I love Tim Drake. He's tied for my favorite DC character with Hal Jordan and Wally West. And I have one question:Could he be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family? Now, this is my OPINION, but I say yes, he will be. What does that mean? Well, In terms of Bat-Fam deadliness, it goes Bruce-Dick-Jason. Jason beat tim many times as Robin, but he has gotten a lot better. I think right now, he is almost as good as Jason. And for the Damian fans, Tim demolished him in Red Robin #14, as he always held back before. His intelligence exceeds ALL members of the Bat-Fam, including Bruce. Bruce said Tim was smarter than him before. Dick said so as well, also adding that he was a better Robin than Dick, and he will probably be a better Batman too. NOw, Tim is also the most like Bruce. They are the two smartest-the World's Two Greatest Detectives- and use that in their most difficult battles. All members have experienced unspeakable tragedy- but Tim has had the most. His parents were killed when he he was 13-15, which means he bonded with them more than all the other members. His two best-friends(Superboy and Kid Flash), his girlfriend(Spoiler), a love interest(The Old Lynx), Bruce, Darla Aquista, and some other people. His skill with the Bo Staff is unrivaled, as he is the best Stick Fighter on Earth. He is also very agile, of course, not as agile as Dick or Jason, but quite agile. He is very Tech-Savvy, and his skill is comparable with that of Oracle's. He fought and gained the upper hand in a fight with Dick as well. Ra's Al Ghul now believes Tim is his worthy successor, not Bruce, and called him Detective. He outsmarted Ra's, took on the Russian Unternet, defeated the Council of Spiders while protecting Tam, is practically unstoppable if he has prep before a battle, outsmarted Lady Shiva, created a systematic way of stopping all criminals with The Hit List, and has done all this... at the age of 17. I believe, when Tim is older, he will be the greatest Martial Artist, Detective (He already is), Hacker, and Batman. He will be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family.
Tim Drake
Character » Tim Drake appears in 3315 issues.
At the age of nine, Timothy Drake cleverly deduced the identities of Batman and Robin. Four years later, after the death of Jason Todd, Tim convinced Batman that he should be the new Robin. He would later become leader of Young Justice.
Tim Drake-Deadliest member of the Bat-Family?
I'm not sure about him becoming the greatest martial artist, but Tim is formidable enough to be a significant threat now and a imminent threat in the future, IMO.
This also should be in the Tim Drake board, not off-topic.
Tim Drake (after Dick) is the next Batman, if he takes it up, he will be the best Batman ever, he is that talented
1 correction Cass Cain comes before Dick and Jason on the Baat fighting scale, but other than that i'm in complete agreement
Having written my own blog on why I love Tim Drake, I actually like the idea of being to comment on someone else's.
Tim is Batman as a teenager. Sure, he might not have the sheer martial arts prowess that Cassandra or Dick has, but he's got two of the most pivotal aspects of Bruce Wayne down - the detective ability and the emotionally detached persona. No one else can detach themselves quite like Tim can (aside from Bruce, obviously) and that is where Tim is set apart from the rest of the Bat family. Damien is a little twat and doesn't fall into the same league as the big three (Dick, Jason and Tim) so I'm not including him. Dick's got too much heart to be Batman, in my opinion. He wasn't never meant to be Batman, he was always meant to be his own man. Jason would slander the name of Batman by being a murderous psycho, plus his intellect is not on the same level as Tim's. That leaves Tim. As Bruce said in Hush - "Tim wants to be the World's Greatest Detective, and from what I've seen, he will be someday".
"You are a very dangerous man, Timothy." - Ra's al Ghul
Oh yeah, I HATE the Steph/Tim relationship. I just don't think they were meant to be. Lynx and Red Robin, on the other hand, is awesome.
When it comes to fighting, I still think he's the second weakest (Damian<Tim<Jason<Dick<Cassandra<Bruce). But when it comes to intelligence, he can be as scary as Bruce. The last issue of Red Robin pretty much proved that he can be capable of becoming a villain or the next Batman if he decided to be.
