Hi People, what are your thoughts on this issue? I for one am really disappointed with Tom King's version of Batman, who completely lacks tactical genius. A high-risk solo assault on Santa Prisca with the danger that Bane could break his back again? That's completely unbecoming of Batman who's a master tactician. It was cool that Batman could brute force his way out of Bane's jail despite being beaten down by an army and his spinal cord being smashed in by Bane. I miss Morrison's Batman sigh

Turn him over and I turn back, refuse to turn him over and I break your damn back. Wow this Batman has the soul of a poet. Unfortunately the repetition made him sound like a robot the actual Batman had sent to troll Bane, except it was the real thing, ugh sounded like a broken record than a determined man. But it was good issue, felt focused and imo the best of this entire run easily. Still has flaws but the lack of useless supporting characters has finally forced King to actually tell the story instead of worrying about how to make Duke relevant without making him instrusive.Its Batman 10 by the way and compared to Snyders Batman labyrinth escape this was genius

Well, that's good! I'm looking forward to it now. Well, I was going to buy it anyways for Bane.

Also, I ordered Nightwing Rebirth #1, and 1-4 and 7 on ebay per your recommendation, and I will be picking up issue 8 today!

Ignoring the constant repetition from Batman, this issue was good because It finally focused on just Batman. No useless sidekicks or anything else, except a brief story of Catwoman told only through text. I really liked how Batman unbroke his back.

I have to say I was really dreading the way King will tackle the Batman/Catwoman relationship, and the whole thing about her slaughtering 200+ people, but I'll admit he completely surprised me. Not only King didn't chicken out from actually going through with having Catwoman murdering all these people, but the letter that Selina sent to Bruce (since when does she know Bruce was Batman ?) perfectly described their relationship and where the two stands in it. In a time where many tend to misinterpret their relationship or misrepresent it to the determent of Batman's characterization, I was pleasantly surprised that King absolutely gets it.

I was still annoyed with the whole story about Selina knowing Bruce since he was a little boy because of the picture of the Waynes that was in the orphanage she grew up in, as that makes Selina yet another character with too deep of a connection to Bruce's personal life, but it's par for the course at this point. Won't be surprised if Bane turned out to be Bruce's long lost half brother by the end of this.

Batman's escape from the pit was cool. His constant droning of the "I'll break your damn back" line started cool at first but became annoying and goofy by the end. Still not much happened in the issue all things considered, but I'm glad to see that King at least has a decent grasp of the Batman characters, at least more than what I've initially assumed.

I think Tom King was trying to express how afraid Batman is of Bane subconsciously due to Knightfall and he is trying to overcome his fear by convincing himself that he is brave and will overcome and defeat Bane, just like how Gotham always going on about overcoming fear

I'm glad they addressed Catwoman's kill count right away. I enjoyed the issue, but I kept waiting for the next page to reveal it wasn't Bruce under the mask. I expected Ventriloquist honestly. The way in issue 9 he said something like "whatever you say", I figured he was told to go in as Batman, and then Bruce and team would be coming in another way.

Still enjoyed it and cant wait to find out where Bronze Tiger, Punch, and Jewlee are and what they are doing.

Really disappointed by this issue but I guess it was better than Part 1. The way Batman repeated the same thing over and over again throughout the whole issue made him sound like an idiot and his tactic wasn't as smart as King thought it will turn out to be.

I've got to be honest with you guys, I am getting tired of the same old stuff King writes. I mean, his Batman comes out as an one-dimensional idiot who lacks everything Batman actually has as attributes and the action sequences King writes are just terrible. I don't know why he rushes everything, it seems like he thinks it makes the story look more serious and realistic when in reality it's nothing like that. King really, really needs to pick things up.

Well DC continues to ruin Catwoman for me and here I was hoping that she was framed. I seriously don't know what I was expecting.

Thought the issue was pretty crappy tbh. I thought well that couldn't be Batman because he's not so stupid that he would try and take on 100 guys at once head on without using any tactics or stealth. But its okay guys because it was part of the plan -_-

I enjoyed this issue. though i felt batman's dialogue was wooden and dull. It was cool the first time but after he kept repeating he was like a caveman to me lol. I get the purpose of it since i believe King was trying to elicit how fiercely determined and obsessed he was to accomplish his goals while portraying his frustration and grief as he contemplates of the letter given to him by Selina. I felt this issue would have been handle better if Batman was completely silent illustrating the grief and pain in his face as silently reflects on that morbid letter as he performs this mission.

