How effective is telekinesis

Rachel Grey, Psylocke, Hope Summers and the real Jean Grey, not teen Jean Grey, all have telekinesis. How effective is there telekinesis ?

Jean Grey has no Phoenix

Against Kitty

If Kitty is phased, can Rachel, Psylocke, Hope or Jean use there telekinesis on her, can they moved her. They can throw things at her. If she phased though a wall or the ground. They can move the ground or wall. If they can't, can they beat her. Kitty did beat Emma in Astonishing X-Men. She proven herself against a telepath.

Against Storm

Storm is consider one of the most powerful X-Ladies, just behind Jean and maybe Magik. If Storm is fighting one of the ladies above. She throwing Lighting bolts or tornadoes at them. Could Jean, Psylocke, Rachel and Hope use there telekinesis on her.

What if Storm is shielding herself with her Tornadoes. Could any of the telepaths move her. If they can't, how can they beat her.

I mean if any of the telepaths fought Storm alone

Against Juggernaut and Against Apocalypse

I have seen Psylocke move Colossus quite easily with her telekinesis in X-Men Legacy. Can she and the other telepaths move the Juggernaut. I mean individually. If they were to fight him on there own.

Could they move Apocalypse too. If Jean was to fight Apocalypse, could she moved him. She can throw things at him. Can she actually moved him.

What do you guys think . Please share your views.

Storm at full force(full force of her winds and lightings) couldn't budge Legion's TK shield.

That time, Legion's TK was stronger than old Jean's TK.

Before jean died, I believe that Jean and Rachel's TK have become stronger than Legion's tk, so I think Rachel and jean can beat storm.

I'm not sure if hellion and Psylocke's tk would stand storm's attacks.

if they control matter to a molecular level then yes they can reach contact with kitty.

Storm has shown to deflect TK energies but it could go either way.

I don't care for juggs or apocalypse.

Well Hope Summers doesn't have TK, but:

I'm of the belief that Psylocke's TK blades can touch Kitty since their not entirely physical. Also if the Psychic is strong enough (Rachel or Jean) they can manipulate her molecules so she can't phase or mimic the effects of any of the many tech devises that have stopped her from phasing in the past.

Storm beats current Psylocke and at best draws Rachel but other wise she has no protection from any of them just yanking her out of the air. Storm beating Emma was cool, but unless the telekinetic just stands still behind a shield they'd beat her.....Rachel and Jean have enough strength/control to probably shield themselves and beat her at once.

Juggernaut can be moved....if he's standing still. But once he's in motion they can't stop him...maybe redirect him, but not stop him outright, he's magical and his power revolves around being unstoppable in motion.

Apocalypse....Well what exactly is stopping Apocalypse from being moved? Jean through Krakoa into space, so unless Apocalypse weighs more then Krakoa she can move him. The only outside factors are Celestial Tech and whatever form of Telekinesis Apocalypse himself might possess but those don't have any way of being factored into things. I don't see it happening on panel because he's just too bada$$ to be thrown across the sky, but we can't exactly measure TK vs Bada$$ness

Hope does have telekinesis, she had it in Cable and X-Force

I supposed a better question would be. Can Rachel, Jean or Psylocke beat Juggernaut. They need to remove his helmet, into order to beat him.

I supposed when it comes to Jean and Apocalypse. it's who has better telekinesis.

I think that in that case she just copied Cable's telekines, it's mentioned in issue 16

She used it again on Bishop in the Cable solo series. Doesn't she need to touch people, to copy there powers, in Cable and X-Force she didn't touch Cable when she was using telekinesis

When did I say that she has to touch people to copy their powers :p?

Psylocke stands a chance of beating him with very little TK, mostly with just speed and maneuverability.

For Jean and Rachel it would either be ridiculously easy, or extremely difficult. Theoretically they should be able to hover out of range and remove his helmet from a distance....but that's so easy i doubt it would work. But otherwise we've seen that a less powerful Jean can be trouble for Juggernaut momentarily:

As far as Apocalypse goes, he's probably stronger then Jean(if not by much) but he's got a laundry list of other powers (including healing) that make her or any of the others beating him unlikely.

