Street PYP 2016 R1: Juiceboks vs Primezone (Voting Now)

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sirfizzwhizz

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#1  Edited By sirfizzwhizz

@juiceboks:

  • Storm Troopers x10 (1)
  • Cable (Mesiah Arc) (5)
  • Zazie (LO) (6)

@primez0ne:

  • Caerula Sanguis (7)
  • Shiki Ryougi (3)
  • Hei (1)
  • Hand Ninjas x10 (1)

Rules

  • All Characters with Expanded Universe are allowed there EU feats. Manga/Anime gets both feats. Game characters get Manga/Anime feats.
  • All characters are in character.
  • No BFR, but can teleport others around the battlefield.
  • No Mental KO or Mental Control of a enemy team. Applies to soul abilities as well. Anything else goes.
  • Time Manipulation is allowed only on the character who has it only. Can not Increase speed past Hypersonic.
  • Transmutation is allowed, but not directly on characters.
  • Intangibility, Teleporting, and Transmutation dismemberment are not allowed on enemy team, but everything else is fine.
  • Gear must remain Street Level.
  • Summons/Duplicates limited to Navy Seal Team quality. You cannot summon anything or duplicate enough to overwhelm a 6 man Navy Seal Team with ease.
  • Team Work is not a factor.
  • Unsure, then ask. If things get out of hand, rulings will be made.

Batllefield

Top Team Starts Left, Bottom Team Right

No Caption Provided

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#3  Edited By juiceboks  Moderator

@Primez0ne Sure

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Primez0ne

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@juiceboks: If not I can have something by tonight or tomorrow at the latest.

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#6  Edited By Primez0ne
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#7 juiceboks  Moderator

@primez0ne: That's cool, you can go ahead and go first.

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#8  Edited By Primez0ne

@juiceboks: Ok I'll start.

Team Introductions

Caerula Sanguis

No Caption Provided

Caerula Sanguisis the last surviving Type-V mutant, a human who was infected by a retrovirus known as the V-virus and gained vampire-like characteristics such as eternal youth and sucking out the blood of others to heal her. She was originally born as Vilma Fachiri and adopted several aliases during her long life. She is a expert in eastern martial arts with over 700 years of combat experience and can be attributed as having taught the originator of panzer kunst, a Martian martial arts. She has gained the ability to see the "neural pulse flow", which gives her great precognitive abilities and sensory awareness. This has allowed her to keep up with opponents three times as fast as her and counter an ambush from invisible enemies.

Shiki Ryougi

No Caption Provided

Lets just leave it at that she is a young woman with a dark and complicated past who has eyes that allow her to see the death of all things. By touching/cutting the faults that all of creation has she can kill anything be it a ghost, powers, disease, or magic. She possesses an artificial arm that allows her to grab ghosts and holds a second dagger within it.

Hei the Black Reaper

No Caption Provided

Hei has the power to discharge electricity which he obtained from his sister in the during the Heaven's War but is just peak human. Hei is such a skilled killer/fighter he has killed several super humans called contractors and even earned the name of the Black Reaper before getting his powers. His standard equipment is a wire used to grapple around the battlefield, a bulletproof jacket, and two double edged knives

Hand Ninja

No Caption Provided

Mystical ninja clan. Ten of them. Not much else to say.

Strategy

The strategy will be simple. None of my team are people who would come up with a brilliant strategy before a battle, but rather individuals who are highly adaptable and experienced with fighting supernatural/very powerful opponents. Going by how they usually operate Caerula and Shiki will try to confront your team head on while Hei and the ten Hand ninjas will sneak on the side. As shown before Caerula's ability to see neural pulse flow will allow her to perfectly dodge all of your team's projectiles while closing the distance. Shiki's speed, while not as impressive as Caerula's, will allow her to also quickly close the distance to engage your team. Due to her heightened senses, Caerula should be able to to track Cable or Zazie if needed and alert her teammates to their locations. Her ability to perfectly predict people's movements in battle should allow her to make short work of either Cable or Zazie if she were to encounter them. Their long range advantage will easily be overwhelmed once my team comes into close quarters combat.

Loading Video...

Skip to 2:21 to see her dodge a point blank explosion.