I would love to hear your thoughts. Is it just me or could the person that he constantly states he needs to save not only Gotham Girl but Catwoman as well? If you reread the last issue coupled with this one it seems he's trying to in a sense "save" Catwoman as well. There were a couple of big hints implying it imo

I am on the fence of Selina basically being mass murderer despite the justification as i feel it goes against the grain of her character. Time will tell if the execution will be good; here's to hoping.

What i did like though was that Tom King had a strong understanding of the the complicated and tragic relationship between Bruce and Selina.

I just can't forgive King for ruining Catwoman's character like that, no matter the justification. Just because 237 people were ''terrorists'' doesn't make is any less of a MASS MURDER. Not to mention how she acts towards the killings, as if she is relishing it which she NEVER DID in her history. I mean even against Black Mask who wanted to destroy everything and everyone she cared about, when she killed him, she was feeling freaking guilt over it. And now we are, not to mention BATMAN himself who is all about not killing , expected to go and say '' oh yea, you mass murdered 237 people but they were terrorists so I guess it is fine ''. Not to mention this whole deal with make it impossible for me to take her ''care-free'' attitude seriously other than her being turned into more like a female-Joker because Selina I know would be far more serious about such things and couldn't go on the same way as we see here. She shouldn't be another mentally-damaged murderer. Batman has enough psycos as it is. What made Catwoman iconic was that she had that redemptive part and that what made her / her relationship interesting with Batman. But after knowing this ? I cannot honestly believe Bruce truly loving a mass murderer...no matter what, and IT PAINS ME to think that because Selina and Bruce is one of my top relationships other than Peter and Mary Jane and now both are in the ruin.

Even more insult to injury, Harley Quinn is now supposedly a ''hero'' while Selina is a Mass Murderer.... Rebirth was going soo well until this crap happened that , honestly, make me wanna not read this crap anymore because I can't stand the idea of a Mass Murderer Catwoman, acting like normal and Batman ignoring that fact like normal too. Why did they had to ruin her so...Why....

Honestly the most annoying thing I find in CV is nobody is willing to accept a characters story if there's even the slightest variation from their basic background. Who cares if Catwoman has 237 kills? It's finally a different take on a long running character. It's like when people rag on Gotham for not sticking to traditional character backgrounds-it's a different take on traditional story line/characters. Just appreciate the fact that somebody is willing to step outside the box and give you a different take on something. If you want to read about the same characters without change, go back and read what's already been written. End rant.

With the exception of the repetitive phrases, the issue was okay at best. Disappointing to say the least .

His interaction with bane and escape from the cell was interesting. Selina's journal writing was the most engaging .However the repetition through me off and was unnecessary. That was an ample opportunity to provide Bruce with interesting monologue to further develop the character, rather than repeating himself. I'm surprised that King decided to continue to repeat that "break your damn back" dialogue, considering his high caliber work with vision, omega men ,sheriff , and Grayson.

8 years of comic book reading and I never cared for Selina's origin. Don't care whether she's a mass murder or not , just give me a great dynamic story between Bruce and Selina . Let's see if king can deliver

First time posting here and still new to comics, but what the hell was King thinking? I don't even know if I want to continue reading.

"I'll break his/your damn back"--It sounds so stupid and cheesy. It was weird at first and laughable by the end. Also, what's the point of making Catwoman a murderer? Honestly, is King doing this just for shock value or trying to put a new "edgy" layer onto their relationship? I don't think Batman could ever forgive/understand her now. Does Tom King hope for readers to understand/empathize with Selina because some terrorist bombed an orphanage? "Let's reintroduce Catwoman for Rebirth; however, let's portray her as a mass murderer and villain even though her pre-Flashpoint characterization and backstory was perfectly fine."

