she is treated poorly because she can't get non exploitative costume along with starfire.

You guys remember when Gail Simone gave her the ability to call lightning strikes from the sky? How awesome was that!?!

Back on topic:

Wonder Woman is not treated poorly . . . she's not a popular comic book character. She is a popular Pop Culture Icon but she is not a popular Comic Book Character meaning that comic book fans do not care for Wonder Woman and they show it by not buying her book. Superman actually has a lot of the same problems that Wonder Woman has in the public eye and that's the fact that these characters are lacking a certain coolness factor that heroes like Wolverine and Batman have. That lack of attraction or appeal means lower comic book sales and any business would be hard pressed to push a product to a demographic that doesn't want it. There was an obligation to publish Wonder Woman because of her Iconic status before the new 52. With critically acclaimed creative teams on the title and the book barely floated above cancellation numbers for years. If she was treated poorly the company would have canned her title long ago like all the other B-listers. That is something that I consider to be Excellent Treatment, A-List treatment.

That being said, being an A-list character doesn't mean that a comic will run forever either. Superman & Batman have had multitude of ancillary titles that are long gone.

@gokuwarrior you keep droning on about PIS and inconsistencies ad nauseam, blaming the company and the creative teams for various indiscretions against Wonder Woman. That's fine, you're entitled to your opinion but your opinion, as often as you repeat it, is very rarely based in factual accounts of her being treated poorly. The company wants Wonder Woman to succeed as much as you do, I believe this, but they are bound by the laws of Capitolism which dictates the rules of supply and demand. If there is no demand why supply it?

This lends to my point that DC has tried to do everything in it's power to make Wonder Woman a success. The inconsistencies that you mention, are in part, due to the efforts of DC to make her more interesting to a wider audience, drum up sales and create more peripheral projects for her. New plot lines, new supporting characters, new costume changes are never meant to tarnish the character, these creative teams are doing the best they can to create the best comics they can. They want to keep their jobs and sell comics.

If someone can make her title sell more then this will be directly affect things like greater consistency, company wide events, interest in new multimedia projects, and over all popularity. All of these elements connect to monetary success and you will never see it unless the comic. can sell more.

@Press Oblivion:she sells well for a character with a comic per month,but let's talk about worldwide sales,they don't promote her properly to make her more successful outside the US,and how do you know that she wouldn't be successful with her own animated series or movie?,when she had the show with lynda carer it was a big success,and helped the character to improve comic sales too,but they don't know how to market her,that's why they did horrible things like some of her comic runs,that didn't seem to have the purpose of making her more successful,because they seemed to be tryin to make it the worst it could be,making her get humiliated by street level characters isn't the way to make her more successful,so i don't agree with that either,then you have the horrible pilot,and the list goes on.they haven't tried to give her an animated series or live action movie or videogame,they have to try to see if it works.

Wonder Woman as a character has not proven to be a salable property. That's why nothing more than one book a month will be done with her.

Every time someone brings up printing another Wonder Woman title, the first words in response are "The Book Would Have to Sell". This is the mentality that Wonder Woman is up against. It's not her treatment it's her reputation as a comic book character.

I am hoping beyond hope that this TV series gets green lit to prove this post wrong.

@Press Oblivion: and if her reputation as a comic character is bad,who do you think is the one to blame?,if she had a good story,good and consistent feats and a good marketing,she would sell more,because that's everything that a character really needs,they have to market her properly,the potential is there,they need good writing and good marketing.

The Consumer Market is mostly to blame because it's their support that makes a publication.It's just business.

Wonder Woman needs some stand alone graphic novel type releases that are suitable for a broader market appeal. some watchmen, killing joke, dark knight type stuff that can get non geeks reading. maybe a young adult series about a teenage diana on themyscira.

@Press Oblivion: they don't market her properly,look at aquaman,he improved sales because he is now being well writen,with consistent feats,good story and good marketing,they have learned how to give him time in the spotlight,and he could sell even better if they keep doing more promotion and proper marketing.

they need to do the same with wonder woman in the comics,and then also market her properly outside the comics,a well down animated series is the easiest way to get a wider audience,and it won't cost that much,the character has the potential,they need to do good stories,promotion and market her properly.

