Why Emma Frost Is Better Off Without Scott Summers

Disagree. I think you're allowing the presence of drama to signify that she shouldn't be with him, but every relationship has drama.

totally agree, and Emma is better off on her own, this drama with Scott is past old.

With good writing she'd easily be a major character in her own right but what they've used her for has become stale. That 'fresh' start is what gets her back on a path to being more than just a sexy panel.

She was practically second in command to Sebastian Shaw in the Hellfire Club and now she's lucky if she gets one line in an issue of Uncanny X-Men.

Are you serious? She gets plenty of page time and lines in almost every issue. You must be skipping pages if you honestly believe that.

She's always be second best to Jean in Scott's heart. With that being said, I would like Emma and Cykes to stay together.

I knew it wouldn't be Aunt May or Agatha Harkness! They're not naked enough to be recognized! On some levels, I agree that Emma would be better off without Cyclops. She does seem to be nothing more than a trophy girlfriend with snappy comebacks rather than a strong woman of her own.

But isn't every woman that Scott has been with eventually take a back seat to him? Jean, Madelyne to an extent, and Emma have all been at his side since he's pretty much a leader among leaders. Emma, I would say is a dominant type of person, where she just forces you to do something instead of the person having confidence in what she says.

Frankly, I can't imagine why a woman like Emma Frost would want to stick around a guy like Scott Summers.

Love?

I think Emma as a villian and Emma as a hero are two completely different people. They kinda have to be if her transition is to be serious. Magneto switches but stays the same only makes us think he is going to switch again. Emma is still a strong woman in my opinion. She still argues, she is still witty, still insulting, but I think the real problem is that it has been a while since a decent writer has been able to develop her.

Poor writing is her problem. I thought she was great thru Whedon's run in Astonishing, potrayed her well, it's the writers that have taken her since, have no idea how to write a powerful, posh, confident, b!tchy woman. Makes me cringe the way she is portrayed as of late, some dumb-blonde that lacks any of the "White Queen" in her

She's better for Scott than Jean ever was. That being said, Emma would be better off without Scott than Scott would be without her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she'd be better off alone than she is with him. They bring out the best in each other and they support each other.

@Dark_Phoenix00x said:

Poor writing is her problem. I thought she was great thru Whedon's run in Astonishing, potrayed her well, it's the writers that have taken her since, have no idea how to write a powerful, posh, confident, b!tchy woman. Makes me cringe the way she is portrayed as of late, some dumb-blonde that lacks any of the "White Queen" in her

This is all Fraction. Gillen (who is now writing Uncanny) does a pretty decent job with her, although he doesn't (nor will anybody ever, really) get her like Morrison and especially Whedon.

When a good writer like Grant Morrison manages to pull off a compelling story and character interaction between characters and this resonates with a lot of fans (and also sparks controversy - which creates a lot of talk) its no surprise that some editors behind the scene will try to deconstruct what they considered what worked and was successful and then try to bottle that and force onto other writers to use. Apparently what they interpreted from Morrisons run was fans loved Cyclops the Alpha dog who is put into morally ambiguous situations but is always right because being right is always more interesting then carefully constructed tension and character balance, and that fans love when Emma says Darling and wears lingerie and cheer leads. Some writers since Morrison have wrote a decent Emma (and Scott), but a lot of them just lacked severely and a lot of them who lacked, were the ones who steered the direction of the characters (and the franchise) 

Scott Summers must die.

I agree she has been underutilized as a character lately, but I don't think working to preserve a relationship is a sign of weakness. Sticking with someone you care about is important. And long-lasting relationships take work. The best relationships even allow for each partner to pursue their interests, strengths, and develop their roles.

With the deterioration, elimination, destruction, re-writing, and otherwise meddling of stable relationships in ongoing comic series lately, I am glad this one has endured as long as it has.

