Been a good run ppl

Hillarious as can get, although Raven's got nothing with her origin on the sheer hillarity of Lara's "earthquake origin". Been a fun time of laughs and giggles. Cool times.

Superman/Lois and Wonder woman/ Steve Trevor are better pairings in my opinion because the fact that those couples are very different make the story more interesting and makes Superman and Wonder woman look more human rather than gods who are too far out of reach to compare ourselves to. I hope at some point it will go back to those relationships.

it's already happening.

http://tinbetto.deviantart.com/art/Wonder-Woman-Superman-211343980

Link- https://www.instagram.com/p/BIKWI_VgmVa/

Dead Horse Flogging People.

@zariusii: dude if people liked the pairing then they liked the pairing don't go out your way to be a douche

Still the best couple in comics the zest in any great story the world pauses and takes a breath for any good writer can work magic with these characters.

In all the worlds and dimensions we know that this couple not only exist but thrives and has children and a legacy.

When one door closes another opens when one way falls another comes to light and when one writer sits it out many others cry out and say. I see a better way a stronger way a super way. A couple that inspires stories that creates epic battles that gives you a song and makes you Wonder just what it is about the women that makes you wish to see more.

Why did they stop writing this comic when it begged for more.

When fans said I no longer wonder if but yes give me more. Create a novel experience and let me get lost in days of reading.

In a world where anything can happen and you get to see it all go down.

Superman/Wonder Women the couple of Tomorrow.

http://jetcomics.deviantart.com/

You know what they say about tomorrow. It never comes.

Peter and MJ they ain't

@zariusii: I said it 10 days ago and I'm saying it now don't go out your way to be a douche people like the pairing so leave it at that

Thank you and it is true , for all things I do not like the female Thor but some do so more power to them. However they can make two comics one with Thor that we know and love and the other with the female Thor or aka Jane... that others have what ever they do.

I have been reading superman forever and a day. So to have a breath of fresh air in a stagnant comic world is nice and fresh. The universe is huge the stories off the chart the understanding that there is room for just about anything from Superman/wonder women to Superman/Maxima for those whom love red heads.

It comes down to stories and what you want to see in them.

If they never open up to knew ideas then they will never write good stories never ever do anything but give us bad ending after bad ending and who invest in that for is it not and investment of money and time.

So when I was about to buy back issues of this title and sit down for a good read and see they have given up and tossed in the creative towel to say.

Then I have to wonder if they will abandon ship on all stories long before they get good , long before they show potential and long before you say what in the world are you doing and you never took the task to heart.

Where was the exploring each other the thoughts and the feel of life you just never got the real chance to dance under a sky full of stars wishing on the impossible because writers did not have the ability to dream that big.

Could not fathom on that level.

A story about Superman who was not super enough to get the job done and a story about a women whom lost her wonder and the writers gave up.

Then they gave a story that is halfway started not even trying and want us to jump in and say oh...this is good...

This will replace what I loved...

I say again if you have a fan base you can do more then one comic.

Superman/Wonder Women can exist outside the rest as some stories with all characters should.

One thing that messes up Marvel is they try to make everything fit into the same universe.

You just kill the spice of the story.

That makes you want to not read it.

Bring back that charm in comics that story is first and let the story work the magic that opens the mind and lets your breath fresh idea after fresh idea.

Tomorrow may never come but in comics people come back from tomorrow all the time and Superman is the man of tomorrow.

I leave you with that and hope you Wonder just what it is that lets you say.

Possible is in the eye of the beholder.

Tales of life...

I never thought I could till I did and once I did I wanted to do it again and again and again....

Impossible is done not stared at for if you dwell on it you will never do it.

Art from SM/WW #31

This guy sums it up nicely.

I am so glad the Thread is still active dropped so much DC since the break up and death of new 52 supes.

Your loss. DC have been killing it with Lois, Clark, and Jon lately. Supes/Diana never achieved the sales success they have. Just stating facts.

IIRC Lois and Clark was doing cancellation numbers.

Ok i read Trinity what the hell is Diana saying he feelings no longer are true? Da flip all those feelings she had when she went to find hera's orbs all gone well dang.

not really i'm digging Lucifer so i'm good. Lois clark and Jon got nothign on that family.