@sunhawk:they need to promot and market wonder woman properly in the comics,and then also market her properly outside the comics,a well down animated series is the easiest way to get a wider audience,and it won't cost that much,the character has the potential,they need to do good stories,promotion and market her properly.

I want to know what happened to the peaceful/peacemaker Wonder Woman,The new 52 isnt that great to me.....they killed Helena Bertinelli Huntress

@sunhawk said:

Wonder Woman needs some stand alone graphic novel type releases that are suitable for a broader market appeal. some watchmen, killing joke, dark knight type stuff that can get non geeks reading. maybe a young adult series about a teenage diana on themyscira.

Those are some very interesting ideas. I'd like to see all of that along side another monthly title. :D

@gokuwarrior said:

@Press Oblivion: they don't market her properly,look at aquaman,he improved sales because he is now being well writen,with consistent feats,good story and good marketing,they have learned how to give him time in the spotlight,and he could sell even better if they keep doing more promotion and proper marketing.

they need to do the same with wonder woman in the comics,and then also market her properly outside the comics,a well down animated series is the easiest way to get a wider audience,and it won't cost that much,the character has the potential,they need to do good stories,promotion and market her properly.

Have they done more marketing with Aquaman? Certainly the creative team of Johns and Ries on the title brought it a lot of attention but I think that Wonder Woman and Aquaman have had equal promotion and they both have about the same monthly sales numbers by about 5k or 10k units. The story and quality of these 2 series are also on par with one another so what you're saying is that you don't like the New 52 wonder Woman series?

@wtk1013 said:

I want to know what happened to the peaceful/peacemaker Wonder Woman,The new 52 isnt that great to me.....they killed Helena Bertinelli Huntress

They did kill the Bertinelli Huntress but we have the Wayne Huntress and she is better than no Huntress at all in my opinion. :D

I don't know that the peaceful/peacemaker Wonder Woman was ever really there. One of my biggest questions about her character was her mission as the ambassador of peace from Themescria. She was always very busy fighting problems but never really proactive with developing peace around the world. Her warrior heritage always seemed contradictory to her mission. In the this new relaunch of the universe, it seems that they haven't given her an ambassador status, I could be wrong.

I think dc is doing ok with Wonder Woman finally but more improvements are possible. The current mythology approach is interesting and makes Wonder Woman totally different from Superman so people can't say Wonder Woman is just a clone of Superman. Green Arrow has a similar problem bec. people always compare him to Batman and can't justify why do we need Green Arrow if we have Batman ? The problem with dc is dc keeps on claiming that Superman must always be the most powerful so this makes the others look bad such as Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Hawkman, Martian, Captain Marvel, Apollo, Orion, Mon-El, Cyborg. Dc also always claims Batman is the best so this makes others look bad such as Green Arrow, Black Canary. Superman is just an alien and he does not need to be god or too powerful but DC always wants Superman to be like god for some reason.

Superman must always be the most powerful too many charater can easily beat superman.... i agree with gokuwarrior again,the wonder woman should be always powerful,why a normal man could be hurt her??what the hell..bad writer,i don't read this comic i want to see wonder woman move planets or destroy planet,now,the new 52 superman can easily lift earth weight,why wonder woman can't?she always was superman strength level,she should be has this feat

@colonyofcells said:

I think dc is doing ok with Wonder Woman finally but more improvements are possible.

Agreed

in the new 52,even powergirl say she was as strong as superman wonder woman should be move planet,that would be More interesting, dynamic, exciting

@Press Oblivion: my point is that they are marketing aquaman better than before,that's why his sales improved,but he isn't as iconic as wonder woman is as a pop culture icon,and even as a comic character,which means they need to promote her more and market her properly.

her new title is good,but they need to develop more her power level and give her more action,that way sales can improve too,and then,DC needs to expand wonder woman horizon outside comics,having an animated series is a good way to gain a wider audience,a graphyc novel can help too.

