Terms you hate seeing thrown around

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SC

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#51 SC  Moderator

@veshark said:

@sc This comment has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of discussion but Sweet Christmas man, every time I see one of your replies, it's like a college dissertation xD

Oh thank you, I think. ^_^

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SideburnGuru

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#52  Edited By SideburnGuru

Hater.

When someone makes valid criticism of why something is bad, is instantly called a hater as a cop-out.

You're just a hater of the word hater.

Hater.

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Veshark

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@sc said:

@veshark said:

@sc This comment has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of discussion but Sweet Christmas man, every time I see one of your replies, it's like a college dissertation xD

Oh thank you, I think. ^_^

You're welcome. Mad props to you for putting in the work :D

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Dabee

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Nazi. Everyone who exhibits any authority (TSA agents at the airport, the Obama administration with this scandal that's going to blow over soon), people always compare it to Nazis and compare people to Hitler. It's just thrown around WAY too much, because Hitler and the Nazis are on... just... a whole different level. Not even comparable in the slightest bit at all. Just my opinion.

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akbogert

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@veshark said:

@sc This comment has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of discussion but Sweet Christmas man, every time I see one of your replies, it's like a college dissertation xD

It has something to do with it, since it was a direct response to me defending the term PIS since multiple people listed it as a term they hate seeing thrown around (you know, the topic :P). To be fair, I did say that I wasn't sure whether a discussion of PIS's validity deserved its own thread or could be conducted here. But if it's considered too tangential that's my fault, not SC's.

@sc said:

@akbogert: Well, I am not sure how the other poster applied it, but I am a person who disagrees with the term PIS as a real meaningful thing, whilst also recognizing its value as a subjective social construct. Plot induced stupidity is just a lazy term really that is usually invoked in cases of inconsistency and usually because of the plot and or writers discretion. How does one apply the stupid context? Its a bit problematic since such a term/concept can differ subjectively, and be applied as such. I mean if there was a thread of greatest PIS moments (and there is probably one) it would be pretty easy for a smart and creative person to go in and explain how the scene may not be that stupid and or alternatively a smart and knowledgable person could take most scenes in comics and explain how the scene could be very very stupid due to plot reasons. Additionally a lot of well referenced PIS moments usually had some context that most readers were not aware of and or has some writer explanation justification that bridges the perception of PIS to what was meant to happen. Another aspect is what some people consider stupid? Others consider silly, and many writers and fans are okay with a bit of silly, but some aren't and they in turn use a term like stupid.

If there is stupidity and inconsistency in a comic or in anything, I personally think its better to just actually say why and how, as an example - "X-23 in Avengers Arena acting like an impulsive unprepared inexperienced dolt is inconsistent with her main bulk of portrayals and characterization, and we can see this is probably due to the writer wishing to advance the main plot and create a sense of tension and fear for readers as well as put the other characters in a difficult spot, which aren't bad objectives, just the use of X-23 and mischaracterization and misrepresentation of the characters skills and abilities undermine the overall effect for those not ignorant on the character" versus "X-23 in that book was PIS" which may be accurate depending on a persons definition but that claim is so watery. So many people can invoke it on whim and whim alone which combined with depending on a persons ability to define something as stupid can lead to situations where good books are full of PIS depending on the criteria applied (knowing about genetics rendering X-23's origin story stupid and PIS, knowledge of physics rendering characters like Galactus stupid and PIS or maybe just silly and or suspending disbelief) makes the term a bit useless, unless used as short hand to start conversation rather than a term used to end conversation which many often try to do in Battles/Versus threads - which even then never works well since people want to know why something is PIS. Heh heh.

Hope that helps shed light.

I'm going to go out on a limb and suppose that you have a more nuanced reason for disagreeing with the term PIS than most of the people who said they hate it -- primarily because you have a more nuanced reason for most things than most people, haha. This may seem weird coming from me of all people, but I don't understand the problem with using a general, nonspecific term if it is sufficient, rather than spending a paragraph or so explaining something. To some extent, that's what you allowed for in your response: "unless used as short hand to start conversation rather than a term used to end conversation." When I say PIS, I at least feel confident enough that I can elaborate and elucidate should it be needed. But if no one specifically asks, it usually is a lot faster than trying to explain precisely why the characterization is off or some basic canonical restrictions are being disregarded. Since people know that that is what is implied by PIS, unless someone has a specific objection or doesn't understand why someone might classify something as PIS, it saves everyone a bit of time.

Ultimately, while it is not as clear as it could be, and while it is often misused, it still refers to a reality in comics, or at least something which is commonly acknowledged enough that saying "there's no such thing" strikes me as absurd. Which is actually what I said earlier. I understand that it can be overused, so I actually do understand people hating it being "thrown around" (as the topic title suggests) insomuch as it is carelessly or inappropriately said with great frequency. But it does exist.

