Ultimate Captain America vs Deathstroke

You're talking about the scan? Oh I thought you were referring to the real life boulder.

@cadencev2 said:

I doubt that is a 20 ton feat. Your average car is about 2 tons and that boulder looks to be around 10 tons. He also isn't lifting the entire boulder off the ground and is only lifting one end off the ground.

Keep in mind a real life boulder like this one is 340 tons.

20 tons seems less now I think about it. That is easily 1/10 the size of that rock and that is 34 tons.

I think Ultimate Captain America beats Pre-New 52 Slade. But I don't think what Cap is lifting there is 20 tons. A lot of that can be hard clay and tar. Not like a solid condense boulder.

Umm.... Ultimate Iron man use Sonics and then Blasted Hulk.

@nickzambuto: Yea the boulder doesn't look 7 ft to me in the picture but the article says it is so I am sort of just going with it. I guess its one of those things you have to see in real life.

@cadencev2

Durability guy.

Cap hits harder than Gambits Charging Energy!

Which is still no where near enough force to KO ultimate hulk. Who IIRC tanks nukes.

I know it defies logic and physics to have the muscle power to lift 100+ tons and then lose to a 800 pound mans punch. That makes no sense in any world. I do know these Liberation Suits fight evenly with the SHIELD ones. Meaning they are tanking eachothers 100+ strength hits! As the scan above shows.

What do you mean with fight evenly with shield soldiers? I saw the previous scan of them fighting the giant men and it looks like the issue is the giant men get blitzed (if that's the scan your talking about). Do we see them tanking each others hits?

Why not.... Wonder Woman.....

I went over wonder woman all ready.

Cap is 6"3, I am rounding down to Cap being 6" just to low ball. To me that looks like a 9 high x 4 wide x 3 thick = 108 Cubic Feet roughly. 108 x 150 = 16,200

Roughly 16,200 pounds. That is 8 tons then. Add in the 2 Ton Soak and Wet Car ( Right after the Flood, standing water in the floors in puddles and cushions soaked as well trunk) Makes 10 tons roughly.

Now we did math in a rough calc, could be 1-2 tons more or less. If that is a fiber class car, less, steel frame car means more, weight of asphalt, Iron Pipes or Steel Pipes running in it, ect.

Either way. We have a better answer.

Around 10 tons was my original guess. So yes I agree you here.

Never said Cap was lifting 100 tons. Only stricking and withstand 100+ ton blows.

I don't know if I can agree with that but I am fine with agreeing to disagree.

The we agree to disagree.

All right.

@cadencev2 said:

@jashro44 said:

He does get stronger. But IIRC he was rag dolling ultimate iron man earlier in the fight before ultimate iron man used sonics which made hulk run.

One of my issues is that ultimate thor was confirmed to do the most damage on panel. And even after he broke hulks bones hulk was still conscious. IIRC hulk even stated all thors strikes did was make him "horny for Betty". And that was the person who did the most damage (other then wasps blowing his brains but that came later).

Umm.... Ultimate Iron man use Sonics and then Blasted Hulk.

My mistake. I remembered it differently. I thought after the sonics happened ultimate hulk went rampaging away.

@slimj87d: I did more math base of Cubic Feet of stone. Its as heavy as the crap I bulldozed in Haiti.

What are Deathstrokes greatest feats against blunt force if anyone can share them?

@cadencev2: All I said was that the people in the scene with the missiles were not people in Shield Suits, and they clearly are not. There is not a single Shield Suit soldier in that entire scene, so your "solid evidence," at least in regards to this feat, is nothing. The missile feat is not applicable to Shield Suit soldiers.

You didn't do a good job disproving it yourself though. Do you have a scan that shows they are not the same guys?

Actually there is only one Captain Britain suit seen period, the rest are shaded specks. So I came to the logical conclusion they are SHIELD suits since there is only 4 confirmed Captain Britains.

So it stands pretty well, you just chose to disagree.

I don't think there is much to say he can take hits from ultimate cap. He was slammed through a wall by wonder girl in the past and super boy once slammed him in the ground. He also blew a building on himself in bat-girl mini I believe.

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I think those are pre 52 slades best durability feats.

@slimj87d: I'll get a scan, but it's gonna half to be cropped into two different pics for the same page.