@a88378438: i agree,they need to make a bigger development of her power level and give her more action.

Wonder Woman's current power levels seem ok enough and Wonder Woman just needs better stories. Pre flashpoint, having god like powers did not really help the popularity of Superman and I don't see Superman becoming popular in the New 52 even with god like powers.

Block Buster Movies and hit television shows have not done one thing for the comic book industry. Marvel & DC will tell you that.

While I would love to see an animates TV series and other Multimedia, it will do nothing to improve the Comic Book Marketplace for Wonder Woman.

@Press Oblivion: that's why i said first they need to market her properly in comics.

then do an animated series,and if they did an animated series based on the current events of her comic,that would improve the sales of her comic,just like the animes do for mangas.

You should really send your ideas to DC gokuwarrior. They need to hear this.

@Press Oblivion: that's my point of view about what could her her to improve her sales,are you being sarcastic with me?.

It has been dc's policy for many years now to make Superman and Batman appear the best compared to the other properties like Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Hawkman, Green Arrow, and this seems to be still the policy in the New 52. At least dc has put a good creative team for the Wonder Woman title. Wonder Woman has some powerful villains such as those naughty Greek gods and I do remember the old event War of the Gods which I liked. DC does not treat Wonder Woman too well bec. Wonder Woman does not really bring in that much profit. War of the Gods was not that profitable similar to the flop event of the New Gods called Genesis. Batman solo titles and Batman family title events tend to bring in lots more profit. Superman had a few profitable events such as Death of Superman and the Imperiex event Our Worlds At War.

@colonyofcells:they need to promot and market wonder woman properly in the comics to sell more,and then also market her properly outside the comics,a well down animated series is the easiest way to get a wider audience,and it won't cost that much,the character has the potential,they need to do good stories,promotion and market her properly.

@gokuwarrior said:

@Press Oblivion: that's my point of view about what could her her to improve her sales,are you being sarcastic with me?.

No. I've been saying this for weeks and not just to you but to all of the Wonder Woman fans . . . . DC needs to know how you feel.

@Press Oblivion: well,it'd be good to let DC know about it,but the question is,do they listen?.

Remember the Wonder Woman Pants issue? I don't know if they listen but they do hear.

Someone made a thread before that asked if WW should have a second title like Action Comics and Detective Comics (Sensational Comics essentially) I think that would be a good idea, a great way to showcase her in the modern world, while her own title shows her mythological, Greek heritage. 

@The Stegman: that would be a really great idea...i m absolutely digging the WW solo but it would be nice to have her interact with the main universe somewhere other than the Jl books... i m really loving her appearance in Batwoman too

@The Stegman said:

Someone made a thread before that asked if WW should have a second title like Action Comics and Detective Comics (Sensational Comics essentially) I think that would be a good idea, a great way to showcase her in the modern world, while her own title shows her mythological, Greek heritage.

@cloudzackvincent said:

@The Stegman: that would be a really great idea...i m absolutely digging the WW solo but it would be nice to have her interact with the main universe somewhere other than the Jl books... i m really loving her appearance in Batwoman too

You guys are Wonder Woman fans after my own heart!

@Press Oblivion: yea i m , she is my favourite superhero along with Superman

Just saying:

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2008/08/10_reasons_no_one_cares_about_wonder_woman.php

As for idea of promoting her, well there is nothing so bad as shoving something down the people's throats.

Wonder Woman probably needs more reboots to be popular.

@Picard said:

Just saying:

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2008/08/10_reasons_no_one_cares_about_wonder_woman.php

As for idea of promoting her, well there is nothing so bad as shoving something down the people's throats.