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SC

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#57  Edited By SC  Moderator

@akbogert said:

I'm going to go out on a limb and suppose that you have a more nuanced reason for disagreeing with the term PIS than most of the people who said they hate it -- primarily because you have a more nuanced reason for most things than most people, haha. This may seem weird coming from me of all people, but I don't understand the problem with using a general, nonspecific term if it is sufficient, rather than spending a paragraph or so explaining something. To some extent, that's what you allowed for in your response: "unless used as short hand to start conversation rather than a term used to end conversation." When I say PIS, I at least feel confident enough that I can elaborate and elucidate should it be needed. But if no one specifically asks, it usually is a lot faster than trying to explain precisely why the characterization is off or some basic canonical restrictions are being disregarded. Since people know that that is what is implied by PIS, unless someone has a specific objection or doesn't understand why someone might classify something as PIS, it saves everyone a bit of time.

Ultimately, while it is not as clear as it could be, and while it is often misused, it still refers to a reality in comics, or at least something which is commonly acknowledged enough that saying "there's no such thing" strikes me as absurd. Which is actually what I said earlier. I understand that it can be overused, so I actually do understand people hating it being "thrown around" (as the topic title suggests) insomuch as it is carelessly or inappropriately said with great frequency. But it does exist.

Thanks. Well alternatively when you use the term PIS you probably have more reasons that attempt to be objective and reasonable for doing so than the average poster, rather than using it when something in a story happens in a way you disagree about? The vague nature of the word leads it to being abused, like I am not certain but I from what I can tell the word was invented/phrased at CBR for use in VS boards and threads to try and discourage posters for talking about instances like when Spider-man and Firelord issue where Spider-man fights and beats Firelord a Herald of Galactus. Which the writer actually had fair reasoning for having issue read that way, similar to how Black Panther put Silver Surfer in an armbar (and that writer having a reason as well, that was lost on many fans) but because what a writer intends isn't always what a reader interprets and a reader may not be comfortable or capable of questioning their own take on a story they can sometimes assert they know why something presented was presented and that it was due to the plot and for done stupidly. Example Spider-man beating a character that for those who value consistency and established patterns he maybe shouldn't be able to? Except at the same time anyone that knows of creative story telling knows that sometimes a good story requires talking about the time the very unlikely underdog hero beat the very formidable, fearsome, powerful villain. That is often a large part of many fictional stories, and can benefit characters and stories rather than say be stupid.

Like what would you give as an example of PIS, and if you wished I could try and explain why maybe thats not the best term for it? I think what the other poster meant, not literally it doesn't exist, but that unless the writer is trying to make it stupid, its not really stupid, because if it is by virtue of a fan judging it so? Then everything can by definition become PIS, if its fans opinions granting it so. Most superheroes method of getting superpowers is PIS in that case so if a lot of their origins are PIS then well sure all stories they are in possesses PIS. PIS loses its value as a word really ironically - assuming it had value which I am assuming some like the other poster believe it never had hence it "doesn't exist" except maybe as a flawed or niche construct.

I agree its a fast way to communicate a certain idea, which is why my criticism of the word isn't the same as others but I can empathize with their objections. It also helps that 90 times out of a 100 when I see the word there isn't actually any plot induced stupidity behind the claim heh heh but that might be because I have high standards when it comes to using words like stupid. Oh and I prefer the term PII or PPI as in Plot Induced Inconsistency or Plot Prioritized Inconsistency or just saying that a writer sucks at characterization or continuity. Also if a book with lots of PIS sells twice as much as a book with no PIS is it really fair to accuse the writer of stupidity with their plot or the opposite since their paycheck is better and they know a lot of fans don't know their continuity or characterization as well as a certain minority of fans? That fans also can fall for and find many tropes appealing hence continual use as plots.

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Veshark

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@akbogert

H'whuh? I think you might have misinterpreted my comment friend. I didn't mean 'this comment' in reference to SC's, I was talking about my own post. Which had nothing to do with the topic at hand....I just wanted to give him props for the amount of work he puts into his essay-like replies.

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Kal'smahboi

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Dead weight. Seems to me that most people have no idea how to use he phrase correctly.

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SOG7dc

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Hater.

When someone makes valid criticism of why something is bad, is instantly called a hater as a cop-out.

omg yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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SOG7dc

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@dabee:

i agree. i thin in todays world we, as a whole, exhibit a wholly ignorance of the words we use; many of which are addressed in this thread. Words like epic, awesome, stupid, amazing etc. the consequence of this is that our words then go the way of the American dollar--perpetually losing value. its sad to see other black people use the n-word so frivolously because more often than not they lack a competent understanding of the weight that word carries and the history behind it. i think what happens is people are generally lazy and therefore unwilling to open their minds and observe the things around them rather than just being aware of them. so in turn we use words that we think we understand to describe situations that do not merit the use of such words.

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JulieDC

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#62  Edited By JulieDC

words i hate when dealing with comics:

realistic

relatable

overpowered

grounded

I also hate this phrase "if you don't like it, then don't read it" and variations of it. How can you improve something if you don't state what you find wrong with it???

I also hate it on forums when people say, stuff like "this question again" and variations of that as well. Its really pointless and unnecessary and doesn't add anything to the actual forum.

and i also hate the use of acronyms because then I have to figure out what it means and then remember it.

Will avoid words outside of comics that annoy me because I will end up angering way too many people....

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BiteMe-Fanboy

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#63  Edited By BiteMe-Fanboy

Probably almost every term a rapper comes up with.