Hei on the other hand is more than willing to use sneak attacks and subterfuge to gain an advantage over a tough enemy. As you can see below Hei attacks April while she distracted by another enemy. Skip to 1:30

Loading Video...

He even quickly realizes that the best way to fight a martial artist contractor, who can destroy anything his blood touches, is to play possum and attack him when he least expected it.Skip to 2:30

Loading Video...

The storm troopers will be quickly decimated as Hei blitzes them with attacks from his knife through armor openings and electrical attacks. This will be made easier with the Hand ninjas. While this is going on Shiki will keep Zazie busy till Hei comes in to disable her guns. He should be able to tank a bullet or two from her less powerful guns thanks to his bulletproof jacket. He'll know to do so once told by Caerula of how dangerous Zazie can be.

For now I'll leave it here, so I can properly assess how this strategy will work out considering yours. I can already guess you will take a defensive stance and wait to snipe at your attackers.

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#9 juiceboks  Moderator

@primez0ne:

Cable

No Caption Provided

Nathan Summers is a psychic supersoldier from the future. He's lead, fought, and ended more wars in multiple timelines than most characters have lived through. The exact capabilities of his powers have varied over the years, but rest assured this version is more than capable of utilizing both aspects of psychic abilities to achieve very effective results.

Zazie

No Caption Provided

Zazie is a cyborg soldier much like Cable, though what she lacks in psychic powers she makes up for in her weaponry and speed. She was trained as a toddler to become the personal bodyguard for the Queen of Mars, and exceeded all expectations set for her on her way to attain that position. She and Cable are the perfect duo to lead a company of troopers in such a scenario.

Strategy

I can already guess you will take a defensive stance and wait to snipe at your attackers.

Well that's only going to be part of it.

First off Cable will link everyone's mind together so as to keep everyone up to date with whatever is going on on the battlefield.

No Caption Provided

After which he and the stormtroopers will scan the battlefield using their sensors and telepathy respectively, thereby giving us knowledge of where exactly your team is at all times. An example of a stormtrooper doing so taken from Allegiance..

"Four-seven-nine: acknowledged," Brightwater said, taking a quick look around as he turned into a wide circle that would bring him back to the rest of the scout troopers still maneuvering their way out of the transport. They'd come in on a ground-skimming course just to the north of a set of low, tree-sprinkled hills, with the edge of their target town a couple of hundred meters away on the far side. Activating his helmet's sensors, he gave the hills a quick but careful scan as he circled back toward the transport. There didn't seem to be activity anywhere, of any sort, which struck him as highly suspicious. The hills included a picnic area, several walking paths, and half a dozen trees that had been patiently nurtured and manipulated over the decades into an elaborate children's climbing structure.

- Taken from Allegiance

While this is happening Zazie will set up a variety of traps around the top warehouse, from monofilament wires to thermal detonators courtesy of the stormtroopers.

No Caption Provided

As I'm sure you're aware, these nets were fast enough to trap a character well into the supersonic range, and as far I can tell the only person that is at that level is Caerula. Speaking of which..

Caerula and Shiki will try to confront your team head on while Hei and the ten Hand ninjas will sneak on the side. As shown before Caerula's ability to see neural pulse flow will allow her to perfectly dodge all of your team's projectiles while closing the distance

Hm, considering Zazie alone is fast enough to hold her own against Caerula due to her comparable reaction time and range I highly doubt it will be that easy for her to just avoid all of her projectiles. But, she isn't alone. And after Zazie lets Cable know how dangerous Caerula is, he'll most likely opt to impede her halt by any means. That includes TK'ing her eardums to severely throw off her equilibrium..

No Caption Provided

..or just meeting her charge with an immovable object

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Er..shield. Honestly you'd be hardpressed to argue Caerula can effectively avoid gunfire from not only Zazie but Cable and 10 highly trained soldiers with hypersonic+ weaponry, but with Cable throwing her around and giving her migraines with his TK? I don't see it happening. This of course goes double for Shiki.

Her ability to perfectly predict people's movements in battle should allow her to make short work of either Cable or Zazie if she were to encounter them

Caerula can predict their movements but Cable can literally read her mind at all times to keep ahead of her as he did to Wolverine.