Thanks for the link . . . read it and now I'm sad. :(

@Picard: those reasons are only subjective,how can someone know that she'll never be A-list character?,and actually she is an A-list character,specially for a female,because no other female in comic gets the spotlight as much as wonder woman does,and what are the A-list characters besides superman and batman?,please if we go by DC standards,then superman and batman are the only A-list characters,because no other character is as important as them,no other character get the spotlight and atetention as much as them,no green lantern,manhunter,cap marvel,no flash,no one,so it's not just wonder woman.

she isn't a good storytelling?,the perez run,ruka run and gail simone run were amazing,and the arazello run is a very good storytelling.

ripp off superman?,she may have some similar powers,but the origin,personality and story is completely different,i would save the ripp off thing for supergirl,she is the only real ripp off superman,and it couldn't be more obious,wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

@gokuwarrior: I wouldnt even pay attention to that link its from 0'8 and just the opinion of some dude.

She is a an A-List character. Like Gambler said.

@Press Oblivion:yes and those reasons are only subjective,how can someone know that she'll never be A-list character?,and actually she is an A-list character,specially for a female,because no other female in comic gets the spotlight as much as wonder woman does,and what are the A-list characters besides superman and batman?,please if we go by DC standards,then superman and batman are the only A-list characters,because no other character is as important as them,no other character get the spotlight and atetention as much as them,no green lantern,manhunter,cap marvel,no flash,no one,so it's not just wonder woman.

she isn't a good storytelling?,the perez run,ruka run and gail simone run were amazing,and the arazello run is a very good storytelling.

ripp off superman?,she may have some similar powers,but the origin,personality and story is completely different,i would save the ripp off thing for supergirl,she is the only real ripp off superman,and it couldn't be more obious,wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

@gokuwarrior: that is a post from some dude who has probably not even read a WW book... he has just given some generic reasons that everyone else seems to throw around while hating on WW. i think some people think its cool to hate on WW and Superman.

@cloudzackvincent: you're right.

Every Wonder Woman fan here who read that link from Picard was probably shaking their head along with me. The article was actually written by a woman and she seems to be stuck on the Golden Age.

From the article:

9) There Are No Great Wonder Woman Stories

Gods and Mortals, The Contest, The Challenge of Artemis, and Down To Earth. Just a few of her great arcs that are more than 3 issues. The writer of that is a moron and desperately seeking attention.

I just see,wonder woman not just have "Golden Age" the Golden Age just too bad...i read some wonder woman Golden Age comic..they are have too many A hint of SEX....

@gokuwarrior said:

@Picard: those reasons are only subjective,how can someone know that she'll never be A-list character?,and actually she is an A-list character,specially for a female,because no other female in comic gets the spotlight as much as wonder woman does,and what are the A-list characters besides superman and batman?,please if we go by DC standards,then superman and batman are the only A-list characters,because no other character is as important as them,no other character get the spotlight and atetention as much as them,no green lantern,manhunter,cap marvel,no flash,no one,so it's not just wonder woman.

she isn't a good storytelling?,the perez run,ruka run and gail simone run were amazing,and the arazello run is a very good storytelling.

ripp off superman?,she may have some similar powers,but the origin,personality and story is completely different,i would save the ripp off thing for supergirl,she is the only real ripp off superman,and it couldn't be more obious,wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