No, Hope just mimics other peoples powersets without touching, when her and Cable fought the Reavers she even brings up how she used up the last of his TK at one point....which she wouldn't have to do if she had it on her own.

Pretty much agreed. My opinion is that a powerful telekinetic should be able to grab Kitty, it could pretty much go either way with Storm, and Storm has strained both Rachel's and Jean's TK before so the power she has been proven effective with TK/TP powered opponents, that Juggernaut can be effected by TK for a BFR but probably not much else, and I think Apoc would be hard for any of these characters to beat (though I think Jean's TK F'd Apoc up before) .

With Rachel in the World's End story Storm's winds were so strong that Rachel needed to be anchored against them to avoid getting blown away as she tried to use her telepathy. She couldn't do both TK/TP offense while defending herself. Also Storm's jovian pressure field strained Rachel's TK, who protected the Queen's maid from being crushed, and the strain from using their powers to these extreme levels caused both of these ladies to pass out.

Jean commented that her TK force field was barely holding up against the winds that Storm was throwing at Legion, and she has counter Candra's TK with her winds and concentrated her lightning on Candra's TK force field enough to create an opening so she could make their fight H2H.

When it comes to opponents with both TP/TK Storm has shown that she can create enough force against them that they have to put a lot of effort into defense and make them less effective for offensive attacks. May not necessarily work against even more powerful TK users but she has a good track record.

Against Kitty - agreed, molecular level TK could take her - so Jean and Rachel certainly. Psylocke is unlikely to have the necessary tk finesse.

Storm is an entirely different proposition. Strong telepathic defences - and getting stronger - there's a bit in X-Men recently where neither Rachel nor Betsy could detect her presence. Suggest monstrous telepathic defences. So its a TK v AK battle. Against Betsy - sorry Bets... you're done. Storm pwns Psylocke.

Storm Against Jean and Rachel however, this is an epic battle. No Phoenix Rachel has been shown to be lacking much of the power she once had. People always seem to forget this, Rachel spent almost all of her Feat-Making years with Phoenix boosters. She doesn't have that power level anymore... she's not going to be fighting in the vacuum of space against an Shi'ar Armada solo again. Storm recently (over the Karima incident) was clearly VERY confident in her ability to smack-down Rachel. I'd therefore believe in her confidence. Storm could take Rachel. Not easily, but she'd do it. Storm knows Rachel much better than Rachel knows Storm. The merest application of Storm's power - taking the air out of Rachel's lungs alone would be enough to win.

Jean is different again. She knows Storm at least as well as Storm knows her. Neither would want to really hurt the other. Full force battle here is so unlikely as to be a purely academic exercise. Jean certainly is more powerful. Storm is no slouch tho - and has a more diverse attacking skill set. Jean's forcefield vs Storm's winds during Legion Quest was also being supported by Iceman's ice-shield... so it would have buckled if not for the physical presence of the ice. Pre-death Jean was more powerful for sure of course. this one could go 50/50.

I thought jean's telepathy is powerful enough to pass through juggernaut's helmet.

jean/Rachel could also create an air tight forcefield around storm in blink. i'm sure this would not only make storm panic(claustrophobia) but also lose breath just like what rachel did to blob.

Among all the telekenetics i think it is Rachel who has shown creativity on the use of her tk.

She did get her TP through once, but it really only made him mad.

My question is what stops them from TK breaking one of Storms bones. I mean Jean has the whole morals thing, but Rachel's the type to rupture an organ to prove a point.

@koays: My question is what stops them from TK breaking one of Storms bones. I mean Jean has the whole morals thing, but Rachel's the type to rupture an organ to prove a point

Right, I agree. With Morals off, Rachel could telekenetically generate a force field and pull storms eyes and brain out of her head. the battle could be done in less than 5 seconds. storm could have hit rachel with lighting, only it would take some time to generate a lightning

@darthphoenix: That's my thing, Storm isn't instantly pulling out hurricane force winds, so unless Jean/Rachel just stand there for a minute i doubt this is going to become a Wind vs TK Shield fight.