Did anyone else find it really weird that Diana never grieved that Clark, the man she was supposedly in love with, died? I would have been satisfied to have one scene with the rebirth Superman where she tells him it hurts to look at him as he looks exactly like her just recently dead boyfriend.

I suppose DC higher ups just wanted to get rid of the new52 Superman as quickly as possible and erase the memory in the fans' mind.

Well she did in JLA. But with Jurgens and RUcka in charge, they didn't care for it so in order to have them on board they are letting them take it out. Rucka doing the most damage with his bullshit "fake memories" arc. Even if the SM/WW relationship never happened, Diana being the daughter of Zeus only brought more to the table and could have been cool to be expanded on.

It wasn't Doomsday that killed the Man of Steel this time, it was shit management that did him in.

@saintwildcard: yeah, we get another interpretation of Diana. Every new writer that comes on board changes her personality (and often her backstory). She has to be one of the least consistent major superheroes. Her's has to be the most dramatic change for Rebirth. For everyone else, it was a soft reboot. For Diana, it was as hard as a block of granite.

Even though I prefer pre52, I do feel a little bad for new52 Superman. DC really screwed him over during the last 5 years. Having the worst writer in the company, Scott Lobdell, being head Superman writer for a majority of the time, removing Supe's supporting cast, bungling the Diana romance; DC really did a terrible job of managing the Superman brand. And after all that, new52 Superman never got redemption; he got killed, replaced and the love of his life forgets about him.

With how DC seems to feel about new52 Superman, I wouldn't be surprised if this is one death in comics that actually sticks.

I don't think it gets more drastic than killing you off and replacing you with an older version who has a kid and a family. Aside from New 52, I don't know much about DIana, but from the looks of her fanbase, that does seem to be the case. Since the running joke is that they can't even decide if they want her with pants or without.

Yup, his entire family was broken (Supergirl was written angry and ran away from Superman), Lois was pretty much useless, and Lobdell was given too much power (he even wrote Superboy, and pucked up his origin). But even JOhns is partially to blame, since he wrote D-Bag Superman in JL War (which by the time CLark got the armor suit, he had toned down the brashness, and even then Grant didn't write him like a JOck) and then put no effort into how he got Diana and CLark together since it was his intention to break them apart. Oh god... I can't believe that never occured to me, Diana truly has not only moved on, but they are ramping up to her relationship with him possibly being a hoaz.... ugh, kill me now.

Even if he does come back, it can't be the same. The introduction of Jon makes bringing him back near impossible. And honestly... I don't think he should come back. Aside from Greg Pak, I don't think anyone else got what Grant was going for. I don't want him to return unless you have someone who actually loves this version and has a plan for him. I hate myself for saying this but..... I think Max Landis could possibly do a good job within the guidelines of what he was, cus if left to his own imagination, he went and made him a hipster and Jimmy a gay black dude. My life goal is to one day write a Superman cartoon based on his New 52 origin, since I think it's the best for adaptation to get a younger audience

Hello everyone! If anyone is interested, I've made this fun quiz on Superman where you can test your knowledge and challenge your friends :) #https://youtu.be/G6GTn8sAujk

Art by Pop Mhan from the upcoming lost issues

Just my s#!t up, fam...

Hmmm? What in particular are you responding do?

@saintwildcard: The entire Superman debacle that resulted in The Super League becoming Final Days of Superman.

this just broke my heart

Could someone explain to me what has happened between SMxWW ?

I've made my peace with it. Got my Refund from Johns for Rebirth and stopped buying comics (although this also has to do with me wanting to convert to trades, but there are very few Rebirth books that I want anyway). In due time New 52 Superman will have his redemption or the concept behind him will come back (a younger Superman starting from scratch). Revenge is a dish best served cold comrade.

Rebirth Happened. DC killed off New 52 Superman so they could bring back the old model with his family. And Rucka is currently trying to cut out all of Wonder WOman'shistory and will keep what he liked intact, one thing he probably won't be keeping the SM/WW relationship, since he's been outspoken about not liking it in the past.

