i'm a fan of the character since a long time,but i think that she is treated like b list character.

her power level is very inconsistent,because some writters make her powerful,but other writters let her be beaten by a guy with cloroform,poison ivy,or btman in a melee fight.

they never let her do important things for the DC universe,not the way that superman and batman do,and most of the time,when they are around,she is just the helper,and many time the writters use her as a punching bag while superman and batman get the spotlight,and do the important job.

her villans are treated like they are nothing,they let all the street level characters beat all of wonder woman's rogue gallery.

and the new events that will start in DC,probaby everything will stay the same,they'll make her be just the helper of superman and batman,and make her look bad,while they do the important job.

how can she be taken seriously,and gain more readers,if they treat her so bad?,it seems that DC doesn't care,they never promote her as much as superman and batman,not even close,after 71 years and just a TV series from 30 years ago,one animated movie and just a comic for month,a comic that now aquaman,buffy and other comics outsell easily,WOW! so much promotion for the most iconic female(sarcasm),and in comics they even let her be humiliated by many street level characters,and they make her rogue gallery look like a joke.

so what do you think?,do you have hope for her and her villans in the new 52,or will everything stay the same?,will they keep treating her like a helper,a punching bag,humiliated most of the time while others take the spotlight?,will they keep treating her villans like the weakest and useless foes than even a normal human can humiliate?,i don't know what to think,what do you think?.

Her new 52 is better and she isn't treatly poorly anymore.

@moywar700: she is still treated poorly,in the JL comic,in one point she was knocked out by a shock wave,and in her comic she has problems with regular monsters.

@moywar700 said:

Her new 52 is better and she isn't treatly poorly anymore.

Her new 52 is a joke and already needs a reboot.

@gokuwarrior said:

i'm a fan of the character since a long time,but i think that she is treated like b list character.

her power level is very inconsistent,because some writters make her powerful,but other writters let her be beaten by a guy with cloroform,poison ivy,or btman in a melee fight.

they never let her do important things for the DC universe,not the way that superman and batman do,and most of the time,when they are around,she is just the helper,and many time the writters use her as a punching bag while superman and batman get the spotlight,and do the important job.

her villans are treated like they are nothing,they let all the street level characters beat all of wonder woman's rogue gallery.

Can you think of any specific examples of some of these. Cheetah and Circe have always been excellent villains. Unfortunately Batman and Superman pull in more money and money makes the world go round. Sad but true =/

I like the new 52 version but like all WW series its isolated (at least in my opinion).

The last Justice League ish I read she drop kicked Superman and beat the holy sh!t outta Green Lantern. I was happy :)

@Gambler: if things keep going like this,she'll never be relevant like superman and batman,she'll never be the star of an important event,or save the world on her own,she'll keep being treated like a punching bag by most of the writters that put thier hands on her and her rogue gallery,and that's sad.

@gokuwarrior: Kinda agree. In fact i wrote a blog awhile ago examining the idea that the Big Three no longer included Wonder Woman (this was pre new 52), but that she had been replaced with Green Lantern or even the Flash. Darkest Night, Flashpoint, whats Wonder Woman's grand DC story arc? The Genocide storyline? If so thats all kinds of sad.

I wish they'd put more effort into actually making Wonder Woman a bigger hero, meaning she needs more attention as a character. Her being in the big 3 should stay that way, she should not be replaced, it's ludicrous if she does.

@gokuwarrior said:

@moywar700: she is still treated poorly,in the JL comic,in one point she was knocked out by a shock wave,and in her comic she has problems with regular monsters.

Uhm, she fought with Green Lantern and broke his construct and sent him flying.

She also punched superman so hard he vomited blood. Here see,

@jwalser3 said:

Breaking out of GL construct. Justice League #11

And takes on GL and Superman

@matchesmalone21 said:

@jwalser3: I would post these scans earlier today, fell asleep too much. LOL

Thanks for posting.

@a88378438: Now with these new scans,you still think she's weak?