Emma needs a comeback, but I don't think she is living entirely in Scott's shadow. Personally, I think Scott's characterization has been eroded over the last 10 years as well. I hope to see Scott and Emma's relationship renewed . . . at least until Jean comes back. Which, I kinda hope doesn't happen. Because that would create predictable, shallow relationship drama.

Emma has been with Stark (that's a relationship I'd like to see explored in flash backs or something) and Namor (again, more exploration), Scott doesn't challenge Emma, there's no witty exchange, no mind games, it's so boring. Imagine Emma with Namor! Too large egos, fighting for dominance; it would be passionate, unstable, volatile. Or Tony Stark. Witty, mind games, playing against one another...to make a 90s cartoon reference, Fox and Xanatos from "Gargoyles." Couldn't you just see it? Scott just isn't right for Emma, I've always felt that way from the beginning.

Even if I consider Scott being a douche at times, I don't think being in a relationship with him hurt Emma's character. She's still queen b***h, and that's why I like her.

Whedon's take on Emma was pitch perfect. She can be a very strong character and a very strong female character in a relationship if written correctly. And I know that everyone hates Scott Summers since he's gone COMMANDO as of late but I've loved his mentality from the get go when he finally sacked up and took the bull by the horns after years of passing the buck. That said Emma is a great foil to his testosterone leadership and should remain with Scott. I feel she'd do just fine on her own but I love the interplay between the two

It's hard for me to read Emma without cringing these days. She's mostly written as a bad Joanna Lumley character, it's painful. What is worse is she is crammed into every comic while essential X-women such as Storm have become wallpaper.

Haha! Babs, you just want to vicariously live out your Namor fantasy through Emma! Lol. On the real though, you make some strong criticisms regarding the deterioration of Emma's character. I blame the writers and, to some extent, the male patriarchy inherent in society. It can all be set right if writers be more mindful of who she could/should be in future issues. Also Scott has become hardened, cold, & ruthless since becoming chief, so he'd be a great complement for the "old" Emma, and the two strong, uncompromising personalities would be a good source of tension/conflict and passion for each other, while STAYING TOGETHER in the future. Finally, KEEP JEAN DEAD! People die, break up, move on. That's life. Embrace change.

I never realized it but you have a point. The new Emma Frost with Scott seems to have lost that air of authority she had. Her very presence kept nearly every X-Man around her on their toes, thats the Emma we need back. The old Emma would've bitch slapped the hell out of Hope Summers for talking to her like that. Come back White Queen, we miss you!

Or bring back Jean, but kill Scott.

Oh come on, Babs. Stop hatin on Scott.I agree that the relationship has hinder her, but this seems to be a problem with comic book writers, not Scott. The same thing has happened to Jean, Gwen Stacy, Mary Jane, Lois Lane, Maddie, and others. A lot of writers just don't seem to know how to write women.

@MorlockMartyr said:

Haha! Babs, you just want to vicariously live out your Namor fantasy through Emma! Lol.

I'm just glad someone else thought it was funny ;)

She should dump him. Emma is way better on her own and not being a back burner to Scott she is just a sub for Jean to Scott anyway. It's high time she gets back to being just Emma Frost not Scott and Emma.

Like everyone else has said it's basically due to the writers and editorial staff. Her and Scott aren't bad together, it's just the writing, which has taken a pretty big spiral. 

your totally right Babs. If Namor and Emma got together and left the X-Men than.......i could actually read X-Men again.

DO NOT LIKE!!

Blame should only fall on the crappy writers.

I do see the points you are trying to make, Sara; and I do agree with some of them. For the most part I disagree with the sentiment. I like Scott and Emma together. I'm quite the open Emma fan. Her poor casting in X-Men: First Class is why I wont even see that movie. The relationship is a good excuse to finally move away from the Scott and Jean soap opera. That was just plain annoying. It's time for when Jean to come back that they toss aside that story and explore a different path.