@cadencev2: They look entirely different than the Shield Suit Soldiers do. They most certainly are not shaded specks. You can clearly see that they look nothing like the Shield Suits. Their costumes all follow different color schemes and look nothing like the actual Shield Soldiers' suits. Furthermore, Captains Italy and Spain are mentioned.

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Edit- Here are the scans. Sorry the same image is broken up like that, but my only way to get scans is from Digital Comics Unlimited.

As you can see these people look nothing like the Shield Suit Soldiers, and they are the only flying soldiers, aside from members of The Ultimates obviously, in that scene.

@vegandiet: You said there was a splash page of more then 4 captain Brittan earlier right? Can you post it?

@jashro44: Thank you. Yeah, I don't think he could take a shield strike to the head judging from the time Batman knocked him out with the butt of a gun.

No problem. All though to be fair to Slade in the fight where batman did knock him out he did let batman hit him a couple of times. I agree he probably wont be tanking a shield strike but it is worth noting.

@jashro44: Just posted it. And I don't know if they're Captain Britains, but they have more in common with them than they do Shield Suits. I didn't really know what else to call them.

They do look different then the liberator soldiers and the shield agents.

@vegandiet said:

@cadencev2 said:

2 Guys only! Look around the Statue as it is falling! No dots or people at all. Just 2 Guys!

4 Captain Britains (Britains, Spain, France, and Italy) yet there is 18 missiles. Do the math people. Those are clearly the Shield Suits in action as this was when they were debut in the Ultimates.

I'd just like to point out that this isn't true. Two pages before the scene you just posted there's a splash page where far more than 4 Captain "Britains", or at least people that are very obviously not people in Shield Suits, are visible. Looks to be about 15 of them. I can provide a scan if necessary.

I don't know why he keeps trying to use these misconstrued scans as evidence. I have already addressed and refuted the claim that those SHIELD Super Soldiers were Class 100 in strength. I find it totally distasteful when someone deliberately posts misinformation out of favoritism of a certain character. And what he should be asking himself is how Ult. Captain America capable of overpowering a group of Class 100's when he is barely a 5 tonner at best.

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/cav-scarlet-spider-calebhara-vs-captain-america-ca-1469780/

Actually you have not proven anything. I already showed how there is only 4 Captain Britains ever confirmed and shown.

I showed How the SHIELD suits and Liberation Suits have Super Strength and Flight.

All of SHIELD (Ultimates Giant Men, Soilders, but notice no SHIELD SUits seen) + 4 Cap Britains (Confirmed and shown consistently) - 20 Nukes (All have a guy flying them) = 16 SHIELD Suits lifting nukes.

You have not shot this down. Why is all of SHIELD there with their Giant Men, Soldiers, and Ultimates, but the SHIELD Suits are not in scene anywhere? Thats becuase they are lifting the Nukes. How can it be Captain Britains when there is only ever shown 4 of them in all the Ultimate Comics?

You have no proof and all the holes in your own opinion to shoot down. I showed 2 Liberation Suits pushing down the Statue of Liberty and the SHIELD suits were matching them in strength! SHIELD lost because of numbers.

There is not a single Shield Suit Soldier present in that scene. Whoever the people in that splash page are, it's clear they aren't Shield Suit Soldiers. The Nuke feat is not applicable to them. You can't attribute a feat to someone who was literally not even seen during the scene in question.

1) You never showed that there was only 4 Captain Britains, and the scans you have been throwing around here give testament to that. I have already explained to you that at the very beginning of the EDI's super soldier program that there was only 4 official members and 12 candidates who were undergoing the program, and then I made it quite clear that there was a time gap from Thor's incarceration to the invasion of America by the Liberator which would have allowed for more Super Soldiers to be inducted into the EDI.

I count 6 Captain Britains in this scan below.

2) You showed how SHIELD and Liberator Super Soldiers had Class 3 strength and flight, not how they had a lifting capacity of 100+ tons.

3) Why do you keep fabricating the numbers of Captain Britains? The scans that make reference to the 4 Captain Britains happen before the invasion of America by the Liberators, and I have already told you that a time gap exists between the incarceration of Thor and the invasion which would be sufficient enough to initiate more members in the EDI. Again, I like have said before the EDI consists of 27 countries that are apart of EU; so there could be as many as 27 Captain Britains for each country apart of the EU.

