what is wrong with slott

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comicawesome

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#1  Edited By comicawesome

I see a lot of dislike for Dan Slott's run on spider-man. so what is wrong with slott?

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magnetic_eye

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#2  Edited By magnetic_eye

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, philandering buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed, sex starved, bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character, whom after years in a bunker shows no signs of having suffered any trauma, abuse and neglect.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

13. Turned Black Cat into an inconsiderate heel of a person, in the worst way possible.

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Impervious

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Though sometimes his storylines and character development arcs are sometimes half baked, Slott is actually a pretty good writer. People just like to hate on him.

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AmazingSpiderDan

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Dang, @magnetic_eye is a straight savage.

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

It's kind of upsetting to think that you can't argue any of these points either. Each and every single one of them is true. Unfortunately, if you presented this list to Nick Lowe and told him Slott can't write Spider-Man, he'll probably scoff and tell you to take a hike. I guess ignorance is bliss. When you have more people telling you they don't like a writer instead of telling you they like him/her, that's a pretty bold sign that it's time for a change.

All anyone has to read is "No understanding of Peter Parker's character" and that should be enough.

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The_Waffle

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kgb725

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Does he still come on here ?

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Zarius

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#7  Edited By Zarius

@impervious said:

Though sometimes his storylines and character development arcs are sometimes half baked, Slott is actually a pretty good writer. People just like to hate on him.

Look, you clearly think he's not all that either in terms of plots and developments (which a consistent dose of is normally what you require to be considered a pretty good writer), so why are you throwing out that tired old "haters gonna hate" card? I've noticed most of the time this over-defensive behavior comes from those insecure about their rather poor tastes in comics. People have legit reason to dislike Dan's work. Hell, I'm a fan of what he does on Silver Surfer and he USED to be a good Spidey writer, but, unlike you, I'm not blind to his faults nor have my lips attached to his rear. I look forward to the day we have a writer on board that actually gives a damn about consistency and gives us a well-rounded book. Someone like Mike Costa would be ideal as he was the best thing about Spider-Verse

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AmazingSpiderman15

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1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

this

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#9  Edited By comicawesome
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1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

13.Trying too hard.

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1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

No need for anything else.

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lxlGiftedlxl

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#13  Edited By lxlGiftedlxl

@magnetic_eye said:

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

This.

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Jimishim12

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#14  Edited By Jimishim12

@magnetic_eye said:

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

That's not a bad message.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

So your even more immature than I anticipated.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

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#16  Edited By Zarius

@jimishim12 said:

Man, people hate fun.

If this is your idea of a good time, I don't want you or your rotten tastes in comics at any of my parties

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SodamYat

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ohhh snap

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magnetic_eye

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@magnetic_eye said:

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

That's not a bad message.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

So your even more immature than I anticipated.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

1. I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

No, Slott is wilfully ignorant of the character’s history and legacy and is unable to write smart sophisticated stories with characters strong enough to inhabit a variety of narratives. It's seriously inconsistent storytelling. You do realize that for decades Peter Parker was a mature 28 year adult who learnt from his mistakes, went through trials and tribulations and learnt to overcome them as an astute and formidable super hero.

Peter's confidence excels when he dons the Spider-Man mask and he uses humor effectively when crime fighting. He's not a stand up comedian cracking jokes left, right and centre.

What do you mean by Spidey being more active than he has ever been? He's dated other women post (making a deal with the devil) OMD, but now he can philander as much as he likes? That's a great code of ethics to live by.

2. Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

A cartoony wisecrack is something from the dreadful "Ultimate Spider-Man" TV cartoon. The whole original essence of Spider-Man was about a teenager suddenly imbued with great power and responsibility and over the course of time, learning and maturing into adulthood which was how the ASM title had progressed for decades. This was the definitive Peter Parker / Spider-Man: an older, mature, formidable and responsible crime-fighter who effectively used humor.

The focus shift to make Spider-Man even funnier with the cheesy comedy relief of a goofy clown is downright corny, boring and ridiculous.

3. Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

Peter Parker centered stories, really? It's obvious Slott doesn't like Pete, MJ or Black Cat. He doesn't get Pete, can't write Pete, can't relate to the character at all. What exactly is Pete more active at doing? The original support cast have been handled like crap in exchange for Slott's characters bought to the forefront. Slott has made characters like Silk and Marconi react quickly and efficiently to a crisis while Peter stands there unsure, stammering to himself, frozen with indecision.

The point ones issues by Gerry Conway are a far better example of how to tell a good story. They are more genuine and true to Peter Parker's character, because they are written by a real professional writer.

Spider-Man has always been a resourceful and formidable super hero. He doesn't need over the top weaponry or gimmicks. He's not Tony Stark.

4. That's not a bad message.

So the appeal of Peter Parker / Spider-Man to a global market the last five decades is a failed concept? I think not. Why tamper with the original character other than trying desperately hard to be seen as politically correct? The whole white privilege argument is a load of BS.

In terms of Cosplay, sure why not, we all share the same emotional make up regardless of backgrounds. It doesn't deter from the fact that anyone can enjoy the character. But if I'm going to buy a Spider-Man comic book, then it's definitely got to be the original Peter Parker as Spider-Man. Changing a character from something he is into something he never was is a very strange and patronizing notion. All Marvel needs to do is create new diverse characters. They have the marketing talent to do that don't they?

Dan Slott's race baiting antics are absurd.

5. Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

Oh I'm sure Peter had the best intimate sex during his marriage with Mary Jane; his only true love. The "everyman" hero as you say was a mature 28 year old man displaying commitment, responsibility and integrity. That's what grown ups do in a relationship. Far more rewarding and satisfying than screwing around all your life.

