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#1 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio
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3 hours prep for Yoda, 3 hours prep for the Army.

4 batallions of Sauron's army including Orcs, , Black Uruks, etc etc. This also includes the Balrog and all 9 Nazgul, along with the witch king,

Battle ends in death.

Batlte takes place at the death gate.

Who wins?

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#2 Posted by darkelf35 (552 posts) - - Show Bio

With prep Batman should solo

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#3 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (30227 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkelf35 said:

With prep Batman should solo

Online
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#4 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (44931 posts) - - Show Bio

How can Yoda kill the Balrog?

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#5 Posted by Dayvid3 (917 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Yoda would get worn down

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#6 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

How can Yoda kill the Balrog?

Multiple lightsaber cuts to the chest, TK throwing him around, evading attacks, etc.

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#7 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (44931 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks said:

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

How can Yoda kill the Balrog?

Multiple lightsaber cuts to the chest, TK throwing him around, evading attacks, etc.

Balrogs are made from fire and shadow, physical attacks don't hurt them

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#8 Posted by logy5000 (6842 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda loses.

@darkelf35 said:

With prep Batman should solo

Must you always troll?

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#9 Posted by Miki1111 (188 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda dies in pain and agony.

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#10 Posted by TheProwe (26 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda is not stupid to go against that much alone .. With prep, Yoda goes back to Dagobah..

And I don't exactly know how a lightsaber would fare against a Nazgul or a Balrog.. If it's enchanted (LotR-wise) then it should easily cut (and an easy win for SW but not against staggering numbers), else it'll probably just pass through (IMO)..

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#11 Posted by Captain_Awesome85 (476 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

@Kingjohnrocks said:

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

How can Yoda kill the Balrog?

Multiple lightsaber cuts to the chest, TK throwing him around, evading attacks, etc.

Balrogs are made from fire and shadow, physical attacks don't hurt them

Force Push or Lightning should do it

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#12 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (44931 posts) - - Show Bio

@Captain_Awesome85 said:

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

@Kingjohnrocks said:

@Jonny_Anonymous said:

How can Yoda kill the Balrog?

Multiple lightsaber cuts to the chest, TK throwing him around, evading attacks, etc.

Balrogs are made from fire and shadow, physical attacks don't hurt them

Force Push or Lightning should do it

And the Balrog is going to stand around and take it? Balrogs are Maiar, the same race of angelic spirits that Sauron comes from.

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#13 Posted by Chaos Prime (11585 posts) - - Show Bio

Can Yoda kill the Witch King being non female?

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#14 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda dies in pain and agony.

Show me the Nazgul reacting to Yoda, and show me why he dies.

Yoda is not stupid to go against that much alone .. With prep, Yoda goes back to Dagobah..

Yoda is not stupid to go against that much alone .. With prep, Yoda goes back to Dagobah..

Yoda has taken on a few batallions of Battle Driods and solo'd them. What makes you think Yoda fails/succeeds?

And the Balrog is going to stand around and take it? Balrogs are Maiar, the same race of angelic spirits that Sauron comes from.

But they can get hurt. Give me a reason a force push/forcetoss would fail. Give me a reason a Lightsaber would also fail.

www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/yoda-vs-durins-bane/746683/

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#15 Posted by Miki1111 (188 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Balrog is a shadow being he can>t be hurt by swords.

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#16 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

If you take out The Nazgul, The Witch King, and The Balrog, then Yoda could win.

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#17 Posted by Rumble Man (11197 posts) - - Show Bio

@Chaos Prime said:

Can Yoda kill the Witch King being non female?

says no man can kill the witch king, but what gender is yoda exactly?

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#18 Posted by Batnandez (522 posts) - - Show Bio

couldn't yoda just use the force to push throw the balrog around? and if he fought sauron his saber is going to cut through his dumb mace thing

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#19 Posted by Nightflash (841 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda would win. The balrog shouldnt prove too much diffuclty. I mean yoda>>>>>gandalf. As for nazguls and witch king. He is too fast, he is duel skills are very very very high, formidable force powers and the footsoldiers are nothing compared to battle droids.

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#20 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Miki1111 said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Balrog is a shadow being he can>t be hurt by swords.

Odd, Lightsabers aren't swords. Show me a Lightsaber failing against a Balrog.

If you take out The Nazgul, The Witch King, and The Balrog, then Yoda could win.

And what's stopping Yoda from speedbitzing the Nazgul, going at speeds faster then the Balrog or the Witch King can percieve and slicing the Balrog into bite size pieces? And then slicing at the Witch King's head then going on to a meduim-long with the Army. In no way this is a stomp, and neither am I saying Yoda wins. Because in some cases the Army can win, the Witch King's scream could be effective but Yoda is a master telepath and is resistant to most Dark Side taunts/powers.