No Caption Provided

There isn't a single move Caerula or the rest of her team won't attempt without Cable already making counters for it. This type of multi-tasking is something Cable's done by himself dozens of times, take for example when he stormed a fortress in Cable #91 using guns, his TK and TP to disarm, down and otherwise incapacitate every enemy he came across without a hitch.

No Caption Provided
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Here he can focus on using his TP and TK, Zazie and the stormtroopers can handle the guns part. Which they are more than well-equipped to do. Again I'm sure you're well aware of the futuristic firepower Zazie wields, so I'll just elaborate on what Stormtroopers carry into battle.

No Caption Provided

The E-11 Blaster Rifle is one of the most state of the art rifles of the era, and yes as I stated earlier fires hypersonic bolts of plasma energy. To put their speed in perspective, slugthrowers are the ballistic weaponry of the SW universe and while they too fire hypersonic rounds they are ultimately archaic compared to modern blasters.

The compound flooded with smoke and flame, with flashes of blaster bolts and snarls of hypersonic slugs. Mace paced through it all with relentless calm, his only expression a slight frown of concentration, his blades weaving an impenetrable web of lightning. He gave more and more of himself over to the Force, letting it move his hands, his feet, letting it guide him through the battle.

- Taken from Shatterpoint

And here we see when a blaster and a slugthrower were fired at virtually the same time, the blaster hit the mark first.

From his weapon's top barrel, a bluish-white high charged energy beam shot outward and upward. A microsecond after the beam's ignition, a second shot from the lower weapon's barrel rang out. To the two occupants of room 547, the shots were virtually simultaneous. The energy beam produced by the first shot hit the penthouse window three centimeters away from the ambassador's chest, through this hole a lead alloy slug fired from the weapon's barrel sped through, hitting the ambassador.

- Taken from Criminal Organizations: Hutts 1, Bresallis

So 10 troopers armed with weaponry faster than anything your team has faced should make mincemeat of them.

So all in all, my team has multiple means to keep your team under surveillance at all times, the range advantage to an obscene degree, the knowledge of whatever your team plans to do before they do it, traps to keep them confused if not kill them outright and a telekinetic with multiple ways to disrupt their movements.

I'd say we're sitting fairly well.

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T4V!

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#11  Edited By Primez0ne

@juiceboks: I will definitely get back to this by Thursday. Getting swamped with schoolwork right now.

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#13  Edited By Primez0ne

@juiceboks: Sorry for the wait.

Counters

While this is happening Zazie will set up a variety of traps around the top warehouse, from monofilament wires to thermal detonators courtesy of the stormtroopers.

No Caption Provided

As I'm sure you're aware, these nets were fast enough to trap a character well into the supersonic range, and as far I can tell the only person that is at that level is Caerula. Speaking of which..

Yes but I think you fail to realize that Caerula has far superior abilities than Rakan, whose only saving grace was his speed. Unlike him Caerula can simply use her senses to detect any traps. Considering she can see through people, see invisible enemies and feel the flow of air molecules I don't see how my team will be caught unawares.

1-2:Detects invisible enemies 3:sees through someone's skin

It would be simple for her to steer the battle towards a space that was not filled with traps.

Hm, considering Zazie alone is fast enough to hold her own against Caerula due to her comparable reaction time and range I highly doubt it will be that easy for her to just avoid all of her projectiles.

For now I won't argue against this, but I will explain one wrinkle to this that will complicate matters for Zazie. The fact that Caerula is capable of manhandling opponents three times as fast as her.

Since I am sure that you remember the fight, I will not post more of the fight, but this just goes to show how strong her ability to see the neural pulse flow and her skills are. Even though Alita can read her opponent's attacks, has a high level of skill, and is easily hypersonic, she was shown to be Caerula's inferior in combat at this point. Zazie herself had to resort to self-destructing herself just for a chance at winning against Alita, who at the time was missing both of her legs. While Zazie did not have her usual equipment in that battle, the fact that Alita with no legs could keep up with and defeat her does not bode well for her chances of defeating or tagging Caerula. Caerula's ability to predict all of her moves will render all of her shot of target and any tactics will be forewarned by her. Zazie won against Rakan due to prepping against him specifically. This time she will not have that foreknowledge.