@RainEffect: Isn't it kind of weird that you hate the Bruce Selina (I agree by the way) relationship but you like the Tim Lynx relationship when Lynx is described as being Tim's catwoman? not trying to start a fight or anything just find it knid of wierd
I think if Tim tries hard enough, his Martial Arts skills can climb astronomically. Like I said, his skills with the Bo Staff are pretty insane. And, in one of the last few issues of Robin, Tim fought Cassandra after being worn down by a fight with 20+ ninjas, and although the fight was never resolved, it was looking like a stalemate. Add the worn down factor, and his prowess as Red Robin, the order would go Bruce-Dick-Tim-Cass. And, in Red Robin #16 or 17, Tim makes Cass look kind of foolish. Tim's fighting skills increase with his intelligence, as his main form of fighting is deducing weak points and HOW to fight particular enemies with data and statistics on them. So when Tim's intelligence gets him to the point where he's the smartest, couldn't it be logical to assume he'll be the deadliest fighter? Just a thought. Let me know what you guys think on the Fighting=Intelligence for Tim topic.
@WhiteLightning said:
I love Tim Drake. He's tied for my favorite DC character with Hal Jordan and Wally West. And I have one question:Could he be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family? Now, this is my OPINION, but I say yes, he will be. What does that mean? Well, In terms of Bat-Fam deadliness, it goes Bruce-Dick-Jason. Jason beat tim many times as Robin, but he has gotten a lot better. I think right now, he is almost as good as Jason. And for the Damian fans, Tim demolished him in Red Robin #14, as he always held back before. His intelligence exceeds ALL members of the Bat-Fam, including Bruce. Bruce said Tim was smarter than him before. Dick said so as well, also adding that he was a better Robin than Dick, and he will probably be a better Batman too. NOw, Tim is also the most like Bruce. They are the two smartest-the World's Two Greatest Detectives- and use that in their most difficult battles. All members have experienced unspeakable tragedy- but Tim has had the most. His parents were killed when he he was 13-15, which means he bonded with them more than all the other members. His two best-friends(Superboy and Kid Flash), his girlfriend(Spoiler), a love interest(The Old Lynx), Bruce, Darla Aquista, and some other people. His skill with the Bo Staff is unrivaled, as he is the best Stick Fighter on Earth. He is also very agile, of course, not as agile as Dick or Jason, but quite agile. He is very Tech-Savvy, and his skill is comparable with that of Oracle's. He fought and gained the upper hand in a fight with Dick as well. Ra's Al Ghul now believes Tim is his worthy successor, not Bruce, and called him Detective. He outsmarted Ra's, took on the Russian Unternet, defeated the Council of Spiders while protecting Tam, is practically unstoppable if he has prep before a battle, outsmarted Lady Shiva, created a systematic way of stopping all criminals with The Hit List, and has done all this... at the age of 17. I believe, when Tim is older, he will be the greatest Martial Artist, Detective (He already is), Hacker, and Batman. He will be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family.
I have adressed Ra's and Shiva as well as Bruce's comment.
If statements mattered then i guess Bane is the second most dangerous man on Earth and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!@WhiteLightning said:
and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
@RainEffect said:
@entropy_aegis said:Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!@WhiteLightning said:
and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
LOL
No, Tim lacks Bruce's paranoia and ridiculous levels of forethought, which is crucial to being Batman.
But even then, Tim will never be as good a Batman as Bruce Wayne, because he lacks Bruce's tragedy. Yes, Tim has had a tragic life, but he himself is not tragic. Bruce Wayne is Batman, he's the most dangerous member of the Bat-family, and he always will be. Offhand conjecture based on a few lines in a Robin solo series won't change that.
@entropy_aegis said:
@RainEffect said:
@entropy_aegis said:Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!@WhiteLightning said:
and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.LOL
Did he get banned?
@RainEffect said:
Having written my own blog on why I love Tim Drake, I actually like the idea of being to comment on someone else's.
Tim is Batman as a teenager. Sure, he might not have the sheer martial arts prowess that Cassandra or Dick has, but he's got two of the most pivotal aspects of Bruce Wayne down - the detective ability and the emotionally detached persona. No one else can detach themselves quite like Tim can (aside from Bruce, obviously) and that is where Tim is set apart from the rest of the Bat family. Damien is a little twat and doesn't fall into the same league as the big three (Dick, Jason and Tim) so I'm not including him. Dick's got too much heart to be Batman, in my opinion. He wasn't never meant to be Batman, he was always meant to be his own man. Jason would slander the name of Batman by being a murderous psycho, plus his intellect is not on the same level as Tim's. That leaves Tim. As Bruce said in Hush - "Tim wants to be the World's Greatest Detective, and from what I've seen, he will be someday". "You are a very dangerous man, Timothy." - Ra's al Ghul Oh yeah, I HATE the Steph/Tim relationship. I just don't think they were meant to be. Lynx and Red Robin, on the other hand, is awesome.