The derailment of Peter's character and regressing him into a youthful time warp is really what is holding Peter back from learning that "with great power comes great responsibility".

How do you compare a static character who never ages with one who does, as a much more dynamic way of telling a story? How does that help the storytelling medium when you can't move your character forward? It's not what Stan Lee or Steve Ditko originally intended for the character.

6. How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

Another false throwaway statement. How has Peter become more pronounced? Pronounced dead when downtrodden and humiliated by SpOck? With ghost Peter floating around? Because Horizon Labs and now Parker Industries has given Peter some sense of achievement? Is that why Anna Maria Marconi runs the company because Peter is incompetent or what? How were the meanderings through Spider-Verse more interactive (in a street level) sense? Again I urge you to read Conway's point one issues for credible street level.

7. He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

No, he hasn't always been an immature philandering buffoon since day one. How much Spider-Man have you actually read?

You do realize that the "Amazing Spider-Man" title with a young Spidey in High School only accounts for 10% of his history??? It only lasted three or four years. It was never a static concept. Marvel established Spider-Man into adulthood as a mature 28 year old. That was the natural progression that was originally intended and 90% of Spider-Man's history is that of an adult, a serious super hero with a sense of humor when fighting crime.

8. So your even more immature than I anticipated.

Well yes of course I am. I'm only human. We all have our faults. I can also be cynical and skeptical if you like but I'm generally a fun guy. At least I don't harass people online who don't like my work, like the time Dan Slott stalked and upset a random woman on Twitter, or telling people to "F@#K OFF", or telling people to go to Christ land, or telling Peter Parker fans they're racists, or get forum moderators to delete very revealing aspects of bad online behavior.

9. Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

What was so original about Doc Ock killing Spider-Man? The masterpiece "Kraven's Last Hunt" by J.M. DeMatteis did it so much better. Spidey has never been so boring since OMD.

SSM was at best a parody and ASM continues to lower the bar.

10. It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

So what? Batman Eternal only? How about Batman or Detective? Quantity of sales does not equal quality. There are a lot of popular things people buy in this world. It doesn't mean it's of any long lasting quality or value.

In most of Spider-Verse, Peter lacked any real leadership skills only to be upstaged by Silk or SpOck. He was hardly the hero in his own book. He had to depend on so many others to secure victory.

11. She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

Okay! so now you're playing the race card. Nice. Being a minority female character does not excuse Silk from being a bad one-dimensional character and a sex-ploitation plot device.

12. Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Another fallacious statement. You know as a consumer I have every right to like or dislike something and voice my opinion on social media. If I don't like a particular actor in a role or the way a movie has been directed, does that mean I hate that actor or that director? Absolutely NOT. Same goes for someone's taste in music or authors. At the end of the day you could argue that taste is subjective and sure, you would be right......I get it.

BUT, you can't deny my opinion of what I see to be flawed writing. It's as simple as that. I don't hate Dan Slott, I don't know him personally, I have never met him. He probably has a very charismatic personality in real life. I just strongly dislike his writing style for Spider-Man and that's that. Stop being an oversensitive online baby.

13. Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

So Spider-Man comics according to you should just be about lighthearted comedic fun? No drama, no action, no in depth characterizations, no slice of life realism? Marvel have regressed Spider-Man beyond belief. He is now immature, weak, lacking leadership skills, with no endearing personality traits and has become a supporting character in his own title unable to do anything amazing. Slott has been on the title for far too long. His creative juices stagnated quite some time ago and I dread to think what RYV will bring forth.

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Zarius

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#19  Edited By Zarius

"MJ is a trophy wife", god this dimwit does'nt know the first thing about relationships or how essential she was to the core of Peter's being (and still is)

You have ZERO grasp of what Spider-Man is, no real respect for the characters or their history, you are not a true fan. Crawl back to the echo chambers of CBR and continue to make yourself look like a div, because you're messing with actual grown ups here.

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Message now modified. Sorry about that guys, I let the little parasite get to me there.

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The_Waffle

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@zarius: I thought it was justified lol

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AmazingSpiderman15

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@marvelicious: i didn't pick up SS because Slott was writing it...

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Zarius

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Surfer's alright, it's biggest criticism is that it's too much like Doctor Who (Slott's favourite show), but I like Doctor Who also so it does'nt phase me as much.

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@jimishim12 said:

@magnetic_eye said:

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

That's not a bad message.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

So your even more immature than I anticipated.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

1. I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

No, Slott is wilfully ignorant of the character’s history and legacy and is unable to write smart sophisticated stories with characters strong enough to inhabit a variety of narratives. It's seriously inconsistent storytelling. You do realize that for decades Peter Parker was a mature 28 year adult who learnt from his mistakes, went through trials and tribulations and learnt to overcome them as an astute and formidable super hero.

Peter's confidence excels when he dons the Spider-Man mask and he uses humor effectively when crime fighting. He's not a stand up comedian cracking jokes left, right and centre.

What do you mean by Spidey being more active than he has ever been? He's dated other women post (making a deal with the devil) OMD, but now he can philander as much as he likes? That's a great code of ethics to live by.

2. Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

A cartoony wisecrack is something from the dreadful "Ultimate Spider-Man" TV cartoon. The whole original essence of Spider-Man was about a teenager suddenly imbued with great power and responsibility and over the course of time, learning and maturing into adulthood which was how the ASM title had progressed for decades. This was the definitive Peter Parker / Spider-Man: an older, mature, formidable and responsible crime-fighter who effectively used humor.

The focus shift to make Spider-Man even funnier with the cheesy comedy relief of a goofy clown is downright corny, boring and ridiculous.

3. Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

Peter Parker centered stories, really? It's obvious Slott doesn't like Pete, MJ or Black Cat. He doesn't get Pete, can't write Pete, can't relate to the character at all. What exactly is Pete more active at doing? The original support cast have been handled like crap in exchange for Slott's characters bought to the forefront. Slott has made characters like Silk and Marconi react quickly and efficiently to a crisis while Peter stands there unsure, stammering to himself, frozen with indecision.

The point ones issues by Gerry Conway are a far better example of how to tell a good story. They are more genuine and true to Peter Parker's character, because they are written by a real professional writer.

Spider-Man has always been a resourceful and formidable super hero. He doesn't need over the top weaponry or gimmicks. He's not Tony Stark.

4. That's not a bad message.

So the appeal of Peter Parker / Spider-Man to a global market the last five decades is a failed concept? I think not. Why tamper with the original character other than trying desperately hard to be seen as politically correct? The whole white privilege argument is a load of BS.

In terms of Cosplay, sure why not, we all share the same emotional make up regardless of backgrounds. It doesn't deter from the fact that anyone can enjoy the character. But if I'm going to buy a Spider-Man comic book, then it's definitely got to be the original Peter Parker as Spider-Man. Changing a character from something he is into something he never was is a very strange and patronizing notion. All Marvel needs to do is create new diverse characters. They have the marketing talent to do that don't they?

Dan Slott's race baiting antics are absurd.

5. Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

Oh I'm sure Peter had the best intimate sex during his marriage with Mary Jane; his only true love. The "everyman" hero as you say was a mature 28 year old man displaying commitment, responsibility and integrity. That's what grown ups do in a relationship. Far more rewarding and satisfying than screwing around all your life.

The derailment of Peter's character and regressing him into a youthful time warp is really what is holding Peter back from learning that "with great power comes great responsibility".

How do you compare a static character who never ages with one who does, as a much more dynamic way of telling a story? How does that help the storytelling medium when you can't move your character forward? It's not what Stan Lee or Steve Ditko originally intended for the character.

6. How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

Another false throwaway statement. How has Peter become more pronounced? Pronounced dead when downtrodden and humiliated by SpOck? With ghost Peter floating around? Because Horizon Labs and now Parker Industries has given Peter some sense of achievement? Is that why Anna Maria Marconi runs the company because Peter is incompetent or what? How were the meanderings through Spider-Verse more interactive (in a street level) sense? Again I urge you to read Conway's point one issues for credible street level.

7. He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

No, he hasn't always been an immature philandering buffoon since day one. How much Spider-Man have you actually read?

You do realize that the "Amazing Spider-Man" title with a young Spidey in High School only accounts for 10% of his history??? It only lasted three or four years. It was never a static concept. Marvel established Spider-Man into adulthood as a mature 28 year old. That was the natural progression that was originally intended and 90% of Spider-Man's history is that of an adult, a serious super hero with a sense of humor when fighting crime.

8. So your even more immature than I anticipated.

Well yes of course I am. I'm only human. We all have our faults. I can also be cynical and skeptical if you like but I'm generally a fun guy. At least I don't harass people online who don't like my work, like the time Dan Slott stalked and upset a random woman on Twitter, or telling people to "F@#K OFF", or telling people to go to Christ land, or telling Peter Parker fans they're racists, or get forum moderators to delete very revealing aspects of bad online behavior.

9. Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

What was so original about Doc Ock killing Spider-Man? The masterpiece "Kraven's Last Hunt" by J.M. DeMatteis did it so much better. Spidey has never been so boring since OMD.

SSM was at best a parody and ASM continues to lower the bar.

10. It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

So what? Batman Eternal only? How about Batman or Detective? Quantity of sales does not equal quality. There are a lot of popular things people buy in this world. It doesn't mean it's of any long lasting quality or value.

In most of Spider-Verse, Peter lacked any real leadership skills only to be upstaged by Silk or SpOck. He was hardly the hero in his own book. He had to depend on so many others to secure victory.

11. She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

Okay! so now you're playing the race card. Nice. Being a minority female character does not excuse Silk from being a bad one-dimensional character and a sex-ploitation plot device.

12. Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Another fallacious statement. You know as a consumer I have every right to like or dislike something and voice my opinion on social media. If I don't like a particular actor in a role or the way a movie has been directed, does that mean I hate that actor or that director? Absolutely NOT. Same goes for someone's taste in music or authors. At the end of the day you could argue that taste is subjective and sure, you would be right......I get it.

BUT, you can't deny my opinion of what I see to be flawed writing. It's as simple as that. I don't hate Dan Slott, I don't know him personally, I have never met him. He probably has a very charismatic personality in real life. I just strongly dislike his writing style for Spider-Man and that's that. Stop being an oversensitive online baby.

13. Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

So Spider-Man comics according to you should just be about lighthearted comedic fun? No drama, no action, no in depth characterizations, no slice of life realism? Marvel have regressed Spider-Man beyond belief. He is now immature, weak, lacking leadership skills, with no endearing personality traits and has become a supporting character in his own title unable to do anything amazing. Slott has been on the title for far too long. His creative juices stagnated quite some time ago and I dread to think what RYV will bring forth.

1. That's completely false, Peter's character shifts depending on the writer(Peter is so veried through Amazing and Spectacular). You're over extricating the narrative about what Peter should be in you're own opinion. Peter is a simple character, Peter's fundamentally speaking is supposed to be a erratic chaotic super nerd who who's uniqueness comes from not being as mature as his peers such as Steve Rogers, Matt Murdock, and even Tony Starrk, just cuz he grown up some in the pre omd days didn't compromise his whole flawed nature, he still was more or less like wade, bobby, and johnny in a stable way. And no, Spidey as a kid used to cope fear and hide his true self from his main identity, I am pretty sure he as adjusted his attitude as Spidey as Peter even out of costume thanks to years of experience, and Spidey is naturally a comedian and has a method in his character that talks about the world and lightens the mood with comedy based on that plus has a comedians cynical loathing attitude, he even went to a comedy club as a stand up but writers don't want him to excel at that for some reason.