But, she isn't alone. And after Zazie lets Cable know how dangerous Caerula is, he'll most likely opt to impede her halt by any means. That includes TK'ing her eardums to severely throw off her equilibrium..

Even in your own scan it was noted that was a rarely used tactic by Cable. Zazie won't know if Caerula is there until its too late.

..or just meeting her charge with an immovable object

No Caption Provided

Er..shield. Honestly you'd be hardpressed to argue Caerula can effectively avoid gunfire from not only Zazie but Cable and 10 highly trained soldiers with hypersonic+ weaponry, but with Cable throwing her around and giving her migraines with his TK? I don't see it happening. This of course goes double for Shiki.

You will also be hardpressed to argue that Cable's Telekinesis will help him much against an opponent who can simply see and "kill" it. In fact Shiki has even done it against a much more powerful telekinesis user, Asagami. Asagami was able to casually destroy the Tokyo bridge while dying. Considering her experience with telekinetics she should easily be able to cancel his telekinesis. His TP will not help much either to prevent this from happening as Shiki will just be reacting to his telekinesis use while battling several others.

Skip to 3:00

There isn't a single move Caerula or the rest of her team won't attempt without Cable already making counters for it. This type of multi-tasking is something Cable's done by himself dozens of times, take for example when he stormed a fortress in Cable #91 using guns, his TK and TP to disarm, down and otherwise incapacitate every enemy he came across without a hitch.

That does not provide much evidence that he can take down a over 700 year old martial artist vampire who can accurately predict his every move and a woman capable of canceling his TK. Has Cable ever used his TP to keep up with and beat someone stated to be three times as fast as him? Although being able to read someone's mind is a huge advantage in a fight Caerula has shown to be able to use her abilities to fight tougher and faster opponents. His TP is countered by Caerula's vampiric eye and his TK is countered by Shiki's mystic eyes of death perception.

So 10 troopers armed with weaponry faster than anything your team has faced should make mincemeat of them.

As cool as that sounds, have they ever hit someone with actual decent reaction/combat speeds? I know that the movie versions are not exactly a true gauge of Stormtroopers, but you will need to show something to proof that they can fire and hit superhumanly fast opponents. Hei has repeatedly blitzed trained soldiers and reacted to someone capable of kicking at mach 1.

Shiki has blitzed an opponent that an opponent capable of moving at high speeds.

Skip to 6:00 to see how fast Lio can move and then again to 9:00 to see her completely dismember her.

Even the hand ninja should be sufficiently faster and more skilled than the storm troopers considering they can dodge bullets

No Caption Provided

Their weapons being fast are not going to change the fact that they are simply too slow for their opponents. As stated before Hei should be able to single-handily move through and kill them using stabs in the weak points of their armor or electrocuting them with taps. Hei alone has dealt with trickier and more dangerous opponents like the magician who could phase through Hei's attacks. With the Hand ninjas there to help it should be a breeze for him to mow through them and then disable Zazie.

So all in all, my team has multiple means to keep your team under surveillance at all times, the range advantage to an obscene degree, the knowledge of whatever your team plans to do before they do it, traps to keep them confused if not kill them outright and a telekinetic with multiple ways to disrupt their movements.

Most of that is negated by either Caerula's ability to literally see all of your team's actions, Shiki's ability to negate TK, and Hei's ability to disable guns.

Summary

  • My team is overall faster than yours. While it is not to an obscene degree this will heavily lessen the chance the lesser members of your team can adequately handle mine.
  • They are also much more skilled.
  • Everything that Cable or Zazie can throw at my team can be countered. There is also things that can be used for cover while your team has little time to setup with mine coming to them at the start of the battle.
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#14  Edited By sirfizzwhizz
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mickey-mouse

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@primez0ne:

Skip to 3:00

Skip where? There is no video???

Skip to 6:00 to see how fast Lio can move and then again to 9:00 to see her completely dismember her.

???? Huh?

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#16 juiceboks  Moderator
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Primez0ne

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#17  Edited By Primez0ne

@juiceboks: @lukehero: Sorry. Keep forgetting that videos don't work in spoilers. I'll have to fix that.

