What changes would you make to it?
If you were in charge of DBZ...
Alot of DBZ threads today.
I'd leave it as is for the most part. Maybe get rid of Goten and Kid Trunks.
Beata
Calm down on the screaming and power up times.
Make sure Broly never existed.
Make it more fun (like DB and GT).
Let other people than Goku and Gohan get the spotlight.
@jashro44: Gross.
I would make Goten the hero by passing the torch from Gohan to him like In the cell games where Goku had Gohan Fight Cell. Also I wold make sure GT never happened. And the final opponent the Z fighters would fight would be Broly cause he is the supposed to be the legendary SS and his last two movies did not do him any justice especially Bio Broly.
PS- who has seen the new DBZ F trailer it looks meh to me, what are your opinions? that's if the OP doesn't mind me asking.
I would reboot it and actually have a plot, good characters, and a real story. Also it wouldn't take 5 to 10 episodes to get through one damn fight...
@darling_luna: LOL agree
- Make a prequel series
- Revamp GT (I like Baby/the shadow dragons, but the execution was pretty bad),
- Make a continuation series
- Bring back the relevancy of characters not named Goku
- Elaborate on the Kai system and how it works
- Bring out some more character development
- Incorperate some of the non-cannon characters into the cannon (For example, stick bojack right after cell saga, Goku heals after vegeta but still can't go to namek with the others because of injuries from Turles, ext)
- Kill as many inconsistencies as possible.
- Have an arc where King Piccolo returns and takes over Piccolo's body, and have Gohan have to fight and kill him.
- Erase that whole Vegeta x Bulma thing, because that was just stupid and instead have him take the place of Piccolo since he's dead as the loner of the group.
- Have Nappa have been the one to kill Yamcha instead of a Saibaman.
- Rework all the movies and GT into the canon proper.
- More focus on the humans and let them actually kill an enemy.
So, aside from really just bringing everything together, a new arc, and a much more appropriate development set for Vegeta, pretty much the same.
- Create new villains with different powersets in order to give the z-fighters more unique and varied chalenges
- Make Z-fighters aside from Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, Goten and trunks useful and formidable.
- Like others said I'd "reboot" GT. I think there were some good ideas there but just very bad execution.
- Make Broly apart of canon. I wouldn't just say "He's canon, now" but I'd make him the next villain and remove the inconsistencies from his history.
- I'd give more clarity as to who the first SS was and what happened to them.
- Develop Planet Vegeta more and incorporate some more Saiyan women.
- More useful female characters in general.
- Focus on humans developing into a "warrior race" as Vegeta once said they had the potential to be.
- Explore what is so special about Human/Saiyan Hybrids.
- Kill ChiChi and Hercule.
I'd also have Gohan go back to wearing his piccolo style clothes. He looked way more badass like that. Also I'd take Gohan back to being something like a "Hulk" meaning he's mostly peaceful and docile but he has the overwhelming strength inside him that scares even his closest allies. Possibly even have an arc where Goku has to kill Gohan in order to save the world. Like Goku kills Gohan Gohan trains withe kais to master this power then they wih Gohan back.
@sog7dc: I agree with everything you said except for killing ChiChi. Was there ever one Saiyan woman shown before?
One that I recall was in the Bardock movie. She was a part of his "team". There may have been a few more in the bar scene on Vegeta in the same film.
Load everyone up with as many FEATS as my mind can process. Goku would have ripped a star in half long ago if I was writing...........And of course story, characters, villains would all be a priority but I'd establish power first so the fanbase can stop speculating.
I would erase DBGT from history.
I would reboot it and actually have a plot, good characters, and a real story. Also it wouldn't take 5 to 10 episodes to get through one damn fight...
@sog7dc: I agree with everything you said except for killing ChiChi. Was there ever one Saiyan woman shown before?
One that I recall was in the Bardock movie. She was a part of his "team". There may have been a few more in the bar scene on Vegeta in the same film.
@realitywarper - DBGT is not Canon. This is about DBZ.
@lukehero - I agree with this wholeheartedly however I do also think the power scale for DBZ characters was too ridiculous IE Android 17.