2. Kids don't care about that, and quite frankly that's not what Spidey at his basic is promoted as. Media wants Spidey viewed as the bugs bunny of superheroes, a light hearted and somewhat annoying daredevil who makes fun of bad guys and allies and even himself. The point is this, Spidey should not be taken that seriously unless to mislead the audience on how cool he can be despite that, he wears bright colors and looks like a circus acrobat from pee wee's playhouse, he's silly. Spidey is a silly man, he's not Master Chief, Solid Snake, Batman. He's fun filled and childish, but can be mature. His main aspect as a everyman that, he's underestimated by everyone and his humor makes him a fool but deep down he's more than he seems, but I would rather him be serious and dramatic as an optional aspect of his character, Spidey is generally fun and silly and heroic because he chooses to be.

3. Slott writes Peter as a expected as a man who set the reset button on his life with MJ and thus started over, without any back pedaling Peters obligation as Spiderman. He finally paid his dues after Civil War, his identity is a secret again, and no more unnessarry bullshit with struggling to pay rent when at the time had freakin tony stark as his friend. He found his mark in life and found some happiness, and Slott elbaborated that with Big time and then Parker industries, a lot of fans back in the day complained that Peter was still in the same rut and never progressing himself. Making him more depressing than Hulk sometimes.

4. Marvel wants Spider-Man to have a unique take behind the costume, and generally it's cool being Spider-Man or a Spider warrior. It works for Batman and Green Lantern. Peter Parker has a interchangeable character that can be anyone given that he will come back. Peter himself is marvel's flagship character, so in order to keep his stories from being repetitive, they set the character back to the basics like the Ninja Turtles to meet the times of the new age.

5. IMO, Spidey shows more responsibility and integrity saving lives and being selflessly genuine in making everyone happy then being a lack luster husband who is written always a unsatisfactory ideal mate when he shackles his duties for a married life with his wife for Superheroics. That seemed unfair to MJ, she has to wait at home doing mundane stuff eating ben and jerrys while Peter's in another dimension with the FF having fun defeating a villain wholely because he can or playing cards with the Avengers. Spidey also has been a terrible husband on account of letting down MJ just as much as he makes up for her, and those stories are the true plot cancers of the Spiderman comic IMO it's like saying Peter's terrible for being a better human being than her since he's the elevated star of the comic who's purpose is being a hero. Plus it's just boring and I don't care about remedial normal day stuff in a childrens action book especially the sex and romantic scenes

6. See number two and yes, Slott killing off Peter was the greatest move Marvel has ever done for the character.

7. And you need to get off your high horse, Spidey written in different ways but at a basic level, it's was the archetypical trickster troll and young elevated fanboy/nerd of heroes. There is what you need for anyone to tell a story about Spidey, the Peter Parker stuff comes when you want the character in a setting where him and Spider-Man are interchangeable, even Peter's normal life is about protecting his loved ones and saving the day despite him looking lackluster and against all the odds. He created the trolling hero btw, Deadpool, Dante, Sonic, Nathan Drake, Toph, Danny Fenton/Phantom, Naruto Uzumaki all take from Spider Man in some fashion way down to his cocky tone of voice and goofy attitude, whether it be coincidence or sheer intent.

8. Cynicism does not bare any grounds in making a feasible argument.

9. Kraven's Last Hunt is overrated and had a terrible ending IMO, Spidey had everything in that story that made him clean from being an actual murderer, Superior Spiderman completely darkened a Spiderman title and made the character step outside his comfort zone in a extreme way, this time it made him completely back to being as controversial as he started which is where he should be, before that, he was a bench warmer avenger who even Clint Barton was more famous than he was.

10. Maybe because he just came from getting his mind taken over, he still had stopped Spock and was still the moral center for all the Spider Warriors. Peter will always be the pure abstract force of nature in a tangible setting of better people than he is.

11. Just agree to disagree. But still, show me detailed examples of this bad written plot holes and characterization?

12. How is it not, Spider-Man has always separating from all the seriousness and the complete static bare bones characterization of tough heroes with a hero who was about being jovial, and light spirited. Plus look at his costume. Can you really think he's all like Wolverine or Batman? Stan Lee's issues IMO were hilarious minus the deaths and drama.

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Zarius

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#27  Edited By Zarius

Go home fake fan/Slott sock account, you're drunk. You don't have any real justification for any of these points, you just want to be "that guy" and go against the crowd. What you read has not, will not, and never will be, Spider-Man.

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@magnetic_eye said:

@jimishim12 said:

@magnetic_eye said:

1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

That's not a bad message.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

So your even more immature than I anticipated.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

1. I'm pretty sure Slott nails the character's woe is moe comedic goodie good nerd aspect of his character, and Spidey is more active than he's ever been.

No, Slott is wilfully ignorant of the character’s history and legacy and is unable to write smart sophisticated stories with characters strong enough to inhabit a variety of narratives. It's seriously inconsistent storytelling. You do realize that for decades Peter Parker was a mature 28 year adult who learnt from his mistakes, went through trials and tribulations and learnt to overcome them as an astute and formidable super hero.

Peter's confidence excels when he dons the Spider-Man mask and he uses humor effectively when crime fighting. He's not a stand up comedian cracking jokes left, right and centre.

What do you mean by Spidey being more active than he has ever been? He's dated other women post (making a deal with the devil) OMD, but now he can philander as much as he likes? That's a great code of ethics to live by.