When Scott got dark, Jean pushed him away and wouldn't help him. She's like one of those high school girl's who marries her school sweetheart, but refuses to accept any change. She wanted Scott to stay just they way she wanted and wouldn't accept anything else. As if Jean has any bloody right to push away someone dealing with darkness. She's often gone full evil and tried to destroy the universe.

I am vehemently against the idea of Emma with Namor. The only reason he's interested in her is because she's a blond. Even Fraction admitted that he made that past relationship as Namor just wants to sleep with her. He just wants her body to prove he can. That's just not my opinion. Those were pretty much Fraction's own words. Namor just treats her as a place to put his fish stick.

It's not the relationship's fault. It's the fact that writers can't put it to work. For some reason, comic writers really can't seem to write people in relationships. One of the problems with comics is that they always talk about 'changing' things, but just wind up right back where they started. That's not change.

Babs is 100% correct.

Emma Frost has spent a good portion of her duration with the X-men apologizing for everything that she is or ever was (evil, icy, not Jean). She's reached a complete impasse where she's really just designated as the bitchy trophy wife who picks people's brains and turns into solid diamond every now and then. Constantly replaying the cycle of neuroses she has about living up to Scott's expectations just makes her seem pathetic.

Magneto, Namor, and Wolverine don't need a living salvation to wrap their legs around in repentance so then why should Emma? I say that Emma and Magneto should create a the third break in the mutant population where all the cool juvenile kids go...they're a bit too good for Scott's generic-B-movie-action-flick style tactics.

And...actually, I think Jean should get with Namor.

@The Dark Huntress said:

She's better for Scott than Jean ever was. That being said, Emma would be better off without Scott than Scott would be without her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she'd be better off alone than she is with him. They bring out the best in each other and they support each other.

@Dark_Phoenix00x said:

Poor writing is her problem. I thought she was great thru Whedon's run in Astonishing, potrayed her well, it's the writers that have taken her since, have no idea how to write a powerful, posh, confident, b!tchy woman. Makes me cringe the way she is portrayed as of late, some dumb-blonde that lacks any of the "White Queen" in her

This is all Fraction. Gillen (who is now writing Uncanny) does a pretty decent job with her, although he doesn't (nor will anybody ever, really) get her like Morrison and especially Whedon.

What Huntress said. Quite frankly I don't see them splitting still, Marvel likes "swerves" and false promotions like all the Emma and Namor moments in the past that never fell through and was just to do it for dramatic effect.The recent Scott and Storm for Astonishing ad with them kissing for example just seems like another one of Marvel's teaser ploys to try and get some reaction to get people to buy the books even though it's doubtful Scott would cheat on Emma and Storm would cheat on T'Challa considering how popular those couples are and especially with Marvel's biggest franchise, those couples rake in huge profits. Emma's done more for Scott than Jean ever did, and bringing her back with him or something like that would just get rid of the character growth, Jean had a long time with Scott and since she's been irrelevant for years, put her with Wolverine or something, there has always been chemistry between those two, Emma and Scott when written well balance each other out as DH pointed, there has been a lack of writing and with Gillen writing and Scott still alive after Schism and both Emma and Scott still in Uncanny things could very well get better. Still, Scott would do more if written well than Namor would ever for Emma and she would do more for Scott than she would for Namor.

I would rather see Scott alone for a time. I think he needs to grow, as a character has become rather stagnant. He's the guy at always needs to be with someone and I think it's time for him to stand on his own two feet and become more of a man.

Babs is 100% correct.

Emma Frost has spent a good portion of her duration with the X-men apologizing for everything that she is or ever was (evil, icy, not Jean). She's reached a complete impasse where she's really just designated as the bitchy trophy wife who picks people's brains and turns into solid diamond every now and then. Constantly replaying the cycle of neuroses she has about living up to Scott's expectations just makes her seem pathetic.

Magneto, Namor, and Wolverine don't need a living salvation to wrap their legs around in repentance so then why should Emma? I say that Emma and Magneto should create a the third break in the mutant population where all the cool juvenile kids go...they're a bit too good for Scott's generic-B-movie-action-flick style tactics.