Altering reality effective.

it really only depends on the story. Telekinesis is one of those powers that can allow someone to do virtually anything if the story calls for it, so the only real limitations of it are the limitations of the story and the writer's imagination.

(and I'm pretty sure teen Jean also has telekinesis.)

@darthphoenix: @koays: Storm's powers work just as quickly and effectively as any telepath being that her powers are psionic. Honestly, I don't know where all these comments about her powers taking time when she's generated effects in instaneous speeds on numerous occasions. One being an ecounter she had with Jean Grey....

Storm has also generated effects faster than superhumans like Rogue and Baroness could even react. So a quick draw will be in her favor not the psychics.

I would think TK is a pretty effective power. Seeing as how you could operate like Magneto by smashing or levitating and throwing objects of any kind. Using a shield and stopping projectiles while also being capable of flight.

@roddy010: Not nearly. We've seen countless times when a supposed surprise explosion or blast would've taken out a team of X-Men only to be stopped by a protective Psi Shield pulled out last minute.

Really Storms advantage comes from her ability to get out of range of a TK attack not from her speed. A strong gust of wind pulled out fast isn't close to the level of winds necessary to strain a Psi Shield. What it comes down too is whether a TK user can multitask and both protect and attack at once. Jean (by early Morrison) can do this easily, Rachel seems to be a stronger telepath then TK but even then Storm's got to get out of her range to justify not having her neck or spine snapped in while winning that fight.

@koays: The same can be said for any character with the proper defense mechanism under those circumstances be it a force field or any other type of energy fields or even wind domes. Storm once reversed an explosion savingYukio as well as Gambit making her powers just as effective and quick as tk. She does not need to run away to be a threat when she has the capability to match and overpower everyone on this list.

Gallery

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Notice how Storm walks up to her and KHTFO without even a scratch from tk.

So as you can see Storm definitely has the capabilities to counter tk as well as tp even in a quick draw. To say otherwise is clearly underestimating her abilities.

@roddy010: My comment about the Psi shield is in response to the belief that Storm is faster then the TK users shield.....which she simply isn't. A draw at best but even then, why isn't Storm having her throat crushed in the next second? Morals, unless she's out of range.

Note that Jean is only using her powers to stand up straight in that panel, she's not pushing back....and yet she's still able to stand. and that was way before Jean's last known (non phoenix) power level. Again the only way Storm wins against Jean is if Jean does nothing while Storm brings down hell. Which is what your suggesting.

Psylocke just can't win....her TK is literally all about brute strength (she hasn't even been shown doing more then slight levitation) and Storm is too versatile to just attempt to over power her.

For Rachel, her TK powers have eratic depictions. But keep in mind in the panel your showing...Rachel used telekinesis to alter her very DNA just because she thought she was a different species...why is it even a question that if Storm doesn't get far out of the way or kill her in the first 10 seconds Rachel could, and in the right mood WOULD, annihilate her in the 11th second. Rachel may not be able to match Storm with raw power....but keep in mind if that was Psylockes "moutain shattering TK" there wouldn't have been a room left, and obviously everyone was still standing so i'm assuming the Psi shield held.

This is my problem with Storm, the writers have made her a god level mutant capable of beating any opponent with just the wind or lightning.....despite the fact that if your fighting a mutant who can manipulate molecules....they'd probably use this ability instead of trying to beat you with outright force.

I won't get into how TP play into this, but Rachel has sent her consciousness across the galaxy, and done stuff Prof X hasn't done without Cerebro.....I don't see how Psi shields are even a factor?

@roddy010: would you mind telling me what issues those scans with rachel are? also the one with Candra if it isn't too much trouble :)

@koays: i wouldn't exactly call her a god level mutant with people like legion around .. but lightning tips the scales in her favor since it has been shown to have uncanny effects on TP/Tk. Charles established that her lightning creates a painful psychic backlash ... when she wasn't actively using her powers and that it becomes worse when they're active .. i don't really see her winning against jean ... they stalemate atleast (i guess?)