@Pokeysteve: she's treated like a punching bag,i don't know how is her reputation in the US right now,but worlwide she doesn't have all the respect that she deserves.

most writters make her inconsistent and weak,god like strength,god like speed,but still,they let street level characters hurt her with a punch,or tag her like if she was a turtle.

her villans are completely humiliated by street level characters too,catwoman beating cheetah like 2 or 3 times,i guess that for most writers,it's more likely that the woman in a cat suit will win against the avatar of a god,and that batman will beat circe like she was nothing,and KO wonder woman with a punch,but when superman attacks him,batman survives somehow,of course,because it's ok if wonder woman and her villans look like crap,but god don't let that happen to superman and batman.

and how can we know if wonder woman can't make more money for DC?,they never promote her,never,71 years and just a TV series and one animated movie,if you promote something properly,you can make more money,but they don't even bother to try and see what happens,to try to promote her more,and see if she has more potential to make much more money,of course she can make much more money,if they invest in her,but they don't care,or they don't realize how profitable she is ,it's sad to see how bad she is treated,she's the most iconic female,and still,it's like if she's nothing,it's sad,really sad.

@Gambler: DC has 2 big faces,superman and batman,GR or flash have never came close to them,you can count wonder woman as the 3 if we consider that's she the only female that is treated better than all the other females in comic,even when now almost anyone outsells her,but her iconic statu from what she used to be keeps her there,but it seems like a fantasy,she's iconic,but at the same time is treated like a helper and a punching bag many,many times,she hasn't been going anywhere in a long time,and it seems that nothing will change.

@gokuwarrior said:

@moywar700: she is still treated poorly,in the JL comic,in one point she was knocked out by a shock wave,and in her comic she has problems with regular monsters.

She also shattered a Green Lantern force field and basically took out Superman with one punch.

@gokuwarrior: There is a "glass ceiling" when it comes to female characters in comics, movies and other media. I believe Wonder Woman's powers and abilities on occasion threaten the legitimacy of other male comic-book characters and there struggles (cough superman) so she is often absent from main events or her power levels are lowered . Same reason why she seems isolated in her comic.

The new 52 version of WW is a big improvement though.

@Gambler said:

I like the new 52 version but like all WW series its isolated (at least in my opinion).

The last Justice League ish I read she drop kicked Superman and beat the holy sh!t outta Green Lantern. I was happy :)

(Hi gambler just making some comments not really directed at you but just to expand on the reasons I think Wonder Woman is isolated)

Anyway

I think Wonder Woman is such a unique character that her solo comics are purposely/subconsciously isolated so her actions do not threaten the legitimacy of other male hero's and villains. I mean How many original (not based of a male or female version) female comic book characters are there that are comparable to Wonder Woman.

Only Starfire (barely)

All the other female counter parts such as power-girl, super-girl, ms, marvel, miss martian, and the others can and are easily adjusted in the DC universe to just below there male counterparts abilities so they are not isolated.

However, since Wonder Woman has no male counterpart her power levels and canon remain a wildcard in the DC universe which keeps her isolated for the most part.

Add to that all her other unique abilities and you have a female character who is a big game changer when/if fully integrated into the DC universe properly.

I mean imagine if the new 52 Wonder Woman and her current rogues gallery and friends where fully incorporated into the total DC universe. Apollo Hades Hera Ares Hermes strife ETC they are all very powerful and would /should have a strong presence in the DC universe but there actions are muted so as not to disturb the current status quote.

I love her new 52 solo title, but I'm less enthusiastic about her JL appearances. Especially her little tantrum in the most recent issue.

@Gambler said:

@gokuwarrior: Kinda agree. In fact i wrote a blog awhile ago examining the idea that the Big Three no longer included Wonder Woman (this was pre new 52), but that she had been replaced with Green Lantern or even the Flash. Darkest Night, Flashpoint, whats Wonder Woman's grand DC story arc? The Genocide storyline? If so thats all kinds of sad.

War of the Gods? And it wasn't hers but she had a big part in Our Worlds At War too.

@Pokeysteve said:

@moywar700 said:

Her new 52 is better and she isn't treatly poorly anymore.

Her new 52 is a joke and already needs a reboot.