''but it is terrorists, Man ! '' Everyone hates terrorists so that makes it okay , right ? RIGHT ? Why are you looking at me like a bloodthirsty - crazy person ? LETS PUT A SMILE ON THAT FACE ! .... is what I think of King right now. I mean with Joker sidelined, I guess they want take that road with Catwoman ? They had to have a mass murderer, heavily involved with Batman to show how ''edgy'' it is. History and Iconic character be damned !

You know what is the worst part ? She doesn't feel the guilt or effects of those murders. She is still as non-chalant about it as her robberies. And by the end, she turns into a pessimist by saying '' Oh Bruce, you fight for a better world but there is no such thing...and when you come to think of like me, we can be together that way '' which is BULLSHIT. No matter what, Selina was always upbeat with her struggles. That is what keeps her going, not this emo '' everything is bad and can't be better '' crap. How the hell Batman is the more optimistic guy in this relationship ?! HOW ?!

It should be the opposite that Catwoman coming to the light to make the relationship work, rather than Batman diving into darkness....THAT IS TALIA'S BACKGROUND, NOT SELINA ! How can they do this to Bruce's True love. and knowing this info, how can Selina be Bruce's true love now, where she IS a mass murderer, no matter what the circumstance might be.

I cannot believe the Mob-boss Selina I hated looks and sounds more reasonable than this Selina we get.

@wowlock: I don't have much knowledge about her (just the basics: Ra's, Damian, "beloved" etc.) but, how is--throwing personality aside, now that she's killed 237 people--Catwoman going to be any different than Talia? I thought she was supposed to be a vigilante/antihero thief who rarely if ever killed (except Black Mask).Why is Batman (even if it's not him; I don't even know now with the repeated lines) storming in the middle of gunfire during the day?

I never liked Batman and Catwoman, always preferred Zatanna. The villian and hero cliche will never end well

There were things I liked in the issue and things I hated in the issue. The first time Batman said he'd break Bane's back I thought it was hilarious, then he proceeded to repeat it again and again, to the point that it became dumb. Literally, spreading that statement's repetition out over the entire storyline would have been far more effective than cramming it all into one issue. Not really sure what Batman's reasoning was for that.

Still not a fan of Catwoman being a mass murderer. I mean, at least it wasn't a bunch of innocents of course, but I still can't vibe with that. Not much more I can say. However, ther were parts of her letter to Bats that I loved, specifically the last half of it or so, after she got past how she used to stare up at the Wayne Family portrait in her old orphanage. That's not as bad as the murder thing, but i'm not big on various characters that Batman meets in his life having connections to him like that dating back before he ever became Batman. A few is fine, but it almost always seems forced, especially when the New 52 already through Poison Ivy and Mr. Freeze into the mix, along with adding some new elements to Batman and Two-Face's relationship before the two ever became who they are now.

That scene where Batman fixed his back was ridiculous.

Meh, judging by the reviews and the comments, guess i did good in not picking it up again.

"This just in iconic Selina Kyle after 76 years finally meets her demise at the hands of Tom King" -everyone that loves her

@bat_girl_cc: At least you still have detective comics.

So there's chatter that Snyder may have compelled King to make this change to Catwoman lol. As much as I'd love to believe it I'm sticking with this being on King. But I will say that he did pull a Snyder, he clearly wanted to rock the boat but didn't have the guts to go through with it. The end result is that Catwoman fans are pissed anyway, kind of a fail imo. Want to make Selina a murderer fine, but dont pretend as if there is thing called "benevolent" serial killer, nor are there benevolent gangsters. Morrison did it right with Talia, sure he got flak(so is King so what difference does it make?) for it but he stuck to his vision, he really went deep in to making Talia a psycho. Now I feel King will spend the rest of his run in damage control mode, think before leaping and if you wanna leap then really leap. Catwoman is a huge misfire so far. The letter was ok but it's just an excuse not an explanation, an explanation would involve the effect of this decision and the purpose behind it and how it will affect her moving forward.

Cool, I hope you enjoy them.

Last issue was a bit disappointing. I think that Tynion's 'Tec might be going downhill with the Victim Syndicate story onwards.

@tdk_1997: Maybe.