Probably one of the best drawings of an SM/WW son. There aren't many, and the ones there are look lame. That being said, in my head canon, their Son wouldn't wanna dress up like his old man. Reminds me of the one by Brett Booth, but it was of a daughter

Well, that and they need movie synergy, as Steve's the love interest in the WW movie. I think it's way past due for Trevor to be WW's love interest again anyway, he's probably the one major love interest that got a big shaft for almost thirty years, which sort of paved the way for the pointless Diana/Clark 'shipping in the first place. Now that he's on the field again (as well as Clark being married to Lois), this can thankfully end.

Rebirth has been received pretty overwhelmingly and you're more flustered that the DC equivalent of Ben Riley isn't getting page time? They're not going to bring back a failed concept. The old ways are currently working. Also, do try to check out the other Rebirth comics, most of them are pretty good, especially Green Arrow and Cyborg.

Yeah, cus we all need that Lex Luthor, murder happy Batman and mopey bitch Superman in the comics right? Also, the comics trying to be like the movies is why alot of people have issues with the Marvel comics.

*sigh* Why must you continue to bash the SM/WW relationship in a response to me, when you know I've wrecked you in the past when it comes to the value in it?

Them failing the concept only proves to me that they are morons and old fools, you seemed to like the pitch which revolved around New 52 Superman. It;s like when the Golden Age Writers got replaced by the fans who grew up, in the Silver Age, they wrote better stories than their predecessors. They ruined Grant's amazing set up (Johns also having blood on his hands) and decided to bury it. As for Revenge, I do mean it will be by my hand, you can only trust yourself when it comes to these matters. In the words of Naruto "I will become HOkage! Believe it!

As for Rebirth, very little books interest me, Chinese Superman seems interesting, I just hope the Old Man doesn't show up cus he ruined Aquaman with his appearance which was a book that I wanted to get. And WW being Zeus's daughter getting retconned will assure that I stay clear of that title.

@saintwildcard: "Why must you continue to bash the SM/WW relationship in a response to me, when you know I've wrecked you in the past when it comes to the value in it?"

I know I'm gonna regret asking but just out of a morbid curiosity what value do you see in SM/WW?

Glad you asked. Well you see, it really comes down to how you write these two and what history they have. But I first want to get one thing out of the way about the CLois relationship, you see one of the most common flub ups by Clois fans is them referring to Lois as Clark's anchor to Humanity. What they don't realize is, that this argument is counter productive. You see, just like how MoS pointed out, Clark is a case of nature vs nurture, and nurture won. The thing I find great about Clark is just how human he is and thereby he doesn't need an anchor or a reminder. That's what the Daily Planet is for and it's why he uses Clark Kent to interact with us. His upbringing in Smallville is what makes him human, not Lois.

Now, as for the SM/WW relationship, let me break down each ones history and what they get out of it.

The History

Clark: For Clark Growing up, I like to think that while he was a fun loving kid he at times would feel out of place. Maybe once while playing with a friend he hurt him and since then he's always tried to hold back. So part of him is a bit ashamed of his own power and he's never really been able to full embrace his own power. He'll put on a strong face and it will only be a small part of him, but he'll feel alone.

Diana: Diana is more outgoing and embraces individuality. She's not afraid to put herself out there and as an Amazon she likes to train herself to her fullest. But when she gets to the modern world, she have a hard time adjusting to how it works.

Why They Are Attracted to each other

Clark: Clark is attracted to strong women. It's why he loved Lana Lang (Greg Pak), and could have feelings for Lois. So Diana would be his type. Diana helps him fully embrace what he is and makes him feel like he's not alone. Diana would be the kind of girl who'd make Clark try new things and fully see the wonders of the world in ways that he never did.

Diana: Only men she's known have been Gods, and they tend to be jerks or full of themselves. Here comes a "God" who is humble and a nice funny guy. He more than Steve. is up to the task of showing Diana the ropes for how to interact with humanity, since he's the same as her. Steve teaching Diana is like a white guy showing a black guy how to live in the south, be much better if an other black guy showed them how since they've been through it in the same way they will.

TLDR- Clark helps Diana adjust to society and be a better human, while Diana helps Clark be a better hero. They are each others halves, and they both grow because of their relationship.

Bonus

Office Space Romance: The only valid way I would take a CLois romance happening, if it's just an office place romance that turns into more. But if that's the case, Clark and DIana also have one, it;s just that they are in tights instead of office wear.