Bad taste bad!
BB

@Pokeysteve said:

War of the Gods? And it wasn't hers but she had a big part in Our Worlds At War too.

Not saying she never had one, more pointing out that compared to other major arcs hers dont match up. Flashpoint and Blackest Night expanded beyond just the GL and Flash titles, Wonder Woman's major arcs seldom if ever cross over which goes back to my point about her being isolated.

@sethysquare:those scans prove my point,they wreren't trying to hurt her,so DC

is telling us again,that she did good against a powerful team because they were

going easy on her,and they tried to clarify that very well.

DC never allowed her to beat superman in a fight one on one,let

alone beat him,green lanter and all the others at the same time;and even if she

beats them here,it's useless if the writters aren't consistent about

her,because in one issue they make her do great feats,but in the next

issue,they make her lose against a paper bag,so all the great feats that she

did befor are nothing,and at the end,she doesn't go anywher,that's sad,and

sexism.

@TheCannon:those scans prove my point,they wreren't trying to hurt her,so DC

is telling us again,that she did good against a powerful team because they were

going easy on her,and they tried to clarify that very well.

DC never allowed her to beat superman in a fight one on one,let

alone beat him,green lanter and all the others at the same time;and even if she

beats them here,it's useless if the writters aren't consistent about

her,because in one issue they make her do great feats,but in the next

issue,they make her lose against a paper bag,so all the great feats that she

did befor are nothing,and at the end,she doesn't go anywher,that's sad,and

sexism.

@Gambler said:

I like the new 52 version but like all WW series its isolated (at least in my opinion).

The last Justice League ish I read she drop kicked Superman and beat the holy sh!t outta Green Lantern. I was happy :)

I am in the same boat. I really like the new 52 version of Wonder Woman and finally have started to get into her series. However, it seems completely isolated from the other stories occurring in the New 52 verse and there currently isn't enough build up prior to her defeating her enemies. Maybe they need to focus more on expanding the scope of the threats she deals with and/or concentrate on building visually exciting combat scenes? I like the art, but even I have to admit that certain fighting or combat scenes seem half-hearted in execution. Maybe they should read some Dragon Ball Z on how to draw out a single battle for as long as possible yet keep the tension high or push her supporting cast (one of which is one of the higher gods, another is a lower-ranked god and a demigod) into the sidelines so we can focus more on what she thinks and does versus what she tells them.

ETA: Had to correct some mistakes and hanging sentences after realizing I missed some words while typing at work.

@PhoenixoftheTides: Couldnt agree more. I wish they'd spend some serious time artistically illustrating her combat prowess. She isnt suppose to be Superman and just overpower opponents but systematically break them down with technique, skills, and hand to hand prowess.

@Gambler:she has never had an event relevant for the whole DC universe,DC never promotes her,after 71 years what does she have?,a comic for month,a TV series and one animated movie,they don't promote her as mucgh as they could,DC doesn't realize that she can give much more,she is very profitable,and many,many times she is treated like a punching bag or just the helper.

@WDW: she hasn't improved,

she has never had an event relevant for the whole DC universe,DC never promotes her,after 71 years what does she have?,a comic for month,a TV series and one animated movie,they don't promote her as mucgh as they could,they need to give her not just a good story,they also need to develop her power level,give her interesting and amaizing fights and respet her power level,don't fall into inconsistencies,but DC doesn't realize that she can give much more,she is very profitable,and many,many times she is treated like a punching bag or just the helper.

Her New 52 so far has been amazing and that is the way I love to see Wonder Woman,an amazon that tries to be a human but has too many ties to the gods and has to fight with mythical creatures and stuff.

@TDK_1997: most of the time,they treat her like a punching bag,specialy outside her comic,and they do the same with her villans,and they keep her as a helper,don't let her do importat things for DC the way that superman and batman do,and they never promote her,71 years and just a comic for month,a TV series and one animated movie.

they need to give her not just a good story,they also need to develop her power level,give her and her villans interesting and amaizing fights,make them relevan for the DC and respet her power level,don't fall into inconsistencies.