And...actually, I think Jean should get with Namor.

I'm an unrepentant Emma Frost fan. I liked her with the Hellfire Club and love her with the X-Men. While I agree that she often is taking a backseat to whatever Scott's got going on (and often taking her cues from him), I lay that at the feet of writers. I often feel some writers don't know how to incorporate her into the story lines well or may simply not have a firm grasp on her character. Perhaps they just see her as Scott's girlfriend and not much more. At any rate, I would L-O-V-E to see her at the fore-front yet again (without role being solely relegated to more Jean Grey jealousy). I would point anyone who wants to experience the complexity of Emma Frost check out the first story arc penned byJoss Whedon in Astonishing X-Men (2004).

I'm an unrepentant Emma Frost fan. I liked her with the Hellfire Club and love her with the X-Men. While I agree that she often is taking a backseat to whatever Scott's got going on (and often taking her cues from him), I lay that at the feet of writers. I often feel some writers don't know how to incorporate her into the story lines well or may simply not have a firm grasp on her character. Perhaps they just see her as Scott's girlfriend and not much more. At any rate, I would L-O-V-E to see her at the fore-front yet again (without role being solely relegated to more Jean Grey jealousy). I would point anyone who wants to experience the complexity of Emma Frost check out the first story arc penned byJoss Whedon in Astonishing X-Men (2004).

Sadly, such is the fate of almost all strong, female leads who become the woman of a lead male hero. I miss the early days of their relationship. I loved the dynamic they had then. I miss Emma being more of an actual leader. Early on they were CO-Workers and both had true authority over and within the X-Men. Then somewhere along in the Brubaker/Fraction years Emma became Scott's do girl and psychic cut buddy. And sadly, it doesn't seem like Gillen plans to fix this (or a few other recent problems I've noticed with X-Men) at all in his run.

@Teerack said:

She was practically second in command to Sebastian Shaw in the Hellfire Club and now she's lucky if she gets one line in an issue of Uncanny X-Men.

Are you serious? She gets plenty of page time and lines in almost every issue. You must be skipping pages if you honestly believe that.

O_O she rarely says anything that some background character couldn't just say. She has occasional one-liners or some snarky comment but she hasn't developed to anything more than scott's girlfriend who has a jean complex

@fodigg said:

Disagree. I think you're allowing the presence of drama to signify that she shouldn't be with him, but every relationship has drama.

The problem is she is losing herself in the relationship(they have some nice moments together). I'm not saying she needs to leave scott, she can stay but she needs to lead a team by herself so she gets some independence again.(even though scott still being hung up on jean is demeaning to emma, it makes her whiny) With what 8 titles she can't have one team to lead without scott. She needs to act more like she's the Queen of Utopia which is basically what she is, she is second in command but doesn't really do much with that power.

Joss Whedon would be nice to have write her because he basically used her personality for the character of Adelle Dewitt on Dollhouse, which is how emma should be written

I'm still waiting for Emma to fully betray the X-Men. C'mon, ya'll know it's gonna happen...it's just a slow burn, know what I'm sayin'?

@Wattup said:

I'm still waiting for Emma to fully betray the X-Men. C'mon, ya'll know it's gonna happen...it's just a slow burn, know what I'm sayin'?

She's been an X-Man longer than she was a villain. I seriously doubt this is ever going to happen.

@god_spawn: @god_spawn said:

@The Dark Huntress said:

She's better for Scott than Jean ever was. That being said, Emma would be better off without Scott than Scott would be without her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she'd be better off alone than she is with him. They bring out the best in each other and they support each other.

@Dark_Phoenix00x said:

Poor writing is her problem. I thought she was great thru Whedon's run in Astonishing, potrayed her well, it's the writers that have taken her since, have no idea how to write a powerful, posh, confident, b!tchy woman. Makes me cringe the way she is portrayed as of late, some dumb-blonde that lacks any of the "White Queen" in her

This is all Fraction. Gillen (who is now writing Uncanny) does a pretty decent job with her, although he doesn't (nor will anybody ever, really) get her like Morrison and especially Whedon.