4) You didn't show that there was only 2 Liberators pushing the Statue of Liberty, but what you did do was butcher a scan to fit your bias that clearly showed a large of Liberators using there combined strength to topple over the Statue of Liberty.

Slade

1) You never showed that there was only 4 Captain Britains, and the scans you have been throwing around here give testament to that. I have already explained to you that at the very beginning of the EDI's super soldier program that there was only 4 official members and 12 candidates who were undergoing the program, and then I made it quite clear that there was a time gap from Thor's incarceration to the invasion of America by the Liberator which would have allowed for more Super Soldiers to be inducted into the EDI.

I count 6 Captain Britains in this scan below.

2) You showed how SHIELD and Liberator Super Soldiers had Class 3 strength and flight, not how they had a lifting capacity of 100+ tons.

3) Why do you keep fabricating the numbers of Captain Britains? The scans that make reference to the 4 Captain Britains happen before the invasion of America by the Liberators, and I have already told you that a time gap exists between the incarceration of Thor and the invasion which would be sufficient enough to initiate more members in the EDI. Again, I like have said before the EDI consists of 27 countries that are apart of EU; so there could be as many as 27 Captain Britains for each country apart of the EU.

4) You didn't show that there was only 2 Liberators pushing the Statue of Liberty, but what you did do was butcher a scan to fit your bias that clearly showed a large of Liberators using there combined strength to topple over the Statue of Liberty.

1) No you proved there was 4 guys with suits that have powers and code names, there was many guys or canadates that had no indication of power and never made a single apreance in any ultimate story ever. Only Britain, Spain, Italy, and France has ever been shown. Where did all these what you suppose is futur Britain guys when they never appeared again? They were never made. That is the facts as they stand.

2) You never showed me proof that Class 3 in that Scientists classification has anything to do with the Marvel Grid for Encylopedias. Class 3 could mean Thor strength for all the proof you shown. You ASSUME Class 3 is referring to a Make Up power grid of the Encyclopedias. Why would a Scientist be referring to a non existent Encyclopedia or Trading Card Game? Its uyour Assumption backed by nothing but what you think.

3) Yet they are never seen ever in the comics of any arc. Only the 4 that are introduce, and then Captain Britain was the last of them after Italy dies. What happen to the other 27? Just becuase there is 27 countries does not mean the EU had the money to fund that many Suits. Your using unrealistic and non factual or shown in comics logic again backed by nothing.

4) Yeah I did. You see 2 only Liberators pushing the heel, it tips over. 2 Guys is all that is shown and as it stands a feat and undispitubal fact! To say "NUH UH" while the Scans show it is beyond me.

@cadencev2 said:

@vegandiet said:

1) You never showed that there was only 4 Captain Britains, and the scans you have been throwing around here give testament to that. I have already explained to you that at the very beginning of the EDI's super soldier program that there was only 4 official members and 12 candidates who were undergoing the program, and then I made it quite clear that there was a time gap from Thor's incarceration to the invasion of America by the Liberator which would have allowed for more Super Soldiers to be inducted into the EDI.

I count 6 Captain Britains in this scan below.

2) You showed how SHIELD and Liberator Super Soldiers had Class 3 strength and flight, not how they had a lifting capacity of 100+ tons.

3) Why do you keep fabricating the numbers of Captain Britains? The scans that make reference to the 4 Captain Britains happen before the invasion of America by the Liberators, and I have already told you that a time gap exists between the incarceration of Thor and the invasion which would be sufficient enough to initiate more members in the EDI. Again, I like have said before the EDI consists of 27 countries that are apart of EU; so there could be as many as 27 Captain Britains for each country apart of the EU.

4) You didn't show that there was only 2 Liberators pushing the Statue of Liberty, but what you did do was butcher a scan to fit your bias that clearly showed a large of Liberators using there combined strength to topple over the Statue of Liberty.

1) No you proved there was 4 guys with suits that have powers and code names, there was many guys or canadates that had no indication of power and never made a single apreance in any ultimate story ever. Only Britain, Spain, Italy, and France has ever been shown. Where did all these what you suppose is futur Britain guys when they never appeared again? They were never made. That is the facts as they stand.