2. Do you ever read a Spidey comic and not see him cracking cartoony wisecracks?

A cartoony wisecrack is something from the dreadful "Ultimate Spider-Man" TV cartoon. The whole original essence of Spider-Man was about a teenager suddenly imbued with great power and responsibility and over the course of time, learning and maturing into adulthood which was how the ASM title had progressed for decades. This was the definitive Peter Parker / Spider-Man: an older, mature, formidable and responsible crime-fighter who effectively used humor.

The focus shift to make Spider-Man even funnier with the cheesy comedy relief of a goofy clown is downright corny, boring and ridiculous.

3. Slott's finally telling Peter Parker centered stories and making him more active in the book, his cast no longer bogs him down with their rudimentary problems and Peter is free to handle his own shit and persue stuff(Science and Technolgy) other than playing the whipping boy to Aunt May or MJ or JJ. Peter has his own book back.

Peter Parker centered stories, really? It's obvious Slott doesn't like Pete, MJ or Black Cat. He doesn't get Pete, can't write Pete, can't relate to the character at all. What exactly is Pete more active at doing? The original support cast have been handled like crap in exchange for Slott's characters bought to the forefront. Slott has made characters like Silk and Marconi react quickly and efficiently to a crisis while Peter stands there unsure, stammering to himself, frozen with indecision.

The point ones issues by Gerry Conway are a far better example of how to tell a good story. They are more genuine and true to Peter Parker's character, because they are written by a real professional writer.

Spider-Man has always been a resourceful and formidable super hero. He doesn't need over the top weaponry or gimmicks. He's not Tony Stark.

4. That's not a bad message.

So the appeal of Peter Parker / Spider-Man to a global market the last five decades is a failed concept? I think not. Why tamper with the original character other than trying desperately hard to be seen as politically correct? The whole white privilege argument is a load of BS.

In terms of Cosplay, sure why not, we all share the same emotional make up regardless of backgrounds. It doesn't deter from the fact that anyone can enjoy the character. But if I'm going to buy a Spider-Man comic book, then it's definitely got to be the original Peter Parker as Spider-Man. Changing a character from something he is into something he never was is a very strange and patronizing notion. All Marvel needs to do is create new diverse characters. They have the marketing talent to do that don't they?

Dan Slott's race baiting antics are absurd.

5. Fuck MJ IMO, she's like Lois but more a trophy wife and freebie plot device. MJ held Peter Back from being the Everyman hero we know him for.

Oh I'm sure Peter had the best intimate sex during his marriage with Mary Jane; his only true love. The "everyman" hero as you say was a mature 28 year old man displaying commitment, responsibility and integrity. That's what grown ups do in a relationship. Far more rewarding and satisfying than screwing around all your life.

The derailment of Peter's character and regressing him into a youthful time warp is really what is holding Peter back from learning that "with great power comes great responsibility".

How do you compare a static character who never ages with one who does, as a much more dynamic way of telling a story? How does that help the storytelling medium when you can't move your character forward? It's not what Stan Lee or Steve Ditko originally intended for the character.

6. How? Peter has become more pronounced and more interactive(in a street level sense) than he has during the last 20 years married and on the Avengers and FF roster.

Another false throwaway statement. How has Peter become more pronounced? Pronounced dead when downtrodden and humiliated by SpOck? With ghost Peter floating around? Because Horizon Labs and now Parker Industries has given Peter some sense of achievement? Is that why Anna Maria Marconi runs the company because Peter is incompetent or what? How were the meanderings through Spider-Verse more interactive (in a street level) sense? Again I urge you to read Conway's point one issues for credible street level.

7. He's always been like that, since day one. And is why we love him for it, he was the tude of super heroes before deadpool and sonic came along

No, he hasn't always been an immature philandering buffoon since day one. How much Spider-Man have you actually read?

You do realize that the "Amazing Spider-Man" title with a young Spidey in High School only accounts for 10% of his history??? It only lasted three or four years. It was never a static concept. Marvel established Spider-Man into adulthood as a mature 28 year old. That was the natural progression that was originally intended and 90% of Spider-Man's history is that of an adult, a serious super hero with a sense of humor when fighting crime.

8. So your even more immature than I anticipated.

Well yes of course I am. I'm only human. We all have our faults. I can also be cynical and skeptical if you like but I'm generally a fun guy. At least I don't harass people online who don't like my work, like the time Dan Slott stalked and upset a random woman on Twitter, or telling people to "F@#K OFF", or telling people to go to Christ land, or telling Peter Parker fans they're racists, or get forum moderators to delete very revealing aspects of bad online behavior.

9. Most original idea since the web of life for the character. Spidey has never been more interesting since then.

What was so original about Doc Ock killing Spider-Man? The masterpiece "Kraven's Last Hunt" by J.M. DeMatteis did it so much better. Spidey has never been so boring since OMD.

SSM was at best a parody and ASM continues to lower the bar.

10. It outsold batman eternal and made enough money to keep another run based off of it.

So what? Batman Eternal only? How about Batman or Detective? Quantity of sales does not equal quality. There are a lot of popular things people buy in this world. It doesn't mean it's of any long lasting quality or value.

In most of Spider-Verse, Peter lacked any real leadership skills only to be upstaged by Silk or SpOck. He was hardly the hero in his own book. He had to depend on so many others to secure victory.

11. She's better than all the sluth of white women we have had over as Spidey's dick warmers.

Okay! so now you're playing the race card. Nice. Being a minority female character does not excuse Silk from being a bad one-dimensional character and a sex-ploitation plot device.