@koays:

My comment about the Psi shield is in response to the belief that Storm is faster then the TK users shield.....which she simply isn't. A draw at best but even then, why isn't Storm having her throat crushed in the next second? Morals, unless she's out of range.

I never said Storm was faster, but she is just as fast and has a better track record of effecting superhumans than the women on this list. My comment was in response to you and Darthphoenix's impression that her powers take time to manifest.

Note that Jean is only using her powers to stand up straight in that panel, she's not pushing back....and yet she's still able to stand. and that was way before Jean's last known (non phoenix) power level. Again the only way Storm wins against Jean is if Jean does nothing while Storm brings down hell. Which is what your suggesting.

And Storm was directing her attack at Legion and yet Jean had to use all her energy to anchor herself from it.

Psylocke just can't win....her TK is literally all about brute strength (she hasn't even been shown doing more then slight levitation) and Storm is too versatile to just attempt to over power her.

I can agree with this but Betsy has been getting more creative with the use of her tk as of late.

For Rachel, her TK powers have eratic depictions. But keep in mind in the panel your showing...Rachel used telekinesis to alter her very DNA just because she thought she was a different species...why is it even a question that if Storm doesn't get far out of the way or kill her in the first 10 seconds Rachel could, and in the right mood WOULD, annihilate her in the 11th second. Rachel may not be able to match Storm with raw power....but keep in mind if that was Psylockes "moutain shattering TK" there wouldn't have been a room left, and obviously everyone was still standing so i'm assuming the Psi shield held.

Candra can also manipulate molecules and shut off/turn on the mutant gene but Storm never gave her that luxury. Rachel won't be any different.

This is my problem with Storm, the writers have made her a god level mutant capable of beating any opponent with just the wind or lightning.....despite the fact that if your fighting a mutant who can manipulate molecules....they'd probably use this ability instead of trying to beat you with outright force.

Telekinesis is just another form of energy, in this case psionic energy. When a telekinetic uses their power they are releasing that energy to effect matter or other forms of energy. However, Energy can be disrupted by other forces such as wind (kinetic energy) and lightning (Electromagnetic energy). That's why most psychics find it hard to penetrate Storm's mind due to the extra electrical energy.

I won't get into how TP play into this, but Rachel has sent her consciousness across the galaxy, and done stuff Prof X hasn't done without Cerebro.....I don't see how Psi shields are even a factor?

Rachel is being ridiculed by Monet these days. I don't see her tp being a problem.

The one with Candra is unlimited X-men #7 and the scans with Rachel are from the days she was on Storm's XSE Xtreme X-men team.

Agreed. Storm has conjured full on tornadoes, downpours, and flash-freeze effects in the time it takes to blink (let alone lightning). Even with Magneto she created a tornado around him all in 1 panel (no build up time required). There really isn't a speed edge for the TK/TP users.

@martinceldFor the Rachel scans those are from the World's End story in Uncanny X-Men# 455 - 459 (Storm's XSE team days). I think the scans with Rachel are 456 or 457.

@roddy010:

Roddy i just need to say a few things lol

And Storm was directing her attack at Legion and yet Jean had to use all her energy to anchor herself from it.

Jean also comments on them "chocking" on the energies Legion is giving off, she is not just dealing with Storms winds, they were in a battle with Legion.

Candra can also manipulate molecules and shut off/turn on the mutant gene but Storm never gave her that luxury. Rachel won't be any different.

Candras ability to manipulate molecules is limited just like Selenes. The only reason she can turn off "mutant genes" is because she activated them, IIRC she can only use that power on people that she actually "gave" power to.

Telekinesis is just another form of energy, in this case psionic energy. When a telekinetic uses their power they are releasing that energy to effect matter or other forms of energy. However, Energy can be disrupted by other forces such as wind (kinetic energy) and lightning (Electromagnetic energy). That's why most psychics find it hard to penetrate Storm's mind due to the extra electrical energy.