2) You never showed me proof that Class 3 in that Scientists classification has anything to do with the Marvel Grid for Encylopedias. Class 3 could mean Thor strength for all the proof you shown. You ASSUME Class 3 is referring to a Make Up power grid of the Encyclopedias. Why would a Scientist be referring to a non existent Encyclopedia or Trading Card Game? Its uyour Assumption backed by nothing but what you think.

3) Yet they are never seen ever in the comics of any arc. Only the 4 that are introduce, and then Captain Britain was the last of them after Italy dies. What happen to the other 27? Just becuase there is 27 countries does not mean the EU had the money to fund that many Suits. Your using unrealistic and non factual or shown in comics logic again backed by nothing.

4) Yeah I did. You see 2 only Liberators pushing the heel, it tips over. 2 Guys is all that is shown and as it stands a feat and undispitubal fact! To say "NUH UH" while the Scans show it is beyond me.

You know what I tried to be respectful and point that what your saying isn't correct, but at this point I no longer care and you can believe what you want. Vegandiet already proved without a shadow of a doubt that there was more than 4 Captain Britain Super Soldiers. And how am I assuming anything about the Marvel power grid when they use the same scale in both Universes.

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@nick_hero22 said:

You know what I tried to be respectful and point that what your saying isn't correct, but at this point I no longer care and you can believe what you want. Vegandiet already proved without a shadow of a doubt that there was more than 4 Captain Britain Super Soldiers. And how am I assuming anything about the Marvel power grid when they use the same scale in both Universes.

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Holy s**t you finally came with scans of Proof! Why not done this from the freaking get go?!

If you showed me this before I would have stop ahead of time. What Issue is that from however?

Also I still say the Class 3 is BS unless you have another solid proof these suits are barely 20 toners when 2 of them lifted and dump the Statue of Liberty on panel. Just 2 of them.

@cadencev2 said:

@nick_hero22 said:

You know what I tried to be respectful and point that what your saying isn't correct, but at this point I no longer care and you can believe what you want. Vegandiet already proved without a shadow of a doubt that there was more than 4 Captain Britain Super Soldiers. And how am I assuming anything about the Marvel power grid when they use the same scale in both Universes.

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Holy s**t you finally came with scans of Proof! Why not done this from the freaking get go?!

If you showed me this before I would have stop ahead of time. What Issue is that from however?

Also I still say the Class 3 is BS unless you have another solid proof these suits are barely 20 toners when 2 of them lifted and dump the Statue of Liberty on panel. Just 2 of them.

Because it was posted awhile ago by Vegandiet in this same thread.

@nick_hero22: Also heres a gold star for helping me in my Ultimate Knowledge.

@nickzambuto@floopay@laflux@strider92@esquire@killemall@slimj87d

Be shock and amaze as Nick of all people slapped my @$$ down with Ultimate knowledge.

@nick_hero22 said:

@cadencev2 said:

@nick_hero22 said:

You know what I tried to be respectful and point that what your saying isn't correct, but at this point I no longer care and you can believe what you want. Vegandiet already proved without a shadow of a doubt that there was more than 4 Captain Britain Super Soldiers. And how am I assuming anything about the Marvel power grid when they use the same scale in both Universes.

Gallery

Holy s**t you finally came with scans of Proof! Why not done this from the freaking get go?!

If you showed me this before I would have stop ahead of time. What Issue is that from however?

Also I still say the Class 3 is BS unless you have another solid proof these suits are barely 20 toners when 2 of them lifted and dump the Statue of Liberty on panel. Just 2 of them.

Because it was posted awhile ago by Vegandiet in this same thread.

....... Im looking back.....

@cadencev2 said:

@nick_hero22: Also heres a gold star for helping me in my Ultimate Knowledge.

@nickzambuto@floopay@laflux@strider92@esquire@killemall@slimj87d

Be shock and amaze as Nick of all people slapped my @$$ down with Ultimate knowledge.

Is this sarcasm?

@vegandiet said:

@slimj87d: I'll get a scan, but it's gonna half to be cropped into two different pics for the same page.

@cadencev2: They look entirely different than the Shield Suit Soldiers do. They most certainly are not shaded specks. You can clearly see that they look nothing like the Shield Suits. Their costumes all follow different color schemes and look nothing like the actual Shield Soldiers' suits. Furthermore, Captains Italy and Spain are mentioned.

Gallery

Edit- Here are the scans. Sorry the same image is broken up like that, but my only way to get scans is from Digital Comics Unlimited.

