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    Avengers

    Team » Avengers appears in 7704 issues.

    The Avengers are Earth's mightiest heroes and foremost super-team... "There came a day, a day unlike any other, when Earth's mightiest heroes found themselves united against a common threat. On that day, the Avengers were born - to fight the foes no single super hero could withstand! Heed the call, then - for now, the Avengers Assemble!"

    Where is the line drawn?

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    CaptainRex

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    For many years media has followed a basic set of tropes that people have accepting and yet torn about for years. In every group, there is usually a token Black guy and a token Woman.

    Most people have voiced concern about that representation for a long time. But now with this current line up of Avengers it seems the rolls have been reversed partially. Now Tony is the token White guy in an ethnic group and Jane and Kamala hold the role of token women. I have seen people go crazy for this and in full support. And thats cool, Im all for diversity. But where is the line drawn?

    An all White guy group with one Black guy, is apparently not ok.

    An all ethnic group with only one White guy, is apparently ok.

    A Captain America that black is ok. Fine I'm cool with that.

    Female Wolverine. Odd choice, but I'll see where it goes.

    But what if they suddenly made a White Black Panther or a Male Black Widow? If that did happen will people be accepting or will they be out raged?

    Where is the line drawn?

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    Hypester

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    #2  Edited By Hypester

    Water flows downhill. If you pick up a bucket to carry water downhill, you're a fool. If you pick it up to carry it uphill, that's okay.

    If there is an oppressed or under-represented group, it is always "okay" for them to take from the oppressors or over-represented group. This is why it is okay for black comedians to joke about white culture, but it is not okay for white comedians to joke about black culture in the same way. This is why it's "okay" for women to hit men, but not the other way around. This is why movies where the underdog wins are more satisfying than movies where the clearly more powerful or advantaged person wins.

    It will always be okay to turn white characters to other ethnicities. Always okay to turn male characters other genders, and on and on very every over-represented over-praised attribute in western society UNTIL (here's that line you're looking for) until said ethnicities/genders/sexualities are no longer perceived as underdogs. Then their 'victory' will no longer be compelling. Diversity draws the line when people start saying 'no white guys' the way they've said no to other racial/gender profiles in the past. Once you start treating white men like minority men or women were treated in comics history (silenced, pigeonholed, undeveloped, grossly mishandled, etc) you are no longer being diverse. Until that point comes where white male characters are all the same, where all the best storylines center on characters who are not white males, where the audience does not live in a world which constantly reminds them of the superiority of white males, it will never be okay to turn a character who is not white white, or not male male. It will have the same effect as having a movie about a super powerful guy and a villain who can't even affect him. "Of course they'd turn her into a guy/of course they'd turn him white, it's always all about white males." No one will be outraged, they're already numb to endless sexually and racially motivated tragedies and traumas. "Losing" a comic icon will just add to that numbness for most. A few will rage if it's their last straw, but it won't mean much or last long. For them, comics will just be another place where the magic is lost and be less intrigued. It's simply not interesting, outside of a sort of "you took our characters, so now we take yours, how do you feel?" that people can feel if they feel that white male characters belong to them and are being taken away unjustly. And those people won't buy a White Black Panther book.

    Still, remember Avengers made history in film with no black people. You can't get more 'okay' than that. It's still perfectly acceptable and profitable to center on white males as has been done throughout western society. But people who want a wider audience go for the underdogs, and are rewarded for doing so, because now the audience is diverse. But the 60's-style comics audience is still there, if you want it. They just aren't a good long term investment.

    Also, btw, once you have two of something, they're no longer token, by definition. Also, if they're there for a reason other than their race (like Tony) then they're no longer token.

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    Pokeysteve

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    Black Widow works as a woman because female black Widows are incredibly dominant. A male Black Widow wouldn't make any sense since the males are pathetic and small.

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    CaptainRex

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    Black Widow works as a woman because female black Widows are incredibly dominant. A male Black Widow wouldn't make any sense since the males are pathetic and small.

    Think we just got our 'Underdog' story.

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    Pokeysteve

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    CaptainRex

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    #6  Edited By CaptainRex

    @captainrex:

    *cues Rocky theme"

    See, this is something that wouldn't make sense and yet people could be just as accepting of it.

    This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for:

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