Telepaths penetrate her mind just fine, they just sometimes have trouble doing certain things. Unlike Xavier, Jean has never had a problem with her passive electrically charged mind beyond sharing certain sensations. Jean and Storm had a girls night out all thanks to Jeans telepathy with no problem other then Jean not being able to access the part of her mind that would allow Jean to taste what Storm was eating, and that is usually because Jean won't push to hard in the mind of person she cares about, as it could damage said mind.

Rachel is being ridiculed by Monet these days. I don't see her tp being a problem.

Rachel having any trouble with Monet is PIS and we both know it. Rachel is off the charts psionically and made Quire hemorrhage by just letting him look into her mind.

I'm just saying :)

@lordofallhumans: Lol I knew we would run into each other soon enough. Hope you've been well :)

Jean also comments on them "chocking" on the energies Legion is giving off, she is not just dealing with Storms winds, they were in a battle with Legion.

Jean made a point to comment on her winds being almost too strong to stand against, not Legion's energy. As a matter of fact, Legion wasn't even fighting them in that scene, but gave off an energy field that took the burnt of Storm's attack. Storms winds were so strong no one on the team was able to step foot outside their shields.

Candras ability to manipulate molecules is limited just like Selenes. The only reason she can turn off "mutant genes" is because she activated them, IIRC she can only use that power on people that she actually "gave" power to.

Still its molecular manipulation and she achieves this by reaaranging the molecular structure via tk. There s no indication that she is limited to only latent mutants.

Telepaths penetrate her mind just fine, they just sometimes have trouble doing certain things. Unlike Xavier, Jean has never had a problem with her passive electrically charged mind beyond sharing certain sensations. Jean and Storm had a girls night out all thanks to Jeans telepathy with no problem other then Jean not being able to access the part of her mind that would allow Jean to taste what Storm was eating, and that is usually because Jean won't push to hard in the mind of person she cares about, as it could damage said mind.

Not exactly true. Storm allowed Jean into her mind with no restistance in that issue of Xtreme X-men. This isn't to say her mind is inpenetrable but She does have a powerful resistance.

Rachel having any trouble with Monet is PIS and we both know it. Rachel is off the charts psionically and made Quire hemorrhage by just letting him look into her mind.

This I can agree with but as of late it is canon. Rachel hasn't been applying herself or should I say the writers haven't lately. With as much potential as she has she should be used more creatively and her powers can definitely use more development. QQ is a joke compared to these lades. Just saying.

@roddy010: You ended that comment by saying "So a quick draw will be in her favor not the psychics." Thats what i was responding too. But even if it were(which i don't believe it is) were looking at a double KO since again the TK user would still be going for a hit on Storm in that instant.

1. Keep in mind Jean was keeping herself upright..... She didn't pull out a Psi shield, or kneel to the ground to keep herself stable, she was standing in the wind that was created by a powerful attack....arguably one of the most powerful attacks considering who Storm was aiming at. And yet she was still standing. Now, in an actual fight Jean Grey (who is much stronger then she was at that time) isn't just going to be helpless against the attack. She can stimulate and ignite molecules, crush bones/boulders and per her own words deconstruct you molecule by molecule.....if you don't think she has enough force to touch Storm for the half a second it would take to critically injure her then it's a stalemate, because one of them would have to run out of power to both attack and defend themselves.

2. Candra is ludicously powerful (on paper)... the idea that this person couldn't beat Storm at that range one on one is PIS at it's finest. Basic TK not beating her we can debate, but Storm defeating someone who can change the very nature of her DNA with lightning and wind would need serious explaining. Nevermind the fact that Rachel just isn't one to hold back, and would more then likely bring Storm down out the gate with everything she's got. I mean she beat back Thor, that says a lot about her force

3. Again, if you can alter and rearrange things on a molecular level...then the amount of power needed to resist this ability would put Storm at a huge disadvantage going against a person who does this subconsciously.