@Gambler said:

@PhoenixoftheTides: Couldnt agree more. I wish they'd spend some serious time artistically illustrating her combat prowess. She isnt suppose to be Superman and just overpower opponents but systematically break them down with technique, skills, and hand to hand prowess.

The thing is, I wouldn't mind if they pushed the idea that her opponents were skyfather level threats and that the least of them was easily a match for a Kryptonian. It would justify that she would need enhanced Amazonian combat mastery to fight them fairly, and give her a reason to exist in a universe where the majority of super-powered, high level heroes fight unarmed. She should at the very least be the one you call when Superman, Supergirl or even Black Adam are rampaging in your city, and IMO she should clearly be shown as capable of handling them even if it's not easily. Make her the Kratos of the DC universe (except not psychotic), in that due to the divine nature of her race, she can conceivably continue getting more powerful and draw power from people's worship. Currently, her book is so self contained that her threats look only dangerous to her and her loved ones - not large scale dangers.

I see the major difference between her and Superman & Batman to be that she uses battle strategy, and should be the one they look to for leadership whereas Batman is more of the type to figure out answers to problems before they come up and Superman is the weapon that can be brought out to finish most battles. It's hard for her to find a place consistently when Clark and Bruce cover so many bases between them.

Few interpretations of Diana have satisfied me to be honest. I love the character but she unlike my favorite female comic hero doesn't get put in stories enough that make me go "WoW!". The potential is there but DC never seems to have the balls to go there.

We need to see Diana strangling hydras with her bare hands, chastize giants and slew the nemean lion. Aliens, robots and such should only be the focus in other stories. Things like genocide, cheetah etc are wastes of time. Have her deal with Ares, Bastet and Hecate instead. Diana's stories should be glorious epic sagas of mythical legend nothing less should be acceptable. If write a tragedy, make it a greek play.

@PhoenixoftheTides: she must have legendary fights,they need to make her very,very powerful,as she is supposed to be.

show her able to move continets with her strenght,show her being able to fight faster than light,giving hits and reacting at that speed too,show her able to destroy planets,and take multi planet busting attacks,her power level should be that high,because she is a warrior with divine power,so her power can keep increasing more and more,but to do this,they need to give her not just a good story,they also need to develop her power level,give her interesting and amaizing fights,and do the same with her villans,make them relevan for the DC and respet her power level,and her villans power level,and don't fall into inconsistencies.

@Crom-Cruach:

she must have legendary fights,they need to make her very,very powerful,as she is supposed to be.

show her able to move continets with her strenght,show her being able to fight faster than light,giving hits and reacting at that speed too,show her able to destroy planets,and take multi planet busting attacks,her power level should be that high,because she is a warrior with divine power,so her power can keep increasing more and more,but to do this,they need to give her not just a good story,they also need to develop her power level,give her interesting and amaizing fights,and do the same with her villans,make them relevan for the DC and respet her power level,and her villans power level,and don't fall into inconsistencies.

@gokuwarrior: Power level is irrelevant to making a good Diana story. What matters is for us to go "WoW". We need a writer that will make readers want to tell their friends about her and convince them to read and buy her stories, then these friends do the same to their friends.

She doesn't need to be as powerful as superman. Heck she could be mortal for all the good it could be in a story. Odysseus was a mortal, he still slew cyclops, fought off harpies and took out dozens of men. What matters is a constant run of good stories that make readers care enough about the character to keep reading and buying. Make her stories feel mythical, legendary and epic. None of that is about power level, it's about tone and style of narration. It's about a passionate writer with talent who know mythology and knows how to write the core concepts of wonder woman

@Crom-Cruach: her power level matters a lot,because most writters use her as a punching bag,they even let normal humans with cloroform beat her.

so they need to make up their minds,if they'll writte a good story with her being just a peak humasn,fine,that's great,but if they will writte her with god like power,then they can't have her being owned by a regular human,and being tagged by a turtle,thats my point.

she is supposed to be a powerhouse,but they treat her like a punching bag,that even humans can beat,even with all her god like powers,so her power level matters a lot,nobody will buy a story with a wonder woman that has god like power but loses to a paper bag,get my point?,it has to be something balanced,a good strory that matches her power level,if she'll be a peak human,writte her that way with story according to that,.if she'll be a divine warrior with god like power,then the story must be written to match that,in order to be good everything must be well balanced,and consistent.