I agree with every thing you say
Tim Drake: potential to mentally surpass Bruce
Damian Wayne: potential at becoming a better martial artist than Bruce
Dick Grayson: potential to be Bruce
Jason Todd: got replaced by Tim as Robin and Damian as the Bat family's psychopath black sheep. Of no further use in assigning a bat emblem on his chest.
Bruce Wayne: got lazy with contraceptives. Definitive Batman.
FTBB makes a good point from a literary perspective Tim isn't a tragic hero so much as a hero with a tragic past. It felt like in RR#25 they took steps to change that by having Tam point out Tim's tragic flaw something he always lacked and something that you need to technically be a tragic hero but even then Tim's tragic flaw isn't as good as Bruces and it may not even still stand post reboot. Looking at tragic flaws is really intresting with the bat family and Tim's is the least engaing of the three i've seen
Bruce: Obsession
Dick: Optomism(something along those lines it's what james gordon jr manipulated at the end of detective comics)
Tim: his plans work but hurt his friends......something like that
Jason and Damian have one to but i don't know enough about their charecters to really guess
I love Tim Drake, he's my favorite of the Bat-Kicks and right up there with my love for Bruce. That's why this type of thinking "he's the best at everything" worries me. If he's the best at everything then he's not really distinct anymore. That's why I don't mind it when writers downplay his combat abilities in favor of his strategic/deductive abilities. I think that's more definitive Tim than playing him up as a Lady Shiva-trained martial artist.
Ultimately, any member of the Bat-Family could defeat any other member in the right fight depending on the needs of the story. Hence why we have Babs able to rough up ex-Batman Dick Grayson over in Batgirl. Just assume that they're all in the same "tier" of martial abilities (except maybe Cassandra being one tier above, although she has her own limitations and possibly doesn't exist anymore) and that should be enough.
@FadeToBlackBolt: Ummm.... Read Red Robin #26 and your comment of his forethought will change. Read Red Robin: The Hit List and your comment on paranoia will change.
@luckydomino1: Why? I'm expressing my OPINION aren't I? God, people are real dic*s on the Internet sometimes.
no...as of now, i say he's the least deadliest, i think Bruce, Dick, Cass and Jason have much more fighting ability, i see Damien over shadowing him very soon, the only one i see Tim being better than, is Steph
@The Stegman: also from what i'v seen barbra but he really solidly beat damian so unless they skip at least 2 years worth of training damian won't even be a challenge any time soon
Tim is definitely awesome but calling him the "deadliest" member of the Bat Family isn't right. Kind of like calling Sea Turtles the deadliest marine creature. Tim doesn't kill people.
Has DC done any future stories where Tim is Batman?
@Pokeysteve: yes in Titans of Tommorow he used the gun that killed Bruces parents to kill all the villans in Gotham the story opens with him shooting Dula Dent in the face, When they redid Titans of Tommorow Tim was potrayed as a the same corrupt Batman except this time he basically lead Justice League Unlimmited , and in Red Robin Tim as Batman was shown as a possible future but not elaborated on for more than a panel, intrestingly enough his bat suit resembled the Batman Beynond suit. DC hasn't really done any otherworld books potraying Tim as Batman but i hope they will
@Pokeysteve: 1.) Ya, he was Batman and very DEADLY.
2.) I never said he was the deadliest, of course he isn.t,,, now. I'm talking in the future, when he's at his prime.
3.) I never said he will, but if he did (hypothetically, of course) he would be, inthe future.
@The Stegman: I would have to disagree with you on that, given Tim's enormous talent, but it's your opinion, and I'm not anyone to say you're wrong, so...
@The Stegman: Tim's my favorite Robin but i definetly expect Damian to be able to beat him in the distant future but no time soon and i'm not familair with either pre wheel chair Babs or current her so i don't know about before but from what i saw in number 1 she seemes way to offbalance to really beat anyone from the bat family but i stopped reading after number 1 so i don't know how she faired against Dick
@BlackArmor: Thank you for the info.