4 It's Monet, she should probably shut up until she does what Rachel did here(without Cerebro):

@koays:

You ended that comment by saying "So a quick draw will be in her favor not the psychics." Thats what i was responding too. But even if it were(which i don't believe it is) were looking at a double KO since again the TK user would still be going for a hit on Storm in that instant.

Considering how Storm has generated her powers before superhumans could react, I do believe a quick draw would lean more to her favor. Keep in mind how Baroness outranned Psylocke's tk blast.

1. Keep in mind Jean was keeping herself upright..... She didn't pull out a Psi shield, or kneel to the ground to keep herself stable, she was standing in the wind that was created by a powerful attack....arguably one of the most powerful attacks considering who Storm was aiming at. And yet she was still standing. Now, in an actual fight Jean Grey (who is much stronger then she was at that time) isn't just going to be helpless against the attack. She can stimulate and ignite molecules, crush bones/boulders and per her own words deconstruct you molecule by molecule.....if you don't think she has enough force to touch Storm for the half a second it would take to critically injure her then it's a stalemate, because one of them would have to run out of power to both attack and defend themselves.

Jean cleary stated herself that she couldn't stand long against those winds. I'm not sure how you can argue what's plainly stated on panel. Her tk was barely holding up against an attack that wasn't even directed at her on two seperate occasions.

2. Candra is ludicously powerful (on paper)... the idea that this person couldn't beat Storm at that range one on one is PIS at it's finest. Basic TK not beating her we can debate, but Storm defeating someone who can change the very nature of her DNA with lightning and wind would need serious explaining. Nevermind the fact that Rachel just isn't one to hold back, and would more then likely bring Storm down out the gate with everything she's got. I mean she beat back Thor, that says a lot about her force.

Its pretty much force vs force and Lol Thor has been taken out by many tk users, mainly due to the execution of his powers which is completely different from Storm. Storm has dealt with many tk users over the course of her career and she has built a solid strategy against them by forcing all their power on the defense. The force of her lightning and winds have matched Scott's optic blast, create craters in the Earth and dug through miles of it. Her blast power is more than suffecient enough keep a tk user on the defense.

3. Again, if you can alter and rearrange things on a molecular level...then the amount of power needed to resist this ability would put Storm at a huge disadvantage going against a person who does this subconsciously.

You keep forgetting that Storm manipulates the elements and the forces behind them on a sub-atomic level. What stopping her from increasing the pressure in their inner ear, or evavuate the air from their lungs, or flash freeze them down to the bone marrow or even hit them with a precise lightning bolt to short circuit their synapses causing paralysis. She's capable of all of this and more.

4 It's Monet, she should probably shut up until she does what Rachel did here(without Cerebro)

This was a nice feat for Rachel. Someone should give all these writers a clue on what Rachel is capable of. Monet calling her out was just a low point and I honestly hope she gets some more development.

@koays: I agree! And telepathy would always be under any telepath's sleeves. If storm can hurl a lightning bolt, Jean and Rachel can also hurl a psi bolt. xorn jean knocked everyone in a room with just one psi bolt. Rachel also did this when she was told jean was dead back in the day when she just got to the x-mansion-pre excalibur days). She Knocked down everyone including storm.

At the end of the day i guess if we are not to base on facts of who's omega level or not, it will be just up to the writers to decide who wins in that battle we are longing to have

to sum it up, Telekinesis is as effective/useless as the write wants/needs it to be LOL

@roddy010: 1 Not arguing against panel, I'm arguing what's on it. And if Bishop is standing upright, why is Jean having so much trouble? Why not Psylocke? It's just Jean....it doesn't even make sense. What I was doing was going along with the idea that these winds are "so powerful" and pointing out that a psychic shield would've provided more protection from their effects then focusing on standing up straight. Idk where the blitz panel is from though so idk, but again were talking PrePhoenix Morrison Jean which i will go on record as saying is the only Jean that can take Storm one on one.