@Billy Batson said:

@Pokeysteve said:

@moywar700 said:

Her new 52 is better and she isn't treatly poorly anymore.

Her new 52 is a joke and already needs a reboot.

Bad taste bad!
BB

IT'S HORRIBLE! Your face is bad :P

@Gambler said:

@Pokeysteve said:

War of the Gods? And it wasn't hers but she had a big part in Our Worlds At War too.

Not saying she never had one, more pointing out that compared to other major arcs hers dont match up. Flashpoint and Blackest Night expanded beyond just the GL and Flash titles, Wonder Woman's major arcs seldom if ever cross over which goes back to my point about her being isolated.

War of the Gods was covered in a bunch of titles. I read the whole thing and only some of them were actually relevant but still. I haven't read Blackest Night (no idea where to start and the order) or Flashpoint. I don't think Flashpoint should count because that was right before everything restarted and just happened to center on Flash. It was his turn for an arc haha.

@Crom-Cruach said:

Few interpretations of Diana have satisfied me to be honest. I love the character but she unlike my favorite female comic hero doesn't get put in stories enough that make me go "WoW!". The potential is there but DC never seems to have the balls to go there.

We need to see Diana strangling hydras with her bare hands, chastize giants and slew the nemean lion. Aliens, robots and such should only be the focus in other stories. Things like genocide, cheetah etc are wastes of time. Have her deal with Ares, Bastet and Hecate instead. Diana's stories should be glorious epic sagas of mythical legend nothing less should be acceptable. If write a tragedy, make it a greek play.

The character you should be reading is Hercules. Seriously, Sorbo's old show is exactly that and is awesome =)

@Pokeysteve said:

War of the Gods was covered in a bunch of titles.

Thats why I added seldom if ever. Cause there's only a handful, if that, that expand beyond her our little self-contained corner of the DCU. As far as Flashpoint, the point still stands that the DCU over the last couple of years have made a major push to get GL and Flash in the front of the pack while WW continues to hover in mediocrity. How in the World multiple Batman, multiple Superman, and even a Green Lantern movie have all seen the big screen yet Wonder Woman, a member of the Big Three has not. I almost wanna bet the Flash gets made before Wonder Woman does.

@Gambler said:

@Pokeysteve said:

War of the Gods was covered in a bunch of titles.

Thats why I added seldom if ever. Cause there's only a handful, if that, that expand beyond her our little self-contained corner of the DCU. As far as Flashpoint, the point still stands that the DCU over the last couple of years have made a major push to get GL and Flash in the front of the pack while WW continues to hover in mediocrity. How in the World multiple Batman, multiple Superman, and even a Green Lantern movie have all seen the big screen yet Wonder Woman, a member of the Big Three has not. I almost wanna bet the Flash gets made before Wonder Woman does.

wonder woman did not get an movie yet because hollywood doesn't like action female leads.

@moywar700: I believe it but its not like there arent female lead movies out there. They make em all the time. Thelma and Louise, Kill Bill 1/2, Haywire, the Debt. There out there, they're getting made. I dont get why Wonder Woman isnt among em.

@Pokeysteve:she has never had an event relevant for the whole DC universe,DC never promotes her,after 71 years what does she have?,a comic for month that now almost everyone outsells,a TV series and one animated movie,they don't promote her as much as they could,they need to give her not just a good story,they also need to develop her power level,give her interesting and amaizing fights and respet her power level,don't fall into inconsistencies,but DC doesn't realize that she can give much more,she is very profitable,but many,many times she is treated like a punching bag or just the helper.

@Gambler: Wouldn't it just be Xena: Warrior Princess on the big screen?