What Huntress said. Quite frankly I don't see them splitting still, Marvel likes "swerves" and false promotions like all the Emma and Namor moments in the past that never fell through and was just to do it for dramatic effect.The recent Scott and Storm for Astonishing ad with them kissing for example just seems like another one of Marvel's teaser ploys to try and get some reaction to get people to buy the books even though it's doubtful Scott would cheat on Emma and Storm would cheat on T'Challa considering how popular those couples are and especially with Marvel's biggest franchise, those couples rake in huge profits. Emma's done more for Scott than Jean ever did, and bringing her back with him or something like that would just get rid of the character growth, Jean had a long time with Scott and since she's been irrelevant for years, put her with Wolverine or something, there has always been chemistry between those two, Emma and Scott when written well balance each other out as DH pointed, there has been a lack of writing and with Gillen writing and Scott still alive after Schism and both Emma and Scott still in Uncanny things could very well get better. Still, Scott would do more if written well than Namor would ever for Emma and she would do more for Scott than she would for Namor.

This. Namor and Emma would be a HORRIBLE couple (and not just because I love Emma and hate Namor). :P

Babs, I am disappoint. It's quite obvious that the problems with Emma's character recently are by no means a byproduct of her relationship with Scott, especially considering how popular said relationship is among fans and writers alike. Hell, even Jason Aaron was quoted as saying that they are his favorite comic book couple. The sad fact is that a lot of writers simply don't know how to portray Emma well. Granted, not everyone can be Morrison or Whedon, but that's no excuse for having the only notable thing involving Emma recently be that Namor won't stop ogling her (fish boy, you like men, there's nothing wrong with it and you need to accept so you can stop overcompensating by chasing after blonds that are already taken). Hopefully Emma asserts herself as a strong leader alongside Scott in the future, like when they actually appeared to be equals during Whedon's run. Also, I hope Namor goes back to Atlantis where he can be broody and arrogant away from Emma. ^_^

@TheCrowbar said:

@The Dark Huntress: I'm actually hoping when Jean comes back, she comes back evil. Not insane. Not possessed. Evil.

I wouldn't mind it.

That, or completely PF-free.

I would be quite upset if she pulled the "I'm evil again" card, especially because some circles do seem to anticipate it. It would be a waste of a lot of potential and the depth that exists in the character. Edit: This, referencing to Emma, not Jean.

I'm not a Cyclops-hater by any stretch, but I think the pairing has become stale. This may in fact be due to the writers, but that should be read as an in world commentary as well. If the writers can't work the pair, then the chemistry of the pair has fizzled, as happens every day to couples in the real world. Even when people seem great together for a long while, the simplicity of having played out every interesting scenario leads to a parting of the ways, often uncomfortably.

I also don't really think we need to contemplate who Emma goes with next, simply because she is a powerful enough character (not referencing her mutant power here) to be both sustainable and interesting on her own. I'm not saying she should stay single either, just saying that I think there are better questions to ask pertaining to Emma's future, post-Scott.

@ApatheticAvenger: <3

@The Dark Huntress said:

@TheCrowbar said:

@The Dark Huntress: I'm actually hoping when Jean comes back, she comes back evil. Not insane. Not possessed. Evil.

I wouldn't mind it.

That, or completely PF-free.

I wouldn't mind seeing her as the Black Queen again. She owned that outfit.

And PF free is a must, evil or hero.

Enough with the Cyclops bashing Babs. It'ss enough to want to avoid coming to this site at this point.

@EmmaGrace said:

@The Dark Huntress said:

@TheCrowbar said:

@The Dark Huntress: I'm actually hoping when Jean comes back, she comes back evil. Not insane. Not possessed. Evil.