Damn, King's twitter has a bunch of unsavory comments, the Catwoman thing is getting out of control. Damian and Selina that's 2 major fanbases King has pissed off, dude needs to decide if sucking up to Snyder has really been worth it. Batman is easily King's worst reviewed work and the fan chatter has been resoundingly meh. Infact I'd even wager that the reviews would have been harsher if some other writer was writing these exact same stories, with King many people are convinced that there's something brilliant planned but with each issue that hope dies a little. I cant see DC continuing with this, he'll be out with in a year if the response persists, he's just coming across as this era's Tony Daniel.

King needs to grow some balls and stop this pal show with Snyder, frick Duke,frick Snyder style of writing, people who want to read those can always turn to ASB.

I liked Batman #10 but I just noticed that King's Batman has no real hook or direction, it doesn't even have a tone.

Not sure what people are angry about exactly, this is not the first time Selina's killed someone. Didn't she kill Black Mask pre-Nu52 in revenge too ? I also remember her almost killing a gangster who killed her friend during the first couple of issues in her Nu52 series, before Batman stopped her. The point is this is nothing new with her, she's always been willing to kill in revenge so not sure what people are getting pissy about. Killing a single person or killing 200 people are essentially the same thing, as that presents the same dilemma with her relationship with Batman.

I'm starting to get convinced that I've been reading a completely different Catwoman all these years, someone who's a cool character when's she's around, but is ultimately not all that important to Batman's world as she's been absent for the last couple of years with Batman being pretty much unaffected by her absence. I'm baffled with how many people try and make her out to be as important as say the Batfamily members, when she's not and she'll never be. I might be in the minority here, but I've never considered Catwoman as a vital character to Batman's stories, or the end all be all love interest, considering that her actual history as a stable love interest is pretty recent all things considered.

Batman and Catwoman have always been fundamentally different characters, and their relationship will always reach a point where it hits a wall that it cannot go past without some dumb writing. Selina will never stop being Catwoman as that wouldn't be in character for her, and would make zero sense from a writing standpoint as by doing do you just lose a character and gain nothing but another civilian love interest. As long as Batman and Catwoman remain who they're, there's noway for the two to work out, that's of course unless you have Batman bending over backward for her for some reason, and acting out of character just so the two can remain together.

I applaud King for the way handled Selina's letter to Bruce. It explained EXACTLY why the relationship between the two happens, and why it ultimately can't work out, not unless one of the two budged and completely changed who they're. I don't see the problem with a relationship that doesn't ultimately work out, I mean that's how it works in this case. Are the angry people just shippers who're waiting for Bruce and Selina to have a bunch of kids and live happily ever after, and got angry because their imaginary romance got derailed ? Because that's the only way I can see people raging over this. If you had any knowledge of the character you know that King didn't do anything new, he just went a little bit overboard with it, but the issue of Selina killing has been done before, so there's nothing new here.

Hahaha even Lobdell is nailing it right now.

Rhato > Batman

@enzo991: Great post, I agree with everything you said. I am not a fan of Catwoman but through the years she had plenty solo titles that had nothing to do with Batman, so I can see why some of her fans would be upset about it, because she has never been potrayed as a mass murderer. From what I know every time she killed, It always was a big deal for her and she felt badly about it, so her killing 237 and not feeling any guilt would be out of character despite not changing her relation ship with Batman. So I do understand why some people are mad.

@enzo991: Unfortunately it's the backtracking with "benevolent" serial killer that's the issue from my end. Catwoman fans were going to be pissed at this no matter what, they dont want their character to be a killer. These days even Ivy fans have gotten all uppity, for instance Manapul was attacked on Twitter by Ivy fans for making Ivy evil lol. What's her act of villainy so far? she gave Jon Kent some seeds, that's gotten their panties in a bunch. I hate whitewashing of villains to satisfy the homoerotic fantasies of a group of fans and it's why I love Deathstroke for how accurate it is but I think King took a swing and missed. Making Selina a serial killer was always gonna piss off her fans, so he should have just gone ahead and made her villainous, at least we might have gotten a decent story out of it. Now, nothing's changed except that she has serial killer baggage, which still doesn't stop Batman from working with her, nor has it changed their interactions, seriously what's the point? if King was going to use Selina like she's been for a long time then he should not have bothered with the serial killer angle, it's so pointless that it just comes across as a cheap ploy for attention.