@sog7dc - There was a female Saiyan on Team Bardock. Her name is Fasha - dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Fasha .There were multiple saiyan women. It was not common for saiyan women to be fighters though according to the manga as well as the Bardock movie. I would assume the overall majority of the Bardock movie takes place in military bases / government facilities of Planet Vegeta. They were also pretty much being wiped out by Frieza at the time so it would not make sense to have a lot of females running around at the time either as Frieza was using Saiyans for his gain.
IMO - I would reboot the series entirely and go much more into detail on Super Saiyans as a whole, I would also completely remove the Buu Saga and the movies.
"I would also completely remove the Buu Saga and the movies."
That would be a mistake IMO especially removing some of the movies. Cooler and his movies were interesting, and so were Fusion Reborn and Tree of Might. Speaking of movies would you also remove BOG and Return of Frieza?
1. I would have never made the characters from DB irrelevant.
2. Starting at the Frieza saga, I wouldn't have had Frieza so damn powerful. Therefore Super Saiyan wouldn't be as powerful either.
3. I would have made Super Saiyan have major drawbacks, it would have been as exhausting as Kao Ken, but not have the death drawbacks. That way the whole series wouldn't be based on just power scaling.
4. The DB original cast wouldn't be obsolete this way. They would still be able to hang with Goku if they played their defenses in a smart way or came up with new techniques.
5. Fights would have been more technical based, and not just spamming powerful attacks.
In summary, I would have found a way to keep everything balanced and not have the Saiyans have all of the attention.
"I would also completely remove the Buu Saga and the movies."
That would be a mistake IMO especially removing some of the movies. Cooler and his movies were interesting, and so were Fusion Reborn and Tree of Might. Speaking of movies would you also remove BOG and Return of Frieza?
Yes. I would completely reboot the series making most of the movies pointless. I would go way more into detail on origins of characters. DBZ is known for just introducing a character as an overpowered monster / villain and going from there.
"I would also completely remove the Buu Saga and the movies."
That would be a mistake IMO especially removing some of the movies. Cooler and his movies were interesting, and so were Fusion Reborn and Tree of Might. Speaking of movies would you also remove BOG and Return of Frieza?
Yes. I would completely reboot the series making most of the movies pointless. I would go way more into detail on origins of characters. DBZ is known for just introducing a character as an overpowered monster / villain and going from there.
I see a worthy goal. I personally would keep certain ideas/concepts such as the Gods of Destruction and what not. Just for kicks what origin would you do for Kid Buu?
Make non-canon stuff intertwine with the canon story.
Make Yamcha on par with Tien & Krillin.
Tarble would be a new Z Fighter.
I would not give him one. Buu Saga is not even considered canon. Therefore I would not give him one. lol.
I'd pretty much remove Buu saga in general.
What about Cell? Just a quick rundown of what you would do with him please?
I would make them power up far more slowly. They go from 9000 to 400,000 in the span of like 15 episodes. And then it just goes bonkers from there. The power readers was a neat idea, but it was obsolete shortly after they introduced it.
If a farmer with a shotgun registers at 15, having Goku at the Vegeta fight peak around 300 would have been impressive. Then 1k could be super saiyan. And do it steadily like that.
I would have stopped the SSJ transformations after the first Super Saiyan, first of all. Every transformation after that was ultimately pointless and only served to put a bigger gap between Goku and his supporting cast. Super Saiyan would still be this huge power boost that puts the saiyans who can achieve it above everyone else, but it wouldn't be the be all end all of combat either.
I would have kept the Dodonpa, or Dodon Ray, technique relevant. The fact that a technique that was said to be deadlier than the Kamehameha by Master Roshi himself was just forgotten really annoyed me. The Dodonpa would give Tien and Chiaotzu a technique that can potentially kill stronger opponents than themselves as the move was a highly concentrated beam of burning ki energy. Combined with Krillin's Destructo Disc the human characters would have extremely efficient, lethal attacks that could make them dangerous to more powerful enemies, allowing them to make up for the power level gap with ingenuity and creativity. Piccolo similarly would use his Special Beam Cannon more frequently, eventually being able to fire it quickly without a huge charge up period, to give him more lethality in his power set as well.
In this way the non-saiyan characters would be relevant late into the series with their special techniques and efficient use of ki, while the more powerful saiyans utilize large, yet inefficient, blasts like the Big Bang Attack and Kamehameha, as they have a much larger ki reserve to draw from than the rest and can afford such moves.