12. Translation: I have no feasible argument, I hate Slott because I think he sucks and that's that.

Another fallacious statement. You know as a consumer I have every right to like or dislike something and voice my opinion on social media. If I don't like a particular actor in a role or the way a movie has been directed, does that mean I hate that actor or that director? Absolutely NOT. Same goes for someone's taste in music or authors. At the end of the day you could argue that taste is subjective and sure, you would be right......I get it.

BUT, you can't deny my opinion of what I see to be flawed writing. It's as simple as that. I don't hate Dan Slott, I don't know him personally, I have never met him. He probably has a very charismatic personality in real life. I just strongly dislike his writing style for Spider-Man and that's that. Stop being an oversensitive online baby.

13. Man, people hate fun. Spider-Man has been fun since Slott came to the comics. Joe Kelly made the last fun Spidey stories.

So Spider-Man comics according to you should just be about lighthearted comedic fun? No drama, no action, no in depth characterizations, no slice of life realism? Marvel have regressed Spider-Man beyond belief. He is now immature, weak, lacking leadership skills, with no endearing personality traits and has become a supporting character in his own title unable to do anything amazing. Slott has been on the title for far too long. His creative juices stagnated quite some time ago and I dread to think what RYV will bring forth.

1. That's completely false, Peter's character shifts depending on the writer(Peter is so veried through Amazing and Spectacular). You're over extricating the narrative about what Peter should be in you're own opinion. Peter is a simple character

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blackspidey2099

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Personally, the best part of Slott's run has been letting Peter finally move on from low-paying jobs and silly money problems and get a great job as a super-scientist, utilizing his intellect as one of the smartest people in the world. I am getting tired of Slott's stories now, but I would rather have him AND Parker Industries/Horizon Labs rather than switching him out for any writer if that writer would once again make him a loser.

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Zarius

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#30  Edited By Zarius

Gail Simone has tweeted she wants to write Spidey. AND she wants MJ to be a major part of the book and give the two some stability.

Would you care to repeat that bit about wanting Slott to stay on knowing talent like that potentially waits in the wings?

Also, I'll be glad to see Peter back to his roots for Renew Your Vows. He's not Reed Richards/Tony Stark, that's not why anyone likes him. Parker Industries was interesting, but it's something that can only be told in the age of deconstructive storytelling ,it exists to prove Peter can't be this kind of person all of the time, it's far above his station.

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98115

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I like dan slott's spider-man personally

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#32  Edited By Zarius

And like most people who like Slott's stuff, you can't come up with any good reason why, otherwise you'd add to the conversation instead of contributing absolutely nothing.

Do yourself a favor and read the classics by JMS, DeMatties, Stern etc, you know, the stuff with actual SUBSTANCE. Stop settling for less thinking it's more.

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comicawesome

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@zarius: wow. there is no need to be so aggressive. We are talking about people writing about fictional characters.There is no need to attack other uses for not sharing your opinion.

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@jimishim12 dude I have never disagreed with someone more on a forum, and really question how much spider-man you have read as compared to just seeing posted scans of him/wikipedia article. "The archetypical troll" would hardly be a term used to describe him. Tell me if I'm wrong, but from what you've written I'm assuming your early experiences with Pete were in the Bendis New Avengers or post OMD, correct?

also, @zarius chill the hell out man, it's just this guys terrible opinion about a fictional character.

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#35  Edited By JulieDC
@blackspidey2099 said:

Personally, the best part of Slott's run has been letting Peter finally move on from low-paying jobs and silly money problems and get a great job as a super-scientist, utilizing his intellect as one of the smartest people in the world. I am getting tired of Slott's stories now, but I would rather have him AND Parker Industries/Horizon Labs rather than switching him out for any writer if that writer would once again make him a loser.

That is how I feel on the subject. Especially because his financial situations and crappy luck hits too close to home and that actually drives me away from his books. Unlike everyone else, I enjoy the humor but then majority of the Spidey stories I've read have been from Slott, JMS, and Bendis so that is the only interpretation I know.

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blackspidey2099

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#36  Edited By blackspidey2099

@juliedc said:
@blackspidey2099 said:

Personally, the best part of Slott's run has been letting Peter finally move on from low-paying jobs and silly money problems and get a great job as a super-scientist, utilizing his intellect as one of the smartest people in the world. I am getting tired of Slott's stories now, but I would rather have him AND Parker Industries/Horizon Labs rather than switching him out for any writer if that writer would once again make him a loser.

That is how I feel on the subject. Especially because his financial situations and crappy luck hits too close to home and that actually drives me away from his books. Unlike everyone else, I enjoy the humor but then majority of the Spidey stories I've read have been from Slott, JMS, and Bendis so that is the only interpretation I know.

I think most Spidey fans enjoy the humor actually - I think that they get annoyed when the constant injection of humor that can sometimes ruin darker tales. Slott does that quite often. Personally, I like the humor as it is the main differentiating factor between Spidey and Batman (they both have super-intellect, tackle both street and cosmic crime, create lots of suits, pure-hearted, etc.), as well as giving Spidey the option of having various and diverse stories from the light hearted romps to dark character explorations, etc.

And of course, I completely agree that Spidey needs to stop being a loser. Not only is that so painfully unrealistic (he's one of the top 8 smartest people in the world), but it gets boring and has been so overdone. This is an AMAZING new direction for Spidey, and IMO it is one that should be kept and built upon for many, many years to come. Hopefully, it will become one of his core characteristics which define the character.

@zarius Parker Industries has proved no such thing. Are you seriously saying that you want one of the smartest people in the world to be a poor beggar for continued PIS and CIS? And nothing is above Peter's station - as a character, he was meant to be unique in that he would continually evolve and get better, which is something many writers have lost sight of. His more mundane problems as a teen were not supposed to plague the character for ever - he was supposed to grow up, get a GOOD job (not continually be a freakin' photographer), get married, etc. Although Slott's writing does have a lot of faults, it is certainly one of the first times in recent years where Peter has actually evolved, though Horizon Labs and Parker Industries. If only he had been on the title without the stupid OMD.