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#21 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@King@Kingjohnrocks: First, Nazgul cannot be killed, and before you say "But the witch king was killed!" He was stabbed by a sword that had enchantments deadly to him, enchantments that a lightsaber does not possess. And the Balrog is a Maia, basicly a demigod in The Lord of the Rings universe, as far as we know, only another Maia can go toe to toe with a Balrog. Plus you forgot to mention which Balrog is this? Is it Durin's Bane the one Gandalf slew? Or is it Gothmog?

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#22 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

First, Nazgul cannot be killed,

Source?

"But the witch king was killed!" He was stabbed by a sword that had enchantments deadly to him, enchantments that a lightsaber does not possess

Show me the Witch King surviving something like a Lightsaber., Nothing is stopping Yoda from slicing his head off, using force light, telekentically owning him. Yoda is much much faster then the Witch King, he has moved in a blur, fought so fast that he generated afterimages, reacted to Palpatine's attacks, avoided multiple members of the Jedi High Council unarmed and simply by jumping around,etc.

And the Balrog is a Maia, basicly a demigod in The Lord of the Rings universe

Yet there's no indication that Yoda couldn't slice up Durin's Bane or hurl him into a wall, slam him repeatedly, toss him across the sky, etc.

, as far as we know, only another Maia can go toe to toe with a Balrog

Source please?

Plus you forgot to mention which Balrog is this? Is it Durin's Bane the one Gandalf slew? Or is it Gothmog?

Durin's bane. But Yoda would win against both anyway.

I mean, Gothmog died because he fell into a river, Yoda knows how to alter the enviorment and could create rain from clouds if he wanted to.

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#23 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: As we know, Tolkien was vague when it came to things like this, all we know is that Maia are beyond mortal beings. Plus Balrogs can shield themselves in flame, making it tough for Yoda to get close, I could see him using the force on him though. The Nazgul are bound to Sauron through the nine rings he gifted to them, if you want the Nazgul to die, you'd have to take it up with Sauron, and as much as I like Yoda, I HIGHLY doubt he could defeat Sauron.

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#24 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks: As we know, Tolkien was vague when it came to things like this, all we know is that Maia are beyond mortal beings. Plus Balrogs can shield themselves in flame, making it tough for Yoda to get close, I could see him using the force on him though. The Nazgul are bound to Sauron through the nine rings he gifted to them, if you want the Nazgul to die, you'd have to take it up with Sauron, and as much as I like Yoda, I HIGHLY doubt he could defeat Sauron.

If he didn't have the ring, Yoda could beat Sauron.

How will the Balrog even be able to see Yoda/react to him? Yoda moves at speeds faster then the Balrog can percieve and can slice them up while moving in a blur.

Yoda can also use Alter Enviorment to dispell the Flames.

This still doesn't disprove the fact that Yoda can speedblitz all the Nazgul before they can react.

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#25 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

Can Yoda even use Alter Environment? Never seen him use it, unless you have proof. And If I'm not mistaken, that power uses the Force energy of the thing its being used on. The Balrog has no Force energy, so it wouldn't work. And like I said before the nazgul can't die, they will outlast until he is killed or flees.

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#26 Posted by Kellar21 (446 posts) - - Show Bio

It's on you the weight of proving.

It's you who are saying it works on them.It probaly won't because ligthsbers aren't magical and lack the necessary enchatments to hurt the Nazgul(which are Undead and non corporeal).Let alone the Witch King.

Nothing is stopping Yoda from slicing his head off

Except the fact that he doesn't have one.

Gothmog died because f***** Etchellion rammed him in the chest with this helmet(after getting both his arms cut off).And the river was way,way down.

Show me proof that normal physical attacks work on a Balrog(the ones made by the swords of elven-lords do not count because their swords are magical).It was said that normal(physical) weapons are useless against it because he was made of fire and shadow.

Lightsabers are heated plasma blades,which burn and cut,and guess what's the Balrog made of,oh yes,FIRE!!

Now normal soldiers(orcs,trolls,uruks) are going to get stomped.

So even if the Nazgul can't hit Yoda his lightsaber will just pass through them(there's nothing under the robes).So it's a stalemate.

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#27 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

Can Yoda even use Alter Environment? Never seen him use it, unless you have proof. And If I'm not mistaken, that power uses the Force energy of the thing its being used on. The Balrog has no Force energy, so it wouldn't work. And like I said before the nazgul can't die, they will outlast until he is killed or flees.

What? Where does it say Yoda needs FORCE energy to alter the enviorment? And yes he can use it:

Alter Environment allows a Force sensitive to influence the weather.

It is possible Yoda displayed this ability when he controlled the air in a hangar bay to remain inside.