I'd probably have also kept Goku's power pole. I'm sure an indestructible, magic weapon that can change it's size would have been useful against later villains. By the same token I'd have kept Trunks with his sword. Maybe have Bulma rig up some sort of ultra dense super metal to forge his sword from so he can keep slashing enemies past Frieza up. Everyone's favorite part about Trunks was his sword, it should have been kept. On the other hand, though, I may have not had Future Trunks use Super Saiyan form. Rather I'd prefer him to use his sword to compensate for the lack of the transformation. King Cold seemed pretty confident that a sufficiently well crafted sword could have killed Frieza without the power boost, so that's how I would have had it happen.
Speaking of Super Saiyan, the only characters that'd achieve that level would be Goku, Vegeta, and later Gohan. Super Saiyan is suppose to be a once in a thousand years sort of thing. The fact small children were able to achieve it on accident with basic training was just disappointing.
The big thing I'd focus on is Gohan. He was always the most interesting character to me, even if Piccolo was my favorite. He was kidnapped at an early age and trained by his father's greatest enemy, and was the first human/saiyan hybrid. This makes him ideal to become the next great hero after Goku, as he was originally meant to be. I'd have explored Gohan's ancestry a bit more, expanding on how being a hybrid with human emotions and saiyan battle instincts gave him the potential to be greater than either humans or saiyans if he'd ever overcome his own self doubt. Piccolo would begin his development just as in the original series, though I would have had more emphasis on Piccolo teaching Gohan the Masenko technique. The passing on of techniques from master to apprentice is a huge part of Dragonball, and I was always disappointed that this training happened off-screen. Then I'd have Gohan stay in base form all the way up to the end of the Cell Saga where Gohan would finally achieve Super Saiyan only after most of the Z Fighters were defeated by Cell. Upon achieving the form of Super Saiyan Gohan will have officially surpassed his father as the ultimate combination of human and saiyan power. I'd probably have changed the manner in which Cell killed Goku, though. Maybe have Goku realize his son isn't strong enough and may die against the bio-android, so he rushes in to save his son at the last moment only to get murdered by Cell. THAT would be the moment that pushes Gohan to achieve Super Saiyan. The emotional rage of losing his father combined with his saiyan bloodlust merging in the ultimate fighter. In the end I'd have Gohan overcome Cell with a fusion of his father's Kamehameha and Piccolo's Masenko technique.
After that Goku would STAY DEAD and serve more as a moral guide for his son, being allowed to speak to him by King Kai periodically to give advice and help him with his hardships. Gohan would go on to face Majin Buu who'd, of course, prove too powerful. Vegeta's arc would remain mostly untouched tough I'd have him fight Gohan in an attempt to prove he's still stronger than Goku's halfbreed child, or perhaps fight Piccolo which I feel would be an interesting match up we'd never seen before. Or shoot, have KRILLIN fight a now evil Vegeta after Vegeta defeats Gohan, showing that Gohan still needs time to grow. Have Krillin play as a distraction so Piccolo can get Gohan away, and have Krillin be the one to try and talk Vegeta out of his evil ways.
The androids 17 and 18 would also still be relevant in some way, especially 18 who I'd keep in the foreground to have at least one respectable female warrior on the team.
Vegeta does his self sacrifice which proves to be futile, as all self sacrifice moves in DBZ are, and the arc continues. Gohan gets training from Old Kai and actually USES the Z Sword rather than breaking it for some reason, giving him a unique fighting style similar to Future Trunks. Tie it in to when Gohan was a kid and Piccolo gave him a sword during his survival training. All fusion related matters would never have occurred as I found fusion rather annoying as a concept.
In the end Gohan uses the Z Sword and his unlocked potential to overcome Super Buu, who turns out to be incredibly hard to put down because of his regenerative abilities. Later Super Buu becomes Kid Buu, and Gohan finishes him off with the Spirit Bomb, which was taught to him by his Ghost Dad somewhere between the Super Buu and Kid Buu fight. End Game Gohan is a full powered Super Saiyan/Human Hybrid with a magic, indestructible sword who uses Piccolo's diverse fighting techniques with his father's raw power, making him the perfect combination of force and finesse.