As you can see these people look nothing like the Shield Suit Soldiers, and they are the only flying soldiers, aside from members of The Ultimates obviously, in that scene.

Oh snap. I totally missed this post altogether.

All credit goes to Vegan here. Damn I been totally off my game this week.

Are you too big of a Man to accept a "Im Sorry, I guess you were right after all" post?

Not that you deserve, it was Vegan who totally knocked me off my high horse on the SHIELD suits feats.

I got a star!

On topic, Ult. Cap wins this. I'd wager he could take New 52 Deathstroke as well.

...what

I think I need to move on from this thread.

How come every Deathstroke vs Ult Cap thread always ends in strife.............

I am upset I lost that evidence as a feat, all I have to judge the SHIELD Agents is this now.

Cap vs SHIELD suits.

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Cap vs SHIELD. This is a great battle as Cap is Tranqed up, fights off Captain Britain suit SHIELD agents, and then takes a Iron Man Suit tackle from hell!

How Tough are these Captain Britain SHIELD Agents?

Strong enough to to stand up to these 100+ toner Liberation suits. How tough are the Liberation Suits?

Strong enough for a mere 2 of them to tip the statue of Liberty.

About the only scaling we have really.

QFT

Deathstroke was above Cap before. And now he's wearing f'ing Nth Metal. This thread should not be that long. Deathstroke is superior and he wins in a fight. He takes on entire teams and obliterates them.

He's above 616 Captain America but not Ultimate Captain America

And so does Ultimate Captain America. He tore through the Ultimate Avengers and has consistently held his own against Hulk level opponents.

Do you have feats to support Deathstroke being superior?

Current Slade is above Ultimate Cap.

Ive played this game before. I post a bunch of scans and you pretend to not be impressed. Current Slade and pre 52 Slade has pierced the skin of class 20 parties and beyond with punches and made them bleed consistently. He is and always has been stronger.

Especially now where Slade wears Nth metal. Until Cap gets an upgrade like that, he loses. And anytime Slade does something Cap could never dream of doing you whine PIS. I'm done.

He's close but not above Ultimate Cap

We'll see in this next Teen Titans issue coming up. I have a feeling he'll be facing more than one opponent in Teen Titans 23.2 in September.

So you've gotten all that from the one comment I posted.

This is the whiniest comment I've ever read.

Good battle, I give it to Ultimate Cap.

@pohocom: Wait was this guy saying Batman can't fight? lol Batman is the best fighter in DC, Cap is not even on top 10 in Marvel.

Slade has him in everything, if he has the Nth metal armor and promethium sword he stomps. Cap can't hurt him.

i think ultimate cap takes the edge on this.... he's bigger,faster,stronger, and more vicious than his 616 counterpart without losing that same tactical mindset. Deathstroke is no stranger to superhumans and several teen titans as well as batman. Keep in mind batman isnt superhuman and cant deliver the same blow ult cap could nor keep up with caps speed. Superboy, wondergirl, and cyborg are more reckless than cap usually preferring to try to overpower deathstroke..... Iknow what youre thinking "but ultimate cap always charges in" he is a far more versatile and skilled fighter than any of the aforementioned DC heroes save batman. Like batman he is well versed enough to pose a threat to deathstroke in hand to hand, pair that with superhuman reflexes rivaling his own I think deathstroke is in trouble. I would compare Ult Caps healing factor to deathstrokes in that hes not impervious, but 'a broken bone isnt gunna hold him down....

Ult cap is willing to use guns and doesnt pull punches against his foes. Hell he knocked out giant man and successfully boxed the ult. hulk for several panels which is an incredible feat by itself. Deathstroke is favorite character of mine, but even with his enhanced reflexes, healing, and combat experience...I just dont see him being able to control the fight against cap like he does the teen titans or batman. He would be fighting on a level of competition i dont think he could sustain successfully. Deathstroke is all about the upper hand and knowing your opponent. Patience and planning aren't enough to keep Ult Cap down

@redhood21: Slade got nth metal armor all over his body, he tanked helicopter fire like nothing who uses over 30 mm bullets which can pierce through thick stone and brick walls.

Nth metal also amps his strength, stamina and speed. Cap got nothing on him, Slade is 6'3, Cap is not bigger lol

Ult. Cap