Magician (a character who uses magic) vs mystical entity (a character who is inherently magical)

The purpose behind creating this thread is to find out the characteristics of a magician and the characteristics of a mystical entity whilst comparing the two.

I could be wrong on many accounts, but the following is my understanding of the whole thing:

For example, Doctor Strange is a magician, whilst Dormammu is inherently a mystical entity. From my understanding , magicians like Doctor Strange who mainly use magic without inherently being mystical rely on external sources to obtain the energy needed to cast spells and perform other magical / mystical actions. Those external sources could be another mystical realm. Or it could be another mystical entity to draw the magical energy from for use. Such characters don't have any inherent magical powers which they can use from within themselves. They require external sources.

On the other hand, inherently mystical entities such as Dormammu, Eternity, Mistress Death, Cyttorak and Odin possess magical / mystical energies within themselves. The source of their magic is themselves. They don't require an external source like Doctor Strange or Doctor Doom require.

What I want to find out is if magicians like Doctor Strange and Doctor Doom have any inherent magical characteristics. I mean, since they would need external sources to cast their spells, such as summoning or drawing energy from a mystical entity, how could they themselves beat another inherent mystical entity when considering that the source of their very magic they use is from those mystical entities themselves? Suppose every mystical entity decides to not allow Doctor Strange and Doctor Doom to draw their magical energy for use, could they ever use magic again? Since they are not inherently magical, is there anything they could do to not rely on other entities (assuming they decide to not allow for the use of their mystical energies to others like Doctor Doom and Doctor Strange)?

How would Doctor Strange beat an inherently mystical entity like Dormammu using magic? Would Doctor Strange require magic from other mystical entities to use against Dormammu, such as entities like Cyttorak, Eternity and etc?

Magic isn't really me forte, nor am I too knowledgeable on it.

Thanks in advance for sharing all the input, views, perspectives and opinions!

@whoisthebest@sirfizzwhizz@decaf_wizard@jrupert1@thewhitecrown@krleavenger @

@ganstaz003: I'll reply later.

No worries mate!

Who said that magicians only use powers from outside sources? Like I said in another thread: Magic in Marvel is divided into three single categories( Which have sub-categories, but this isn't important now).

Egocentric Magic: Derived from personal powers like the soul/mind.

Ecocentric Magic: Derived from the environment.

Exocentric Magic: Derived from extradimensional sources and beings.

They all have been discovered by Agamotto, who was the first Sorcerer Supreme and is also the son of the Elder God Oshtur. Agamotto is the one responsible for teaching magic to humanity and others(Especially the mages/sorcerers who later formed the city of Atlantis):

One of Strange's first Bios during Marvel's Offical Handbook Vol.3#04 backups/shows this:

Many other sources also have the information, such as Marvel's Offical Handbook- Marvel Knights(2000)#04:

Dormammu's Bio in the same Handbook further explain the difference between a magical entity like him and Strange:

Another thing is that those who truly read the comics know that practically all of Strange's fights against Dormammu have some sort of context involved or a plot as some call. Strange has many specific advantages that only him has over the Dread One, such as the Eye of Agamotto.....An artifact toxic and dangerous to beings similar and like Dormy:

Another instance that expanded this was when The Eye while working through Agamotto's will was overpowering an amped Dormammu and the same had to seal since its power was too great and dangerous for him to use it during Doctor Strange, Sorcerer Supreme#01:

Don't trust in users who keep posting Wiki's as evidence since most of the pages are entirely out-of-context. Dormammu is and always been marginally above Strange magical-wise and his most modern Bio even confirms that his power dwarfs that of any sorcerer:

Stephen is a character suited to fight against the likes of magical beings such as him and Dormammu usually underestimate Strange because of their history together. In fact, this is what Dormammu said about Strange beating him in the past:

Strange also knows how to fight Dormammu(His weakness and all) and many instances prove this, which is one of the reasons for the powers from other extradimensional entities against him( Something you already pointed out). There's a big difference between minor mystical beings and others such as Shuma-Gorath and the Vishanti, so it's not far-fetched for magicians to defeat those low one0s using magic if backed by powerful forces and enchantments.

Suppose every mystical entity decides to not allow Doctor Strange and Doctor Doom to draw their magical energy for use, could they ever use magic again?

That happened to Strange after the War of the Seven Spheres during Doctor Strange, Sorcerer Supreme#49. He still could use magic from other sources but was unable to call upon any mystical beings.

Gallery

I'm pretty sure @wastelandman can contribute to the discussion as well.

@laylah:

Honestly, you pretty much covered it. I could only really provide further evidence/examples of mystics obtaining their magic from sources other than deities. For instance, During the Last Days of Magic when the Impirikul had already drained nearly all of the magic in the universe and all the mages lost most of their magic, Voodoo still retained most of his because most of his magic is derived from the Earth:

A good portion of Strange's magic is also originates from his talismans. Here Strange's power increases significantly simply from having his talismans returned to his dimension after Agamotto had whisked them away previously:

Gallery

So as already shown, invocation is far from a mystic's only source of magical energy.

@laylah: @wastelandman:

Thanks for the scans and the input. Appreciated!

I now have a few questions I'd like to ask:

1. Is it fair to say that more often than not, when everything is equal, a purely mystical entity (Dormammu) would beat someone who uses magic but is not purely a mystical being like themselves (Doctor Strange)?
2. What are some examples of characters who are purely 100% mystical that have inherent abilities to use magic from within themselves?
3. Are there characters who are partly mystical (ability to use magic inherently from within themselves) and partly something else, like biological for example? If there are, what are some examples?
4. Would Doctor Strange be classified as a mystical entity in some form or is he someone who only uses magic from external sources without having the ability to use magic inherently from within himself?
5. Would any character that has the ability to use magic inherently from within themselves be classified as a mystical entity?

@ganstaz003: I think you're confusing a few things and terms, friend. Doctor Strange as any other magician is capable of using magic within themselves(Mind and soul), but they can't spontaneously generate their own and specific types of magic like entities such as Cyttorak and others, I think the only exception is Wiccan given his status/form as Demiurge( Which can indeed be classified as a mystical entity in that state). One of your questions have already been answered by my post above as well, I explained that Dormammu would and is more powerful than Strange when the situations don't favor the later. Stephen isn't a mystical entity and neither is any practitioners of the mystical arts aside from Wiccan and possibly Agamotto before ascending to the Vishanti through his mother.

Thanks for the input mate!

Thanks! I'd like to make a few points in response.

Not only is Doctor Doom's or Iron Man's technology inferior to the Celestial's, it's also inferior to some of the other extraterrestrial Marvel civilizations such as the Shiar. Those extra-galactic civilizations are astronomically more advanced than Earth in terms of science and technology.

Wouldn't Thor be partly mystical and partly biological as well? He doesn't appear to be 100% mystical like Cyttorak or Dormammu for example.