'm not even sure what the theme was to even begin with. Imo they just need to make a theme work, my standards for judging these one shots is pretty low since I acknowledge the aburdity of this event as well as the low page space.

Red Death, time and mortality

Murder Machine, fatherhood and humanity

Merciless, War and its codes

The other 2= I have no clue, generic tragedy, darkness, going under or whatever

New ranking

Murder Machine

Merciless

Red Death

Drowned

Dawnbreaker

On a different note Nightwing NWO is basically the story Tynion is writing except infinitely better. I still cant get over how he used the Robins in their first proper Tec showing in the Rebirth era. Really to prove how awesome and worthy Tim is? Lol the character must be seriously broken if they have to resort to this. Either way I dont want to see Tynion writing Dick and Jason ever again period and Bruce and Damian he should write only with each other.

@entropy_aegis: I'd add Merciless to Drowned and Dawnbreaker

@entropy_aegis: I didn't mind the Merciless in terms of personality, he still was stern and determined, albeit in a different way since he was being affected by the helmet. Both Merciless and Murder Machine have a reasonable way out due to the fact that they are being influenced by an outside force, whereas someone like the Dawnbreaker seems to be doing evil nonsense for the sake of it. I just believe the breaking point for each Batman, and Merciless in particular, could had been done better. The twist that Batman himself killed Diana was a poor decision. No problem with any other point you've made since the event itself can be difficult to take too seriously, no matter how well written some of its issues are. Hopefully the core series won't fizzle out. Even in the way that they established the characters, I don't find it plausible that most of them would willingly join and follow the Batman who Laughs, it's a stretch.

I just don't understand why Tynion gets so much leeway even though the book doesn't get anything more than decent to average reviews, but I admittedly haven't looked at its sales in a long while. Far too many writers would be really into having a short run on Batman and Tynion does his best to demean and spit on the character over the course of the past year and through nearly 40 issues.

@morpheus_: I think the twist was written to make it different from the others and counter the notion that this issue was written to pander to Batman/Wonder Woman shippers. Some times outside factors do influence the story. Them following the Batman who Laughs is bothering me as well but as I recall none of these one shots have featured Joker. Murder Machine had Harley but other than that I'm getting the impression that none of these Batmen ever faced the Joker on their worlds. With Drowned and Dawnbreaker I'm almost 100% certain of it. Remarkable how Bane is the most prominent of the Bat villains in these one shots so far because he murdered Alfred in Murder Machine.

I think its telling how Tynion used Bruce and the Robins to make this lameass Batman look cool while sparing the actual cast of this book. The fanboyism is nauseating.

@all-father: Eh his theme was clear unlike those 2.

@entropy_aegis: I'm actually sort of a Batman/WW shipper but not to an excessive degree. At least I used to enjoy the idea, pre-FP, not much interest in it currently. It was explored nicely in Kelly's JLA and Rucka, to whom I defer as an authority on Diana had her crushing on Bruce really hard during Blackest Night.

At the very least they have made a conscious effort not to show or reference the Joker which leads me to believe you are onto something. I'm not really complaining because they'd follow a distorted version of Batman that behaves like the Joker, but mostly because their morals, even after undergoing massive changes don't seem skewed enough (except for Dawnbreaker) that they'd go out of their way to bother with him and his leadership.

I'm also not sure why they went with a Doomsday version of Batman instead for a Superman one. It doesn't fit the entire trope.