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@zarius said:

Gail Simone has tweeted she wants to write Spidey. AND she wants MJ to be a major part of the book and give the two some stability.

Would you care to repeat that bit about wanting Slott to stay on knowing talent like that potentially waits in the wings?

Also, I'll be glad to see Peter back to his roots for Renew Your Vows. He's not Reed Richards/Tony Stark, that's not why anyone likes him. Parker Industries was interesting, but it's something that can only be told in the age of deconstructive storytelling ,it exists to prove Peter can't be this kind of person all of the time, it's far above his station.

And you know this how? Writers have always tried to build up Peter's potential on levels like Tony and Pym, the only aspect Peter can't rise up in is himself(cuz he holds himself back(, he isn't incapable of doing anything that the greats can do. Peter is always in the gutter middle due to PIS writing and established a underdog, so I call BS that he can't be a kind of person like Stark or hell even Reed.

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you know its funny, when I started reading comics again after 28 years away, the two characters I most wanted to buy a comic for in Marvel where Spiderman and Hulk, because we go way, way back. Hulk comics have been garbage for years now so I am not buying a Hulk comic and I just couldn't get on with the Amazing Spiderman when It restarted. I actually like the jokey Spiderman with wisecracks as that's what Spidey is about, but nothing really happens! I mean, read any Batman comic by Snyder and you get core Batman attributes in it, but in the Spiderman comics, I didn't see any agility, any amazing fighting skill, any super strong strength....just a fair bit of jerking around and the relationship issues involving Silk and Cat....

I think Dan Slott does write a fun comic and I love his Silver Surfer comic, but perhaps we just need a new writer on Spiderman. When I read my old Roger Stern Omnibus I see what I am missing....

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magnetic_eye

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Personally, the best part of Slott's run has been letting Peter finally move on from low-paying jobs and silly money problems and get a great job as a super-scientist, utilizing his intellect as one of the smartest people in the world. I am getting tired of Slott's stories now, but I would rather have him AND Parker Industries/Horizon Labs rather than switching him out for any writer if that writer would once again make him a loser.

@jimishim12 said:

And you know this how? Writers have always tried to build up Peter's potential on levels like Tony and Pym, the only aspect Peter can't rise up in is himself(cuz he holds himself back(, he isn't incapable of doing anything that the greats can do. Peter is always in the gutter middle due to PIS writing and established a underdog, so I call BS that he can't be a kind of person like Stark or hell even Reed.

As much as I strongly dislike Slott's writing style, I actually didn't mind seeing Peter put his intellect to good use and earning some decent money. I don't doubt that Peter can't be as great as Stark, Richards or Pym. He is capable of doing anything that the greats can do, but I think Peter operates best outside of the limelight, not as an underdog or as the (down on his luck) loser, but as the non braggart silent achiever. Peter's personality is vastly different to that of Stark, Richards or Pym.

@bezza said:

you know its funny, when I started reading comics again after 28 years away, the two characters I most wanted to buy a comic for in Marvel where Spiderman and Hulk, because we go way, way back. Hulk comics have been garbage for years now so I am not buying a Hulk comic and I just couldn't get on with the Amazing Spiderman when It restarted. I actually like the jokey Spiderman with wisecracks as that's what Spidey is about, but nothing really happens! I mean, read any Batman comic by Snyder and you get core Batman attributes in it, but in the Spiderman comics, I didn't see any agility, any amazing fighting skill, any super strong strength....just a fair bit of jerking around and the relationship issues involving Silk and Cat....

I think Dan Slott does write a fun comic and I love his Silver Surfer comic, but perhaps we just need a new writer on Spiderman. When I read my old Roger Stern Omnibus I see what I am missing....

Love both the "Batman" and "Detective" titles. Extremely well written books. The Spider-Man of the last seven or so years is by far and large not the same Amazing Spider-Man we have had for decades. It isn't new or refreshing. Peter Parker is a shell of his former self.

I love Roger Stern's run. Awesome writer who has written some of the greatest Spider-Man stories. He gets the character of Peter Parker. Yes indeed, I am missing that Spider-Man very much.

I think most Spidey fans enjoy the humor actually - I think that they get annoyed when the constant injection of humor that can sometimes ruin darker tales. Slott does that quite often.

Annoyed is an understatement. It's the constant injection of juvenile humor that makes it worse. As I have mentioned in many posts, Spider-Man comics used to be about more than just lighthearted comedic fun. I like the jokey wisecracking Spider-Man too, but it needs to be balanced out with some serious drama, action, in depth characterizations, and the occasional slice of life realism. Darker, grittier tales should not be confused with making comparisons to Batman comics either.

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daredevil21134

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1. No understanding of Peter Parker's character.

2. Uses simplistic clichéd dialogue akin to Saturday morning TV cartoons.

3. Cannot write character driven stories, only loose plot driven ones.

4. Thinks anyone can be Spider-Man.

5. Hates Mary Jane's character.

6. Has made Spider-Man a support character in his own title.

7. Has turned Spider-Man into an ineffective, immature, hedonistic buffoon.

8. Is a petulant man-child troll on the Internet.

9. Put a megalomaniac (Doc Ock) in control of Peter's body.

10. Spider-Verse: a "Where's Waldo" nonsensical event.

11. Silk: a force fed bland character, an obvious Mary Sue character.

12. Stories are nonsensical, endings are rushed, no character development, filled with plot holes, badly written with anti climatic, dull and unsatisfactory endings.

Everything Mark Waid did to Daredevil but it's still highly praised even though numbers don't prove it.