@entropy_aegis said:

Poison Ivy being evil? Say it ain't so, that's totally OOC! It's not like she's a supervillainess or anything!

...Jesus, fandom is cancer.

Yeah, its easly the best bat-book out there right now, did you dropped it? you know can always pick it back up starting from the last issue which its the beggining of a new arc.

I enjoyed it, specially Cass and Clayface moments, the victim syndicate look cool and they seem very dangerous, hope they deliver.

The only part i didn't enjoy was Luke, like others i also thought that it was a disservice to the character, but then Tynion explained on Twitter that Kate just doesn't know Luke yet, pretty much confirming that he will surprise her and prove her his worth down the road, Tynion will do him justice, you can bank on that.

Sadly, this is true...right now, from all of the bat-books, King is the only writter who doesn't seem to know what he's doing and who he's writting.

And when even Lobdell surpasses you (writting-wise), you know you've reached a new low.

@bat_girl_cc: To be RHatO is really good. The only downside is first arc could be Red Hood Mini-series since the team will be formed after end of the arc and Artemis and Bizarro dont appear in first issue but appearing later. I admit that i avoid reading Batman focus titles at it possibel but i feel that how he is writing Batman, he would make a good writer for Suicide Squad and mainly Waller, Flag and Deadshot and maybe Katana or even better Deathstroke. He could probably write good BOP arc, but DC probably wants that a female writer or writers on that title.

@bat_girl_cc: I am picking it up and i never dropped. Due to everybody wanting Batman and Superman Rebirth comics, i didnt get the first issue when it came out but i receive it in last month. I was affraid that Batman would be main focus which would mean i would have to pay for comics that i wouldnt enjoy it. But i was wrong and like to see other characters have spotlight. I knew that something bad would be happening to Red Robin but i am glad that it was just a fake death. Maybe after the major event, he can appear in Dectective Comics or found the Young Justice.

They definitely aren't or you'd be tried with the same level of severity for both cases lol there's also the entire context of the situation to take into account. As people say, context is key. Selina killing Black Mask was akin to Dick Grayson letting Tarantula kill Blockbuster or Damian Wayne killing Nobody; a terrible action, occuring when that character was at his/her absolute lowest point and felt as if there was no other choice. In then wasn't treated as being the right thing to do, something that the character could easily live with, or something that even Batman in turn just shrugged off and said "Well, it be like that sometimes". There was actual purpose behind, build-up to, and fallout from that event, that led to important growth for each character at the time in their lives. So, when Selina killed Black Mask you didn't have her suddenly being mass murderer who had plotted this event out for a long time beforehand. She didn't go into the situation wanting to kill Black Mask. She reached a point, after a long series of events, where she felt that killing Mask was the only option she had left to bring an end to things. And afterwards, she didn't feel great about it, even going to Batman some time later to formally confess what she'd done.

First and foremost, just methodically planning to kill 200 people makes this new situation entirely different. It takes away any argument of distress, necessity, or even self-defense. She targetted these people and hunted them down one after the other, going out of her way to do so. Like, i'm not sure how you could even equate one event to the other. Thinking that people are specifically angry at her killing people and nothing more simplifies what actually happened, in either case, for no real reason than to not understand the actual reason people are upset. That fallout from both events then have the potential to be very different and who knows how this will play out once the arc is over. However, in terms of Batman as a character, even his fans have to take note of this. Because of his no kill policy. So, when he begins associating with people who have killed it is important, as what exactly separates them from people like Two-Face or really any random thug who guns down some innocents on the street is important to his character.

Cass/Clayface was the only good thing about the issue and the only thing that is kind of promissing so far about this arc.

I didn't have a problem with Luke as most people were saying they did. I thought he was okay but it's not getting me excited or anything. I think that Tynion is going to have problems with all future story arcs just because he is already kind of forced to force more of Kate on us because of her upcoming ongoing solo title. It's not a particularly bad thing but it can become overwhelming since I want to see more of Bruce as well. Although I love that he's chosen to turn 'Tec into a Bat-family book in a Claremont X-Men style.