Child- Jon seems to be the big draw right now, and while I have no problem with the character, I do think that Clark and Diana having a kid is much more interesting. It be like Sky High, but with the kid always having his powers. The pressure of being the child to the worlds greatest heroes and not being seen are your own person, but rather the accomplishments of his parents. Plus the dual rouges he;s getting, both magic and aliens makes for interesting action.

Dichotomy: The way the contrast can also make for some good stories/chemistry. Clark comes from a race of scientists, while Diana a race of warriors. Clark is Sci Fi, while Diana is Magic.

Colored version of an art piece done by Jackson Herbert

Personally, it skeeves me out only cus it feels way too real and way to personal.

You've done no such thing and you never will. History and audience reaction are on my side. People see more value in Lois and Clark.

And calling writers and Supes "old" does nothing but convince me you're an ageist and I have no time for ignorance like that.

Okay then, why is it when I destroy your little "Anchor" argument, you never respond? But please, do feel free to point out in an objective argument why CLois is way more valuable than CLiana.

Don't confuse preference with objective arguments. Also, the fact that you have to rely on "well other people like it too" is a weak leg to stand on buddy.

I called them old fools yes, but that's after their failure to write New 52 Superman properly (there are also editorial problems as well). Despite your hissy fits and hatred for it, it can be done. Only a bad blacksmith blames the metal.

To be fair, has anyone ever been given a real choice outside of Lois for longer than 30 years? Because Lois and Clark has been the default for close to 70, give or take. After that long of being fed one idea over and over again, is it any surprise that there is no alternative could be received as well. Lois Lane basically has a monopoly on this idea of who is Supermans' perfect soul mate because any other idea is new or considered blasphemy. In an alternate universe, where Superman and Wonder Woman was the norm for 70 years, I'm sure people would look at a Lois and Clark pairing and go "Who? The reporter? What's the fun in that? He's already saved her a bunch of times. Them being together adds nothing to their relationship."

Lois Lane was specifically built to be paired with Superman. She does that. Same way Doomsday was built specifically to kill Superman. He did that, and they both suffer from the same problem. They've succeed at that (give or take). Now all she has to do is raise Jon. I don't see the fun in that, but then again, I'm not a daddy so who knows. Maybe it'll be amazing. But I've already read a book on Fatherhood. Was written by Bill Cosby. Good book. Don't need it in comic form with Superman.

The thing is, it's getting to a point where the people that grew up with Lois and Clark in the 60s and 80s and whatnot are the ones still dictating who Superman spends his downtime with. And it's not just the fans, but it's the writers that are in fact those people that grew up with Lois and Clark. So of course they probably don't want to change what they grew up with.

I mean, heck, we've seen The Eradicator, Cyborg Superman, and Doomsday. The only things missing now are Pre-Flashpoint Steel (who, judging by this new armor in Superwoman, may well have already succeeded) and "Superboy" (who may have done it off-panel, and like much of Rebirth, we'll never know) murdering their Post-Flashpoint counterparts (or Doctor Manhattan or Geoff Johns, or whoever the heck is in charge) and seamlessly replacing their younger selves with nobody the wiser. Because that's the slippery slope Rebirth has put the DCU on and I don't feel that shiz, not even a little bit.

I've been a fan of this ship since the Justice League cartoons, even though they were never official because Clark was with Lois. But Kingdom Come has shown that it can work and the stuff with Charles Soule was really really good. I do agree that maybe the setup for the relationship could've been different but the thing is that as personalities go for these two...I prefer the way they are now and if the current Superman and Wonder Woman end up in a relationship due to a breakup for Clark and Lois, (I mean they can't stay a married couple for forever. You know that's gonna run its course because it has in the 90's and now they're trying it again for some reason with a kid this time....even though I actually like Jon.) I would be fine with the Superfam and having to raise Jon together like that, I'd be ok with it.

And at the end of the day, I still have my HC's so it's not really the end of the world. SuperWonder will come back in some fashion through Elseworlds most likely or maybe canon in 3-5 years hopefully.