Explosive decompression sucked all the air out of the docking bay, plucking chairs, papers, tools, small craft, and most importantly the four assassin droids, and flinging them into the black vault of space. The howling wind nearly jerked Chuff out of the lift tube to follow them, but Master Yoda's hand held him back. A pocket of air remained in the lift, held there by Yoda's will.

--Taken from Yoda: Dark Rendezvous'

Credit goes to Silver for quote.

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#28 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Thats just something I vaguely remember about it, I should probably look it up. I still think Yoda would eventually be defeated by the Nazgul, no matter how long it took. His lightsaber would not effect them. And if he tried to stab the Witch King, it would disintegrate into dust.

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#29 Posted by KingOfAsh (3935 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Why do you keep making Lord of the Rings battles then saying Lord of the Rings gets owned? I see clear, obvious spite.

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#30 Posted by Chaos Prime (11585 posts) - - Show Bio

@Rumble Man said:

@Chaos Prime said:

Can Yoda kill the Witch King being non female?

says no man can kill the witch king, but what gender is yoda exactly?

Im sure hes masculine or at the very least has a wee willy.

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#31 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@KingOfAsh said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Why do you keep making Lord of the Rings battles then saying Lord of the Rings gets owned? I see clear, obvious spite.

Where in this thread did I say LOTR gets owned? I even said the army could win if Witch King could use black breath, I am simply presenting arguments for Yoda and some for the Army.

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#32 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Thats just something I vaguely remember about it, I should probably look it up. I still think Yoda would eventually be defeated by the Nazgul, no matter how long it took. His lightsaber would not effect them. And if he tried to stab the Witch King, it would disintegrate into dust.

Look I am very stumped on who wins in a Yoda vs Witch King battle, I am willing to make another thread to debate about it on here because I just don't know.

But if Yoda can strike at speeds the Nazul can't percieve and faster then they can see, how do they kill him? He can be untouchable.

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#33 Posted by Laurcus (1309 posts) - - Show Bio

@Chaos Prime said:

Can Yoda kill the Witch King being non female?

The prophecy is not an immunity, it's just destiny. And it does not refer to gender, but rather, species. The following is a repost of something I wrote in a different thread.

"The Witch King was not killed by a mortal woman. Eowyn is a Man. Man is not a gender in LOTRs, it is a species. There are male Men and female Men. The movie heavily changes this scene because Peter Jackson misinterpreted it. The Witch King was not killed by Eowyn, he was killed by Merry.

In the Fellowship of the Ring when the Hobbits were saved from a Barrow Wight by Tom Bombadil, there was treasure in the Barrow that Tom handed out. Specifically, he gave each of the Hobbits a dagger. These daggers were not normal, they were blades of Westernesse. These blades were made during a time when Arnor was at war with Angmar. The Witch King is the King of Angmar. Because of this, all blades of Westernesse were given a special enchantment designed to kill the Witch King instantly should one ever cut him.

When Merry and Eowyn fought the Witch King, Merry was still armed with his blade of Westernesse, a relic from a past age that the Witch King was sure did not exist anymore. The way things actually played out in the books is that Eowyn had the attention of the Witch King, while Merry was on the ground in pain from his dread aura. When the Witch King walked past Merry though, Merry attacked him, and stabbed him in the foot. This killed the Witch King instantly. Eowyn didn't realize he was already dead, so as the Witch King fell she saw the gap in his defenses and stabbed him through the visor.

This is why, during a later scene in the weeks leading up to the Battle at the Black Gate, Eowyn is complaining to Aragorn that she has gotten no glory during this war. The prophecy that the Witch King would not be killed by a Man referred to the species, because he was destined to be killed by a Hobbit."

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#34 Posted by KingOfAsh (3935 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Not in those words, but you are saying that

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#35 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Yoda is just as mortal as you and me, he will get worn down eventually. The Witch King is an ethereal being, he doesn't have lungs or a heart, there is literally nothing there, just a cloak and some armor to give him a shape, he cannot be worn down. He will kill yoda eventually, there is no need for another thread.

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#36 Posted by TERMINATORFAN (1252 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda.

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#37 Edited by TheProwe (26 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks said:

@Miki1111 said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Balrog is a shadow being he can>t be hurt by swords.

Odd, Lightsabers aren't swords. Show me a Lightsaber failing against a Balrog.

Show us a lightsaber in Middle-earth..

@Kingjohnrocks said:

Yoda is not stupid to go against that much alone .. With prep, Yoda goes back to Dagobah..

Yoda has taken on a few batallions of Battle Driods and solo'd them. What makes you think Yoda fails/succeeds?

Yes, indeed but he's not against just hordes of non-magic immune beasts..

@Kingjohnrocks said:

And the Balrog is going to stand around and take it? Balrogs are Maiar, the same race of angelic spirits that Sauron comes from.