@Gambler said:

@moywar700: I believe it but its not like there arent female lead movies out there. They make em all the time. Thelma and Louise, Kill Bill 1/2, Haywire, the Debt. There out there, they're getting made. I dont get why Wonder Woman isnt among em.

out of the ones you listed, only kill bill did well. Despite this, hollywood didn't approve of action female leads.

@Pokeysteve said:

@moywar700 said:

Her new 52 is better and she isn't treatly poorly anymore.

Her new 52 is a joke and already needs a reboot.

Agree completely. They did it with Deathstroke, I think it would be wise to do it with WW.

@Gambler: and the worst part is that even in the comics she is treated like a mediocre character,only a comic for month,that almost any other comic outsells,in the important events she is the helper of superman and batman,or the punching bag while they do important job.

if at least writtes could develop her character properly in comics,that would be an improvement for her,if they writte her comic respecting her story,her standar,and give her the oportunity to shine in other comics too,and develope hr villans properly,make them something relevant for DC universe outside her title,and avoid inconsitencies,that's all we need for now,but it seems to much to ask,they don't even try,that's disappointing.

@Erik: they rebot new 52 deathstroke?.

@Malonius said:

@Gambler: Wouldn't it just be Xena: Warrior Princess on the big screen?

I see lots of options. But even if it was, Xena was a massive hit for several years. I wouldnt care.

@moywar700 said:

@Gambler said:

@moywar700: I believe it but its not like there arent female lead movies out there. They make em all the time. Thelma and Louise, Kill Bill 1/2, Haywire, the Debt. There out there, they're getting made. I dont get why Wonder Woman isnt among em.

out of the ones you listed, only kill bill did well. Despite this, hollywood didn't approve of action female leads.

I'm not debating which ones did good, just pointing out that they in fact make action movies with female leads. As much as the men, course not, but they still get made. You pointed out that Hollywood doesnt make a WW cause they dont make action movies with female leads, but they do. So I'm suspicious that there are other factors preventing her film from being made.

@Gambler: There's just something very goody goody about her character that I think they'd have a hard time putting on the big screen. She's not like Marvel's Thor or Hercules who have a variety of character flaws that make them relatable. How do you make her interesting?

@Malonius: she has potential to have very interesting story,just like a xena warrior princess with god like power.

the problem is that she isn't trerated right,always in shadow,or being treated like a punching bag,but if writters are consistent with her power level,and make her part of important event,and writte her villans properly too,then she can have good stories,and make a good movie too.

@Malonius: You skip her origin. Maybe reference it a couple times but you make the movie with the intention of exploring her origin in the sequel. I would have made her movie in the same way the new Superman movie looks to be headed. The lost warrior trying to re-discover her calling. Use that Hulk opening from the old school series where he's hitchhiking but swap in Wonder Woman. Tan jacket, duffle bag slung over her shoulder, looking for something, or someone. Maybe have her meet up with I-Ching and have her learn some martial arts skill cause her powers have been stripped. I'm not a script writer but I would stay away from the more Clash of the Titans theme with all the Gods and stuff in the first movie. But thats me.

@gokuwarrior: I agree for the most part

@Gambler: a movie is goo,but i was talking about comic,they need to promote her properly in comics first,make her power level consistent,so she can be what she is supposed to be,a powerhouse,not a helper or the punching bag,then add a good story and you have very good comics,well balanced,her power level needs to be written consistently,and have the help of a good story,then she has to be treated with respect and relevance outside her comic,that's what her and her villans need,first good treatment in the comics,the movie can come after that.

@Gambler: Saving the Clash of the Titans stuff might not be a bad idea. Maybe the market is oversaturated and you wouldn't want Wonder Woman looking like a female Thor. The Immortals and Wrath of the Titans did make a decent amount of money counting global box office and Thor was a hit, though.

@gokuwarrior said:

@Erik: they rebot new 52 deathstroke?.

Kinda sorta.

@Malonius: I thought Immortals was a massive flop? I dont know for sure but its seems like it got killed by the critics and cost more to make then it brought in. Might be wrong though. As long as its good and actually put together with the intention of making a great film I dont care what theme the use. Its overdo though, we're entitled to a damn WW movie.