@WhiteLightning said:
@Pokeysteve: 1.) Ya, he was Batman and very DEADLY.
2.) I never said he was the deadliest, of course he isn.t,,, now. I'm talking in the future, when he's at his prime.
3.) I never said he will, but if he did (hypothetically, of course) he would be, inthe future.
I'm focused on the word itself. Deadliest. The word implies he kills people. Punisher is deadly while Spider-Man is not. I'm just nit picking English and don't disagree with your post. Someday Tim will be a major Bad Ass. I hope he has better people skills than Bruce haha.
@The Stegman: I do too, but Tim's fighting skills have been escalating enormously since he became Red Robin. And am I the only one who was enraged when Tim lost his Robin role, but now likes him more as Red Robin?
@ Pokeysteve He will definitely be a MAJOR BAD ASS, and I hope he bests everyone, not only Bruce.
let me finish kanye west and calm down you do know these are fictinal characters right he may be the smartest but hes got a long way if he wants to be the strongest
@The Stegman: Uggghhh... If I hear anyone say Joker Jr one more time, I'm gonna go around and burn every copy of Batman Beyond Return of the Joker I can find!
@luckydomino1 One, it's my opinion, you can't say anyone's opinion is wrong unless you have factual evidence to support your contradiction, which you can't, because I'm talking about when he reaches his prime, not NOW, so any evidence you have is in the present, and can't be used in representation of prediction or advancement, because I never once said he's the strongest now, I said if he continues to escalate like this, I BELIEVE he WILL be. And two, yes, they are fictional characters, but why make characters and stories unless they mean something to you and hold a special place in your heart, because Tim got me into comics, and I'm grateful for the opportunity he (meaning the people who write him) gave me to be able to immerse in a culture of art and literature where the IMPOSSIBLE means POSSIBLE, so Tim holds a very special place in my hypothetical comic book heart, and I don't find it laughable at all. And finally, I HATE Kanye West, he's an arrogant asshole douchebag, and you saying my blog is laughable is being way more of douche bag than me snapping back in defense of my article.
@shadowjax: Uh? Tim wasnt a blank slate, not even when conceived. I dont even know where you could possibly defend that moronic statement.
@whitelightning: nah bro, jason has gotten alot better and the order rn is
Cassie/JPV(maybe not paul but hes there)>bruce>dick/jason>tim>Damien
The thing is tim aint gonna surpass jason anytime soon
-hood
@shadowjax: That doesnt mean blank slate, just means normal kid, with a normal background. Like Batman, Superman, Flash, Flash, Captain America, Cyborg, etc. Regular kid that encountered something that changed everything forever. Its a pretty common trope.
His mayor defining trait among the batfamily is being the brain, i agree. Much like jasons defining trait is being angry (which he isnt anymore), or dick being the acrobat, or stephanie being the klutz.
They are not solely defined by said trait, its just the one that comes to light the most.
Tim is a fairly complex individual, what defines his struggle is that he has a need to do the right thing tho. Like spiderman or superman, he will put his life on hold to do the right thing. This is his main motivation. While dick does it for the adventure and because its everything he knows, and jason does it because he wants to prove himself, and damian does it because he is scared of what he would become if he didnt try to be like batman.
He is pragmatic, selfless, and detached. He is a jerk, but to the one he is the biggest jerk to is himself, so its an endearing quality instead of one that puts the reader off. He is cautious because he is afraid of failure. But he isnt afraid of failing, he is afraid of disappointing Batman and Dick. They are the two people he cares the most about. Pressure and hardship drives him to improve, and he improves so fast even Bruce and Ras admire him. He starts as the least capable robin, and through hard work and perseverance he becomes the best.
Welp, it seems like the latest Detective Comics makes this whole thing pretty clear. Tim at Bruce's age can basically take down the entire Batfam single-handedly and hold his own against f*cking Doomsday. He may be a borderline-evil anti-hero but he's definitely the deadliest of the bunch. Personally, I'm not wild about the fact that future Tim goes so dark and semi-evilish, because it feels like a betrayal of his core character, but the dude is a stonecold badass.
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