With Vegeta and Goku gone Gohan takes Trunks and Goten on as students and begins to train Earth's next generation of guardians. The series ends with Goku and Vegeta watching the three go off, and talking about how proud they are of their sons' accomplishments, both in this timeline and the other, and how they are curious to see how powerful the next generation will become.
Were GT to be a thing I'd have COMPLETELY overhauled it and had the story focus on young adult Trunks and Goten after Gohan's training and their adventures. Pan would also be around, and would have also been trained by Gohan some time after he finished with Goten and Trunks.
I would not give him one. Buu Saga is not even considered canon. Therefore I would not give him one. lol.
I'd pretty much remove Buu saga in general.
What about Cell? Just a quick rundown of what you would do with him please?
I would go into detail about how he was actually created, IE how Gero got all of their DNA and during what fights he was able to pinpoint their weaknesses. He said he was watching the Z-Fighters and somehow knew things about the fight on Namek but how? He wasnt on Namek as far as we know.
The entire Android To Cell saga was just to vague to me. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely loved Android 17 and 18 as characters but they just didn't go into enough detail about them as a whole.
I still think my Ginyu force alternate reality idea is a good one.
I wanted to write a comedy story where the Ginyu force are super heroes that travel the galaxy to try and liberate planets from Frieza's men and at the same time save dying planets like on Star Trek. In the end, the final showdown between the Ginyu force vs Frieza would happen on Namek where they try to save the Namek people and most of the Ginyu force dies fighting Frieza, leaving Ginyu to fight Frieza one on one.
I would not give him one. Buu Saga is not even considered canon. Therefore I would not give him one. lol.
I'd pretty much remove Buu saga in general.
What about Cell? Just a quick rundown of what you would do with him please?
I would go into detail about how he was actually created, IE how Gero got all of their DNA and during what fights he was able to pinpoint their weaknesses. He said he was watching the Z-Fighters and somehow knew things about the fight on Namek but how? He wasnt on Namek as far as we know.
The entire Android To Cell saga was just to vague to me. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely loved Android 17 and 18 as characters but they just didn't go into enough detail about them as a whole.
I'd like to see that. Great ideas friend :)
I would have stopped the SSJ transformations after the first Super Saiyan, first of all. Every transformation after that was ultimately pointless and only served to put a bigger gap between Goku and his supporting cast. Super Saiyan would still be this huge power boost that puts the saiyans who can achieve it above everyone else, but it wouldn't be the be all end all of combat either.
I like this idea. I think SS3 was too far. I wouldn't have even named SS2. I would have just said that SS2 was the ultimate or perfected form of a Super Saiyan.
I would have kept the Dodonpa, or Dodon Ray, technique relevant. The fact that a technique that was said to be deadlier than the Kamehameha by Master Roshi himself was just forgotten really annoyed me. The Dodonpa would give Tien and Chiaotzu a technique that can potentially kill stronger opponents than themselves as the move was a highly concentrated beam of burning ki energy. Combined with Krillin's Destructo Disc the human characters would have extremely efficient, lethal attacks that could make them dangerous to more powerful enemies, allowing them to make up for the power level gap with ingenuity and creativity. Piccolo similarly would use his Special Beam Cannon more frequently, eventually being able to fire it quickly without a huge charge up period, to give him more lethality in his power set as well.
Agreed here. Humans shouldn't be useless especially if you want to say that Saiyan/Human hybrids are special.
In this way the non-saiyan characters would be relevant late into the series with their special techniques and efficient use of ki, while the more powerful saiyans utilize large, yet inefficient, blasts like the Big Bang Attack and Kamehameha, as they have a much larger ki reserve to draw from than the rest and can afford such moves.
I'd probably have also kept Goku's power pole. I'm sure an indestructible, magic weapon that can change it's size would have been useful against later villains. By the same token I'd have kept Trunks with his sword. Maybe have Bulma rig up some sort of ultra dense super metal to forge his sword from so he can keep slashing enemies past Frieza up. Everyone's favorite part about Trunks was his sword, it should have been kept. On the other hand, though, I may have not had Future Trunks use Super Saiyan form. Rather I'd prefer him to use his sword to compensate for the lack of the transformation. King Cold seemed pretty confident that a sufficiently well crafted sword could have killed Frieza without the power boost, so that's how I would have had it happen.