You know this work both ways - only because you like something doesn't mean that it's good. :) I just give you something to think about and you come back with this passive aggressive rant. Butt hurt much? You claim that WW is indeed A-list character yet in your opening post you cliam that obscure character like Buffy - female character BTW -, from small publishing company like Dark Horse is selling more books than WW. Yes, I see how immensely popular Diana is... difference is that authors of Buffy are very conscious of its audience - their goal was essentially to create a female version of Spider-man, socially awkward high schooler who fight evil, someone with whom young female audience can identify with. Also you can see strong vibes of X-man and Kitty Pryde in there: Have you tried not being a mutant? , Have you tried not being a Slayer? etc. Can you say this same about WW? What this character have to offer to young females? Let's see Diana is: "beautiful as Aphrodite, wise as Athena, as strong as Hercules, and as swift as Hermes.", she wrote a book, she was ambassador to the UN, she is an excellent fighter, and princess, even her conception was supernatural, and even though she came from warrior's society she believe in equality, peace, love and understanding etc. And I hear that her tears cure cancer but she never cries... ;) Essentially she is Mary Sue. Do you think that any person can identify with such perfect hero? I don't think so. This is the same problem with Superman - he is essentially boy scout with godly powers. Did you ask yourself why Batman is such popular hero, why he is the only hero that DC can sold to general audience? Bruce is distant, reclusive, neurotic, obsessive, he is borderline psychopath, his orygin is rooted in tragedy, and his crusade to clean up Gotham is doomed to failure. You see now why he is popular and your princess Mary Sue is not? People want to read about Batman because he is deeply flawed individual and in this same time he is this great hero who save the day without aid of superpowers. There is something deeply appealing about flawed hero because if hero can have flaws then it is possible that there is a hero in all of us. Hell, even authors of Superman know that - Sups is still around because of Clark Kent, ordinary farm boy with glasses... But when Joss Whedon wrote a screenplay about flawed Wonder Woman, Warner Bros didn't even want to hear about it. You feel stupid now Warner Bros executives, after The Avengers made gazillions of dollars? ;) And even if main character is applying but story sucks, then your comic is doomed to failure. You can see this on example on those mentioned Buffy comics, story sucks and sales dropped drastically:

http://www.mdd-marketing.co.uk/files/BuffyS8-ratings2.png

Can you show me great, critically acclaimed WW graphic novel, such as Allan Moore's Killing joke? You can't? That's what I thought. And yes Wonder Woman is inspired by Superman, her creator William Moulton Marston said: The obvious remedy is to create a feminine character with all the strength of Superman plus all the allure of a good and beautiful woman.

And I don't hate her, I just don't give a damn about her. Why should I?

@Picard: Wonder Woman obviously isn't for everyone and I fear that your opinion represents the majority when it comes to her character.

This line of thinking is what the character is up against. But I think that things are turning around for her and next few years will be great for the character.

@gokuwarrior said:

wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

Quoted for poetic beauty.

@Press Oblivion said:

@Picard: Wonder Woman obviously isn't for everyone and I fear that your opinion represents the majority when it comes to her character.

This line of thinking is what the character is up against. But I think that things are turning around for her and next few years will be great for the character.

@gokuwarrior said:

wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

Quoted for poetic beauty.

Sure she isn't. You know de gustibus... But in your place I would be 1) happy that there is this one WW book, there are some old , characters that were immensely popular in the past and now faded into obscurity - think about Tarzan, The Shadow, Sherlock Holmes, Zorro etc. - so be happy that she is still around. 2) Be happy that her book stays true to character. You don't want her portrayed as psychopath, don't you?: ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8ejRI7R3JA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5XF_m2Hcjc

http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/teamt/nash/specials/33934-wonder-woman-2011

The real problem is that WW fan's feel that WW is more entitled then any other hero fan bases.

@Picard said:

@gokuwarrior said:

@Picard: those reasons are only subjective,how can someone know that she'll never be A-list character?,and actually she is an A-list character,specially for a female,because no other female in comic gets the spotlight as much as wonder woman does,and what are the A-list characters besides superman and batman?,please if we go by DC standards,then superman and batman are the only A-list characters,because no other character is as important as them,no other character get the spotlight and atetention as much as them,no green lantern,manhunter,cap marvel,no flash,no one,so it's not just wonder woman.

she isn't a good storytelling?,the perez run,ruka run and gail simone run were amazing,and the arazello run is a very good storytelling.

ripp off superman?,she may have some similar powers,but the origin,personality and story is completely different,i would save the ripp off thing for supergirl,she is the only real ripp off superman,and it couldn't be more obious,wonder woman isn't the counterpart of a male character like most females,wonder woman is her own character.

and just cos some people don't like something it doesn't make it's bad.