I wouldn't mind it.

That, or completely PF-free.

I wouldn't mind seeing her as the Black Queen again. She owned that outfit.

Was Jean ever Black Queen? I know that Maddie was, wasn't sure about Jean.

That's because Scott Summers is the most contagious jerk of mainstream Marvel heroes.

@The Dark Huntress: I do my best. x]

@The Dark Huntress: Yep, she was. But she was going through her DP thing, so it wasn't technically Jean.

@The Dark Huntress said:

@Wattup said:

I'm still waiting for Emma to fully betray the X-Men. C'mon, ya'll know it's gonna happen...it's just a slow burn, know what I'm sayin'?

She's been an X-Man longer than she was a villain. I seriously doubt this is ever going to happen.

After settling things with shaw Recently in UXM, it won't happen, I think that put her going bad again to rest.

@ApatheticAvenger said:

@god_spawn: @god_spawn said:

@The Dark Huntress said:

She's better for Scott than Jean ever was. That being said, Emma would be better off without Scott than Scott would be without her. That doesn't necessarily mean that she'd be better off alone than she is with him. They bring out the best in each other and they support each other.

@Dark_Phoenix00x said:

Poor writing is her problem. I thought she was great thru Whedon's run in Astonishing, potrayed her well, it's the writers that have taken her since, have no idea how to write a powerful, posh, confident, b!tchy woman. Makes me cringe the way she is portrayed as of late, some dumb-blonde that lacks any of the "White Queen" in her

This is all Fraction. Gillen (who is now writing Uncanny) does a pretty decent job with her, although he doesn't (nor will anybody ever, really) get her like Morrison and especially Whedon.

What Huntress said. Quite frankly I don't see them splitting still, Marvel likes "swerves" and false promotions like all the Emma and Namor moments in the past that never fell through and was just to do it for dramatic effect.The recent Scott and Storm for Astonishing ad with them kissing for example just seems like another one of Marvel's teaser ploys to try and get some reaction to get people to buy the books even though it's doubtful Scott would cheat on Emma and Storm would cheat on T'Challa considering how popular those couples are and especially with Marvel's biggest franchise, those couples rake in huge profits. Emma's done more for Scott than Jean ever did, and bringing her back with him or something like that would just get rid of the character growth, Jean had a long time with Scott and since she's been irrelevant for years, put her with Wolverine or something, there has always been chemistry between those two, Emma and Scott when written well balance each other out as DH pointed, there has been a lack of writing and with Gillen writing and Scott still alive after Schism and both Emma and Scott still in Uncanny things could very well get better. Still, Scott would do more if written well than Namor would ever for Emma and she would do more for Scott than she would for Namor.

This. Namor and Emma would be a HORRIBLE couple (and not just because I love Emma and hate Namor). XD

Babs, I am disappoint. It's quite obvious that the problems with Emma's character recently are by no means a byproduct of her relationship with Scott, especially considering how popular said relationship is among fans and writers alike. Hell, even Jason Aaron was quoted as saying that they are his favorite comic book couple. The sad fact is that a lot of writers simply don't know how to portray Emma well. Granted, not everyone can be Morrison or Whedon, but that's no excuse for having the only notable thing involving Emma recently be that Namor won't stop ogling her (fish boy, you like men, there's nothing wrong with it and you need to accept so you can stop overcompensating by chasing after blonds that are already taken). Hopefully Emma asserts herself as a strong leader alongside Scott in the future, like when they actually appeared to be equals during Whedon's run. Also, I hope Namor goes back to Atlantis where he can brood away from Emma.

Nice post, I just want to add onto it a bit. The only thing Namor has to offer Emma is a title, that being of Queen. Scott himself may not be a real king, but he is the savior of the mutant race, the man has become a general, a leader, and a messiah. Scott has every right to call himself a king for what he has done even a king has to make hard decisions. Give Emma a bit of initiative with Scott and she has every right to call herself a Queen.