Agreed here as well. In fact, I'd have Goku and Vegeta and Broly be the only ones so far to even reach SS level. As soon as Goten and young Trunks reached it it became immediately devalued to me. Goku worked and died to only acheive it with a zenkai boost but then we have 8 year old kids that are already far stronger than Frieza. I'd have mystic Gohan be the equivalent of Goku's/Vegeta's Perfect SS mode (SSJ2). Tht way Gohan would still be that uber powerful guy from way back when.
Speaking of Super Saiyan, the only characters that'd achieve that level would be Goku, Vegeta, and later Gohan. Super Saiyan is suppose to be a once in a thousand years sort of thing. The fact small children were able to achieve it on accident with basic training was just disappointing.
LolI didn't read this before I wrote my last point. We, for the most part, agree here.
The big thing I'd focus on is Gohan. He was always the most interesting character to me, even if Piccolo was my favorite. He was kidnapped at an early age and trained by his father's greatest enemy, and was the first human/saiyan hybrid. This makes him ideal to become the next great hero after Goku, as he was originally meant to be. I'd have explored Gohan's ancestry a bit more, expanding on how being a hybrid with human emotions and saiyan battle instincts gave him the potential to be greater than either humans or saiyans if he'd ever overcome his own self doubt. Piccolo would begin his development just as in the original series, though I would have had more emphasis on Piccolo teaching Gohan the Masenko technique.
Quick point here: Masenko would be just as powerful as the kamehameha.
The passing on of techniques from master to apprentice is a huge part of Dragonball, and I was always disappointed that this training happened off-screen. Then I'd have Gohan stay in base form all the way up to the end of the Cell Saga where Gohan would finally achieve Super Saiyan only after most of the Z Fighters were defeated by Cell. Upon achieving the form of Super Saiyan Gohan will have officially surpassed his father as the ultimate combination of human and saiyan power.
This, i sort of disagree with. I really like the idea of Goku always being in the mix for the most powerful. Gohan can surpass him, but not permanently. They should all (The Z-fighters) be close in power with the exception of when one of them gains a huge boost from training or zenkai.
I'd probably have changed the manner in which Cell killed Goku, though. Maybe have Goku realize his son isn't strong enough and may die against the bio-android, so he rushes in to save his son at the last moment only to get murdered by Cell. THAT would be the moment that pushes Gohan to achieve Super Saiyan. The emotional rage of losing his father combined with his saiyan bloodlust merging in the ultimate fighter. In the end I'd have Gohan overcome Cell with a fusion of his father's Kamehameha and Piccolo's Masenko technique.
Love this.
After that Goku would STAY DEAD and serve more as a moral guide for his son, being allowed to speak to him by King Kai periodically to give advice and help him with his hardships.
I'd have Goku stay dead but only until they used the dragon balls to bring him back when they needed him like in the Buu saga. Bu, imo, should bean utterly overwhelming enemy. Even with the entire cast of Z-fighters Buu should be able to defeat them. Imagine the Z-fighters are about to win but then Fat Buu becomes Super Buu and then Gohan makes a last ditch effort to gather the dragon balls (with his immense speed) while the others sacrifice themselves. Gohan wishes Goku back just before Super Buu kills Vegeta then Gohan Vegeta and Goku fight Super Buu.
Gohan would go on to face Majin Buu who'd, of course, prove too powerful. Vegeta's arc would remain mostly untouched tough I'd have him fight Gohan in an attempt to prove he's still stronger than Goku's halfbreed child, or perhaps fight Piccolo which I feel would be an interesting match up we'd never seen before. Or shoot, have KRILLIN fight a now evil Vegeta after Vegeta defeats Gohan, showing that Gohan still needs time to grow. Have Krillin play as a distraction so Piccolo can get Gohan away, and have Krillin be the one to try and talk Vegeta out of his evil ways.
I wouldn't be opposed to this either.
The androids 17 and 18 would also still be relevant in some way, especially 18 who I'd keep in the foreground to have at least one respectable female warrior on the team.
I like the idea from GT where there were two halves of 17 that come together to make an even better android than Cell.