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kcomicfan

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There is not a lot wrong with slott's run on spider-man. He clearly understands the character and he clearly loves Spider-man. The storys he wrote dipped in quality, picked up around superior and then dipped in quality again. But aside from that, and nit picking, Slott's run on Spider-man has been really good.

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The_Waffle

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There is not a lot wrong with slott's run on spider-man. He clearly understands the character and he clearly loves Spider-man. The storys he wrote dipped in quality, picked up around superior and then dipped in quality again. But aside from that, and nit picking, Slott's run on Spider-man has been really good.

Fair enough. I respectfully, disagree completely though imo Slotts run has been mediocre, okay at best.

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Catty_Spider1

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@magnetic_eye: You can add turning Black Cat Heel in the worst way possible to your list too

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magnetic_eye

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@magnetic_eye: You can add turning Black Cat Heel in the worst way possible to your list too

Okay, done.

13. Turned Black Cat into an inconsiderate heel of a person, in the worst way possible.

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spider11211

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I think the issue we have is that we have fans from the beginning, and new fans. The fans that have been reading for many years tend to have a bigger overall picture of the character and past history to draw from; where new readers do not have as much history to draw from. This disconnect creates opposing views based on observation. This observational difference creates multiple interpretations of what the character is and who he should be. Would it not be fair to say that people that have read the series from the start tend to have a better overall view of the character?

This seems to be the root of why the character is not viewed as the same anymore.

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silent_bomber

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There is not a lot wrong with Slott's run on spider-man. He clearly understands the character and he clearly loves Spider-man. The stories he wrote dipped in quality, picked up around superior and then dipped in quality again.

But aside from that, and nit picking, Slott's run on Spider-man has been really good.

Pretty much (though from what I've read I thought the latter half of superior was when it started dipping)

I think the main thing may be that Slott's run has just gone on too long tbh, having stories which are essentially just lightweight fun is enjoyable once in a while but I think for many people it can wear thin over a sustained period.

I think the issue we have is that we have fans from the beginning, and new fans. The fans that have been reading for many years tend to have a bigger overall picture of the character and past history to draw from; where new readers do not have as much history to draw from. This disconnect creates opposing views based on observation.

Agreed. For example, I am a Black Cat fan, but I'm really not that outraged by what Slott has done with the character. Black Cat's personality has changed so many times over the years that his take on her isn't really even without precedent.

Peter David wrote Black Cat as a pretty horrible person, Micheline's wasn't so bad, but was still very petty and manipulative.

Roger Stern's Black Cat is still my favourite.

Slott's Spider-Man reminds me more of the Romita Sr era, with maybe some elements of the cartoons thrown in. That would either be classed as a "regression" of the character, or a "Back to his roots/back to basics" approach depending on whether you like it or not :)

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kcomicfan

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This disconnect creates opposing views based on observation. This observational difference creates multiple interpretations of what the character is and who he should be. Would it not be fair to say that people that have read the series from the start tend to have a better overall view of the character?

This seems to be the root of why the character is not viewed as the same anymore.

There is nothing wrong with people having different interpretations of a character.

No it would not be fair, You don't have to be there in the early days of a characters creation to understand who that character is. As long as someone has read enough of the character to know there basic characteristics and motivations and they like the character they can say they understand the character

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Zarius

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Different interpretations are fine. It is through different opinions a writer has that lead to certain developments with the character, but usually the best developments are ones that don't feel like they come out of left field and come across as a natural extension of who the characters are. To the extent that when these pay-offs occur, you root for/relate to the character more and understand the decisions that led to their moment of clarity or moment of madness.

These days, the writers for many characters, not just Spidey, are more content to abandon the roots/basics of a character just to bend them to a different whim purely for the sake of adding a new layer, and slipping on a new shoe regardless of how well it fits the wearer.

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kcomicfan

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@zarius said:

Different interpretations are fine. It is through different opinions a writer has that lead to certain developments with the character, but usually the best developments are ones that don't feel like they come out of left field and come across as a natural extension of who the characters are. To the extent that when these pay-offs occur, you root for/relate to the character more and understand the decisions that led to their moment of clarity or moment of madness.

These days, the writers for many characters, not just Spidey, are more content to abandon the roots/basics of a character just to bend them to a different whim purely for the sake of adding a new layer, and slipping on a new shoe regardless of how well it fits the wearer.

The thing is Dan Slott does this. Peter being a scientist is a natural extension of the characters genius and it feels right for the character considering he built web shooters at the age of 15. And you can root for the character of Peter Parker because his life is finally going right.

Slott might have done something different with the character, but Peter still has his motivation of with great power comes great responsibility and Slott has clearly changed the characters status quo because he likes the character rather then writing storys to add stuff to the characters mythos.

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Punkaiser

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@jimishim12: I don't completely hate Dan Slott. I actually like Superior Spider-Man. It was an interesting idea that followed through spectacularly. I enjoyed the ending, but had I developed distaste for a few of the effects, that I need not mention. But, Kraven's Last Hunt is a far more superior story. Unlike Superior Spider-man, Kraven's Last Hunt focused on Peter, not the villain in title. It is in no way overrated. 10/10 or 9/10 is a perfect assessment. The darkness and psychological battle that Peter has to deal himself witrh, stretched himself so far as a character. The worry Mary Jane has to suffer right after their marriage, is the first true test to this new life they just began together. Kraven completed his goal and Spider-Man was able to return from the grave. It's an everyone wins situation in the darkest sense. It seems to me that you are far too invested in the lighthearted, wise-cracking presentation of Peter Parker, rather than his struggle to fulfill his responsibility and sacrifice the time he would have rather spent with his friends and family. That's why I think its better than Superior Spider-Man.