2. The way i see it Rachel can match Storm in terms of force. And it's not as if Rachel hasn't seen Storm fight before, she knows how strong Storm is first hand. And of people Rachel, just isn't going down with your standard TK preps. Don't get me wrong I give the edge to Storm...but she loses all her advantage if she doesn't put distance between them because Rachel can do the most damage in this fight in the least amount of time.

3. Lol this just puts us back at stalemate, because Rachel and Jean are in the class of Psychics that can do the exact same thing to her twice over. Truthfully the very nature of Telekinesis means they should be able to mimic anything that Storm can do and more, but as far as known abilities...they've got her beat on the manipulation of minute elements.

4. I've said many times the writers don't care about Rachel, it's why she hasn't had a plotpoint resolved since 2006.

Storm didn't even have her powers at that time and both instances were surprise attacks anyway.

Lol yea pretty much. I was trying not to bring up the whole Omega level thing since it's unclear....But unless Storm is blocking EVERYTHING telekinetics of a certain class match and beat her.

Really though, it's not even a question i want resolved with a fight....I'd much prefer everyone just get along and characters get fair treatment.

And yes @martinceld power levels are complete BS lol... But someone needs to defend the Grey's since Marvel won't do it.

I'm good lol, but always up for a good and friendly debate, I know I can always get one out of you :)

Jean made a point to comment on her winds being almost too strong to stand against, not Legion's energy. As a matter of fact, Legion wasn't even fighting them in that scene, but gave off an energy field that took the burnt of Storm's attack. Storms winds were so strong no one on the team was able to step foot outside their shields.

His energy was still something she mentioned, and the fact that they were only safe in their shields means, they can take her winds, she was going all out, was Jean? Lets consider that an ice dome was all Iceman has in the way of shields and he wasn't budging. Seems strange to me, if Jean was using all she had, she would have definitely been able to shield better than Bobby.

Still its molecular manipulation and she achieves this by reaaranging the molecular structure via tk. There s no indication that she is limited to only latent mutants.

There is every indication she is limited to latent mutants because that is all she has ever used her powers to do on that level IIRC, and they were latent mutants that she activated. It's no different than the limitation Selene has, she can manipulate matter at the molecular level, but only on inorganics and only to disintegrate them, not rearrange them. Candra hasn't as far as I know used her tk on anything on that level except those she has empowered and has never even tried to use tk on that level on Storm, so it doesn't really matter if Storm can block a blast of tk from her, we don't know if Storm can block molecular tk, and I'm willing to bet she can't because tk that can affect molecules would have no problem with lightning, that is why I doubt Candras ability to do anything outside of activating and deactivating powers she has already activated. Jean and Rachel are more powerful than Candra and by extension so is Psylocke, considering her tk is Jeans old tk which is why she was more powerful than Rachel, just not as skilled.

Not exactly true. Storm allowed Jean into her mind with no restistance in that issue of Xtreme X-men. This isn't to say her mind is inpenetrable but She does have a powerful resistance.

Storm and Jean were a world away, the only way they could have even begun to have that exchange is if Jean initiated contact. Even if Storm sent Jean a message "Hey girl let's hang out", it is only because Storm like all Xmen are telepathically linked to Jean because Jean has established links with them to keep tabs. During Black Sun, Jean lost telepathic contact with over a dozen Xmen that she wasn't actively communicating with, Storm was one, this means that Jean is always present in their minds whether they want her there or not. Jean even says in that same arc that all she needs is the right psychic keys to get into a mind, Storms mind is open to her because of the link Jean forges with all her teammates. No Xman can keep her out, she just respects their privacy and does not pry. She also mentions in that story that she wasn't gonna try harder to free Colossus from demons because the effort it would take would harm him, it doesn't mean she can't it just means that she won't. Most telepaths that Storm has given trouble to are telepaths that are not as powerful as Jean anyway, including Xavier, and he wouldn't risk hurting his Xmen either. Jean can force her way into Storms mind, she just doesn't because she doesn't want to mess her up doing it.