I find it odd that DC keeps pushing out SM/WW merch even with Rebirth being a hit for them and all writers scrambling to get rid of any traces of SM/WW. Obviously it's done for monetary reasons and I think it's mostly Hot Topic asking for the rights to sell it, but it's a bit shocking to me that it's such a hot seller for them even to this day. Like I got it when it barely came out it was a hot new thing, but it's been years. Quite interesting

Why would Clark and Diana take up care of Jon? Do you seriously think Lois is so career-minded that she would neglect her son? Get real pal. They've teased break-ups with Lois and Clark in the past and they've never stuck. DC aren't going to risk bad headlines by separating them, especially now that they're looking after a kid. This is'nt Kramer vs Kramer/Kent vs Kent. Rebirth is about hope and optimism, not despair and broken families edgelord. Your selfish need for the "power couple" should never sow any kinds of seeds for that.

They are "trying it again" because fans voted with their wallets and protested the abysmal S/WW pairing so much that they had no choice but to step up Lois and Clark and bring their union to the next level. Why deny people what they want to keep a proven minority happy?

And in today's issue of Wonder Woman, Diana makes it perfectly clear that she considered her relationship with N52 Superman an "uncomplictated and simple" fling, it was never a romance, she even admits she's TERRIBLE at romance.

They're going to explore WW's bi-curious side in future, so don't expect SS/WW to be canon in five years or a considerably long time. Stick to Elseworlds in the meantime.

So I just got word of what the Lost Issues of SM/WW are going to be. I don't wanna give anything away, but it is a complete, albeit short, story on its own. So it's not gonna be like something incomplete which was my worry since the arc after Truth was gonna be a Super League Event. It'll be out in the last trade of SM/WW I think.

So now I know the full scope of the Lost Issues. To put it bluntly, it's

So glad this fanfiction couple is over

@saintwildcard said:

I find it odd that DC keeps pushing out SM/WW merch even with Rebirth being a hit for them and all writers scrambling to get rid of any traces of SM/WW. Obviously it's done for monetary reasons and I think it's mostly Hot Topic asking for the rights to sell it, but it's a bit shocking to me that it's such a hot seller for them even to this day. Like I got it when it barely came out it was a hot new thing, but it's been years. Quite interesting

I'll make it even for you, Superman and Wonder Woman are super hero icons, their merch sells independently so it will obviously sell when they're collectively paired together especially since both genders are represented and both are supers. It's not rocket science and it's not proof of their relationship's strength or demand.

Batman/Wonder Woman merch will sell just as much if not more so, Superman/Batman merch will also sell a lot and it's the same reason Superman/Wonder Woman sold copies. The characters are popular and successful, the relationship itself is a dismal failure, dont confuse the two.

I disagree with that logic. Just because two characters are popular, doesn't mean that merch of them making out if it doesn't makes sense to people in some way, will sell well enough for a huge chain to repeatedly make different pieces of merch for them over years. At best you may see some Lesbian Disney Princess fan shirts made from some websites.

If if's and but's were candies and nuts, we'd all have a marry Christmas. By SM/BM and BM/WW merch, do you mean merch of them making out? SM/BM making out may be huge in the Gay community, so maybe. As for BM/WW, dunno, but I think that it's mostly dudes who would be into that pairing, while the SM/WW is mostly girls (from the groups I've seen, and they are the ones who'd buy the most merch, so I doubt it). But nice of you to make this a D**k measuring contest. You mistook my post for gloating, when I'm honestly more perplexed/slightly amused.

It's not rocket science and it's not proof of their relationship's strength or demand.

I never said that, and my "Glass Half Full" personality wouldn't allow me to make such a claim. Well.... for Strenght. I think Kid Chipotle made a great point that I had escaped me when making that post, which is that SM/WW has been a thing teased throughout decades. Biggest splash being made with Kingdom Come, but DC is just barely getting around to whoring out and putting out as much merch as possible. So the thirsty audience is getting the water they so craved.

ALso, I think there must be some interest in a person to see those characters together for them to buy a shirt. As someone who hates the pairing, would you really buy a shirt of them making out just cus they are on it? So it's silly to suggest that people buy shirts of them making out just cus they like the two characters but have no interest in them together. It's not Rocket Science, it's Commerce 101. If it sells, there's a demand. And if it sells in different forms, it's a big demand.