You know this work both ways - only because you like something doesn't mean that it's good. :) I just give you something to think about and you come back with this passive aggressive rant. Butt hurt much? You claim that WW is indeed A-list character yet in your opening post you cliam that obscure character like Buffy - female character BTW -, from small publishing company like Dark Horse is selling more books than WW. Yes, I see how immensely popular Diana is... difference is that authors of Buffy are very conscious of its audience - their goal was essentially to create a female version of Spider-man, socially awkward high schooler who fight evil, someone with whom young female audience can identify with. Also you can see strong vibes of X-man and Kitty Pryde in there: Have you tried not being a mutant? , Have you tried not being a Slayer? etc. Can you say this same about WW? What this character have to offer to young females? Let's see Diana is: "beautiful as Aphrodite, wise as Athena, as strong as Hercules, and as swift as Hermes.", she wrote a book, she was ambassador to the UN, she is an excellent fighter, and princess, even her conception was supernatural, and even though she came from warrior's society she believe in equality, peace, love and understanding etc. And I hear that her tears cure cancer but she never cries... ;) Essentially she is Mary Sue. Do you think that any person can identify with such perfect hero? I don't think so. This is the same problem with Superman - he is essentially boy scout with godly powers. Did you ask yourself why Batman is such popular hero, why he is the only hero that DC can sold to general audience? Bruce is distant, reclusive, neurotic, obsessive, he is borderline psychopath, his orygin is rooted in tragedy, and his crusade to clean up Gotham is doomed to failure. You see now why he is popular and your princess Mary Sue is not? People want to read about Batman because he is deeply flawed individual and in this same time he is this great hero who save the day without aid of superpowers. There is something deeply appealing about flawed hero because if hero can have flaws then it is possible that there is a hero in all of us. Hell, even authors of Superman know that - Sups is still around because of Clark Kent, ordinary farm boy with glasses... But when Joss Whedon wrote a screenplay about flawed Wonder Woman, Warner Bros didn't even want to hear about it. You feel stupid now Warner Bros executives, after The Avengers made gazillions of dollars? ;) And even if main character is applying but story sucks, then your comic is doomed to failure. You can see this on example on those mentioned Buffy comics, story sucks and sales dropped drastically:

http://www.mdd-marketing.co.uk/files/BuffyS8-ratings2.png

Can you show me great, critically acclaimed WW graphic novel, such as Allan Moore's Killing joke? You can't? That's what I thought. And yes Wonder Woman is inspired by Superman, her creator William Moulton Marston said: The obvious remedy is to create a feminine character with all the strength of Superman plus all the allure of a good and beautiful woman.

And I don't hate her, I just don't give a damn about her. Why should I?

u accuse him of ranting, yet this is one of the longest rants i have seen in my 3 years in CV. He just stated his opinion, Some people may prefer reading about relatable or flawed characters, while others might wanna read about morally upright perfect characters. Its just a matter of taste. And how many mainstream comic characters do u think has a critically acclaimed graphic novel like "The Killing Joke" to their name? The only ones which could be compared to TKJ other then the Batman books are of course Watchmen, Sandman, Hellblazer and a couple of others like Hellboy, Preacher etc. And even these books don't really feature mainstream characters. Most of the critically acclaimed graphic novels like Maus, V for Vendetta, Y the last man, From Hell are very different from regular superhero books. Does Spiderman have a critically acclaimed graphic novel like "The Killing Joke"? No... does Wolverine have one? the answer is still no... neither does the incredible Hulk.....

And although i do concur that the last WW#13 was only the 44th top selling comic which is pretty bad, but i don't agree with your view that only relatable or flawed characters sell.. or that Batman is the only DC character that is selling... Over the past year Action comics has consistently outselling the very relatable Amazing Spiderman and the flawed Wolverine and the X men... Green Lantern has been selling pretty well too..in fact only the Marvel crossover and team books are selling better than these books. Action Comics and Green Lantern are outselling most of the solo books from Marvel.

@Picard: Please dude, no more disparaging links. Everyone's aware of the hate out there.

@Teerack: she doesn' have the promotion and development she could have.

@gokuwarrior: See what I mean?