This I can agree with but as of late it is canon. Rachel hasn't been applying herself or should I say the writers haven't lately. With as much potential as she has she should be used more creatively and her powers can definitely use more development. QQ is a joke compared to these lades. Just saying.

Yes QQ is a joke, but powerwise Monet can't touch him, and she has never been formally trained in telepathy, because nobody even knew she had it until she communicated directly with Emma when she was the twins in Gen X, so her being able to stand up to Rachel post-twins is PIS. Rachel is jobber queen, when in reality she has just as much raw power as her brothers, and in reality is in-between Cable and Nate because Cable already admitted she is more powerful than he is, right before he rescued her from the end of time.

Not a god, but old school Storm is portrayed as unbeatable. Nowadays she shows up, tells people she is "not amused" then wrecks everything...i'm cool with that. But there's a period up to the early 90s where you almost wonder why she needs the X-Men if everytime she fights someone hand to hand or with powers she out classes them....AND she led the team.

I don't think that lightning outright negates TP, and its effects on TK are secondary. The way i see it its a power defense, but if it were that good she'd never lose to psychics.

You're right it doesn't outright negate TP. All that crap came from the new age movement telling people that electrical storms hampered psychic abilities because activity in the brain is measured by electrical impulses, when in essence if psi powers originate in the actual brain, increased electrical activity should increase the power of any psi that comes in contact with it.

Telekinesis has been shown on panel as incredibly powerful and other times, just blegh. It's a difficult power to play with if you're a writer since you can do so much with it and chance throwing the story into wacky zones that leave readers rolling their eyes.

I think that's why Marvel tries to establish levels in individual tk users, they are not all created equally. So just because you can close a door doesn't mean you can lift a bus, and just because you can lift a bus doesn't mean you can shatter a mountain, and just because you can shatter a mountain doesn't mean you can manipulate molecules, but at the same time just because you can manipulate molecules doesn't mean you can do any of the others things. IMO so far Grey tk (Jean, Rachel, Cable, Nate) can do all those things. All the others specialize in how much they can mess around with matter.

Perfect breakdown, thank you! Having anyone equal to or more powerful than the Greys would be extremely annoying to me as an X-Men fan. It was always Jean's motif, you know? I hope writers (BendisBendisBendis) keep that in mind when they play with different characters. If an extraordinary feat is required, telekinesis wise, then bring in the mutant to match it, not upgrade a pet character's power-set to accommodate it.

Yes!!

lol i see what you mean, i think the thing is that she didn't know firsthand how to apply her powers to telepaths and telekinetics though .. rachel stated that storm's lightning field scrambles her psychic assault, i agree on the secondary effects part though but her controlling the energies behind weather can really make her a bad bish to deal with but i don't think she'd outright force a telekinetic to their knees though i think the strain of the initial strike gives them a bit of a shock(?) then they try to stabilize its like being hit with a car moving at high speeds, if you're strong enough to withstand the fist attack you're gonna be fine. But if that car hits you and continuously keeps baring down on you without letting up you're bound to feel the strain of it increasing.

@malachi_munroe: I accept that Storm is extremely strong and has certain advantages....but that doesn't just leave anyone who faces her helpless. I mean if that car is crashing into with more and more force....wouldn't you go on the attack before it reaches the point where all you can do is wait to get crushed.

Lol It's sort of the idea that these extremely powerful molecular manipulating psychics are going to just stand around rather then using some of there molecular manipulating powers on Storm....

@koays: thats the point .. i don't understand candra did go on the offense while storm's winds were hammering her shield and even fired tk blasts ...they didn't even connect ..

@lordofallhumans: does cable saying rachel is more powerful happen in his solo series?

@malachi_munroe: Storm winds combined with the sand deflected her attack. Candra, same as with what has been shown with Rachel, couldn't both effectively defend and attack Storm at the same time due to the raw power Storm through at them. They needed to put most of their effort into either their defense or offense, and in both these instances it was very effective for Storm.

@thunderbolt30: :p must you always know exactly what i'm trying to explain?