But they can get hurt. Give me a reason a force push/forcetoss would fail. Give me a reason a Lightsaber would also fail.

www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/yoda-vs-durins-bane/746683/

Plain water will not work.. The Balrog Gandalf fought got submerged in water but didn't die, instead became more of a slime monster just not portrayed in the films..

Mind you, the reasons I see Yoda losing are tiring and the inherent incapability of destroying the Balrog or Nazgul.. Different worlds, different mechanics and LotR is just vague on power and magic stuff..

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#38 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Yoda is just as mortal as you and me, he will get worn down eventually. The Witch King is an ethereal being, he doesn't have lungs or a heart, there is literally nothing there, just a cloak and some armor to give him a shape, he cannot be worn down. He will kill yoda eventually, there is no need for another thread.

Show me Yoda getting tired. Show me it. He has carried a crate with no noticeable strain before, he fell hundreads of feets below, slammed on the ground and got up with little injury.

Yoda can use a Saber to cut off his "helmet". What's saying he can't?

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#39 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: I don't need to show you it, its common sense, they could fight literally for years, he will get tired eventually, he is an organic being. Yoda wouldn't be able to touch him with his lightsaber, as soon as the blade touches him, the entire weapon will collapse to dust. I can tell your really fond of Yoda, and so am I. but face the truth, he would lose.

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#40 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks: I don't need to show you it, its common sense, they could fight literally for years, he will get tired eventually, he is an organic being. Yoda wouldn't be able to touch him with his lightsaber, as soon as the blade touches him, the entire weapon will collapse to dust. I can tell your really fond of Yoda, and so am I. but face the truth, he would lose.

Show me a sword decimating to dust the minute it touches the Witch King.

Also, Yoda can use TK to slam him around, toss him, etc.

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#41 Posted by JamesKM716 (2018 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Yoda can win this one.

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#42 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@JamesKM716 said:

I think Yoda can win this one.

Someone with some sense. Finally.

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#43 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks:

Powers

"As a Nazgûl, the Witch King had a wide arsenal of powers. Besides from the common Black Breath any weapon that touched the Witch-King should be destroyed." Taken from the Lord of the Rings wiki. What is Yoda going to do with TK? Throw off his robes and armor? Like I said before, The Witch King is an ethereal being, hes not there, he has no shape except his apparel that he wears, Yoda wouldn't be able to do anything against him.

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#44 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks:

Powers

"As a Nazgûl, the Witch King had a wide arsenal of powers. Besides from the common Black Breath any weapon that touched the Witch-King should be destroyed." Taken from the Lord of the Rings wiki. What is Yoda going to do with TK? Throw off his robes and armor? Like I said before, The Witch King is an ethereal being, hes not there, he has no shape except his apparel that he wears, Yoda wouldn't be able to do anything against him.

Give me in the book where it says any weapon that touched him should be destroyed.

Wikias are not always reliable, I would like a source.

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#45 Posted by Xanni15 (6791 posts) - - Show Bio

Yoda obliterates the army.

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#46 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Straight from the text, right here in my hands: "And still Meriadoc the hobbit stood there blinking through his tears, and no one spoke to him, indeed none seemed to heed him. He brushed away the tears, and stooped to pick up the green shield that Eowyn had given him, and he slung it at his back. Then he looked for his sword that he had let fall; for even as he struck his blow, his arm was numbed, and now he could only use his left hand. And behold! there lay his weapon, but the blade was smoking like a dry branch that has been thrust in a fire; and as he watched it, it writhed and withered and was consumed."

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#47 Posted by Kingjohnrocks (2271 posts) - - Show Bio

@Inphase said:

@Kingjohnrocks: Straight from the text, right here in my hands: "And still Meriadoc the hobbit stood there blinking through his tears, and no one spoke to him, indeed none seemed to heed him. He brushed away the tears, and stooped to pick up the green shield that Eowyn had given him, and he slung it at his back. Then he looked for his sword that he had let fall; for even as he struck his blow, his arm was numbed, and now he could only use his left hand. And behold! there lay his weapon, but the blade was smoking like a dry branch that has been thrust in a fire; and as he watched it, it writhed and withered and was consumed."

Alright but these are different universes, we MUST make an exception. A lightsaber is not your standard LOTR sword. As I said I am still stumped on if Yoda can defeat the Witch King. But Gandalf the White serverely outclasses the Witch KIng, while Yoda would stomp Gandalf the White through speedblitz. Once again I am stumped on this battle, that is all I can say.

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#48 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (30227 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman with prep solos

Online
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#49 Posted by Inphase (395 posts) - - Show Bio

@Kingjohnrocks: Yeah that would be kind of unfair to take away the saber. But it still would be destroyed, its just as much a physical weapon as a sword, just much more advanced. BUT, Yoda would NOT stomp Gandalf the White. And just because you're saying that Yoda can beat Gandalf, doesn't mean he can beat the Witch King, fights don't work like that.