Vegeta does his self sacrifice which proves to be futile, as all self sacrifice moves in DBZ are, and the arc continues. Gohan gets training from Old Kai and actually USES the Z Sword rather than breaking it for some reason, giving him a unique fighting style similar to Future Trunks.
In my version I'd have Gohan be made mystic here as well. (Gohan still wouldn't be a super saiyan yet)
Tie it in to when Gohan was a kid and Piccolo gave him a sword during his survival training. All fusion related matters would never have occurred as I found fusion rather annoying as a concept.
I liked Fusions, just not the way there were handled.
In the end Gohan uses the Z Sword and his unlocked potential to overcome Super Buu, who turns out to be incredibly hard to put down because of his regenerative abilities. Later Super Buu becomes Kid Buu, and Gohan finishes him off with the Spirit Bomb,
This is where we totally disagree. I'd have Goku be the only master of the Spirit Bomb. I'd have King Kai even be reluctant to teach him. The SB would be something that noone as ever been both pure-hearted enough and skillfull enough to learn as it takes tremendous Ki control and a totally pure-heart. I just like the SB being something uniquelly Goku.
which was taught to him by his Ghost Dad somewhere between the Super Buu and Kid Buu fight. End Game Gohan is a full powered Super Saiyan/Human Hybrid with a magic, indestructible sword who uses Piccolo's diverse fighting techniques with his father's raw power, making him the perfect combination of force and finesse.
With Vegeta and Goku gone Gohan takes Trunks and Goten on as students and begins to train Earth's next generation of guardians. The series ends with Goku and Vegeta watching the three go off, and talking about how proud they are of their sons' accomplishments, both in this timeline and the other, and how they are curious to see how powerful the next generation will become.
Were GT to be a thing I'd have COMPLETELY overhauled it and had the story focus on young adult Trunks and Goten after Gohan's training and their adventures. Pan would also be around, and would have also been trained by Gohan some time after he finished with Goten and Trunks.
We agree a lot but we also have a few starkly different POVs. :3
I would make them power up far more slowly. They go from 9000 to 400,000 in the span of like 15 episodes. And then it just goes bonkers from there. The power readers was a neat idea, but it was obsolete shortly after they introduced it.
If a farmer with a shotgun registers at 15, having Goku at the Vegeta fight peak around 300 would have been impressive. Then 1k could be super saiyan. And do it steadily like that.
If the farmer was 15, I'd make Goku and Vegeta, during their first fight, be in the 20k-25k range. At the end of the fight, with zenkai boosts, Goku and Vegeta would be at 100k-120k (Zenkais should be greater the closer one comes to death, imo. Goku and Vegeta were on death's door at the end of that fight so I think a substantial increase is okay). I'd have frieza's final form be at around 450k-490k with Super Saiyan being (minimum) at 500,000 and Frieza's 100% being at 495k. When Goku transforms he's about to lose to frieza. When they reached the perfected SS form (What we know now as SS2) their power levels would be at 1,000,000. And of course, the stronger they become in their base form the stronger the SS transformaion becomes.
I'd get rid of every trashy english dub there is and replace it with the kai dub
I'd actually focus more on gohan so that his moment in the cell games doesn't appear to be out of character
I would have ended it at the cell saga.
I would erase DBGT from history.
Which is fine. Creativity thrives from conflicting ideas!
The big reason I'd want Goku to stay out of the picture is because he has a tendency to overshadow others. It was fan pressure that made Toriyama bring him back and be the hero again, which completely robbed Gohan of his chance to step up and take on the mantle of Earth's protector. As long as Goku is alive, and as long as he's the defacto strongest, Gohan can't surpass his father and come into his own as a true hero. He'll always be relegated to relying on his father to save him when things get rough. And as long as Gohan is forced to remain in his father's shadow he'll forever be the son who never lived up to his father's legend.
Personally I love the passing of the mantle. It's why Wally West is my favorite Flash. I really enjoy seeing a young, inexperienced character grow in the shadow of these great heroes only to one day step up and form his own legend. I enjoy the constant evolution of life that comes from when the son surpasses the father, or the new generation proves it can handle itself without the older generation's protection. At the same time I REALLY dislike the "status quo". Goku always being the strongest is boring to me because it means any other character will only have a fleeting moment in the spotlight before he takes it back.
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