Edit: Fixed it.

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#19 juiceboks  Moderator

@primez0ne:

Rebuttals

Yes but I think you fail to realize that Caerula has far superior abilities than Rakan, whose only saving grace was his speed. Unlike him Caerula can simply use her senses to detect any traps. Considering she can see through people, see invisible enemies and feel the flow of air molecules I don't see how my team will be caught unawares.

Caerula's senses allow her to feel the air molecules shift in her immediate surroundings and scan a person's body, but that isn't the same as say Daredevil's Radar Sense which allows him to detect hidden traps and such. Both examples you posted are of Caerula scanning someone she can already see, and noticing someone she can't by their movements through the air. That's how her Neural Pulse Flow works, by sensing the shifts in air molecules and giving her all the information about the things she can sense through that.

No Caption Provided

Not only are we starting at a far enough distance to where her senses won't be of immediate use, but she hasn't shown the capability to sense stationary and hidden objects ie thermal detonators and net traps buried underground. Her Neural Pulse Flow will certainly aid her in evading the traps as soon as they are activated, but she won't know about them until that point.

she was shown to be Caerula's inferior in combat at this point. Zazie herself had to resort to self-destructing herself just for a chance at winning against Alita, who at the time was missing both of her legs. While Zazie did not have her usual equipment in that battle, the fact that Alita with no legs could keep up with and defeat her does not bode well for her chances of defeating or tagging Caerula.

You're right, Zazie couldn't beat Alita without her legs. Of course, this was in a zero g environment and Alita was in a space suit engaged in h2h combat. Zazie never fought with her legs, and utilized her space suit to move around. Alita's lack of such limbs shouldn't have been much of a hindrance as they fought with their hands and arms the entirety of the fight. It's also important to note that this was h2h combat, where Alita's specialty lied and yet Zazie was beating her up until she had a PIS moment and remembered a move she was taught a long time ago.

No Caption Provided

If Zazie had any firearms as is her specialty, no doubt this fight would have gone a lot different. Regardless, Zazie isn't going to be fighting Caerula in h2h combat to which I'll agree that Caerula is her superior. Rather, she's playing the range game along with the stormtroopers.

Caerula's ability to predict all of her moves will render all of her shot of target and any tactics will be forewarned by her. Zazie won against Rakan due to prepping against him specifically. This time she will not have that foreknowledge.

She won't be able to predict anything from long range. The only "prep" Zazie did was in mid combat, she didn't go into the battle knowing anything about him. Against Caerula, it's likely she at the very least has an idea of who she is either from her own knowledge or anything Alita told her. If not, anything she won't learn from the first shot can be passed on by Cable's mind scan.

Even in your own scan it was noted that was a rarely used tactic by Cable. Zazie won't know if Caerula is there until its too late.

And yet Nathan still opted to use it because he saw it necessary. That's not the only time he's used his TK to disrupt an enemy's internally, hell in the scans I posted of Cable #91 he used it twice.

No Caption Provided

Cable's not one to shy away from these types of tactics. He's been stated on panel to be a strategic genius, and has no qualms with killing people. This has been shown throughout his publication history, but was explicitly stated in AvX..

No Caption Provided

..seeing as how fast Caerula is, it would only make sense for Cable to try and keep her distracted so that the rest of his team can get a clean shot on her.

You will also be hardpressed to argue that Cable's Telekinesis will help him much against an opponent who can simply see and "kill" it. In fact Shiki has even done it against a much more powerful telekinesis user, Asagami. Asagami was able to casually destroy the Tokyo bridge while dying. Considering her experience with telekinetics she should easily be able to cancel his telekinesis.

Couple things here.

1. Asagami is not more powerful than Cable, not when Cable has been stated and shown to be a more powerful psychic than Charles Xavier and Jean Grey but usually holds back due to keeping the T.O virus from consuming his body. She's also definitely not more skilled than Cable, who has used his TK in a wide variety of applications from amping his guns firepower to turning off mutants powers.

2. Shiki was able to see her TK lines and cut them after Asagami literally spammed it against her. Shiki even thanks her for using it so much and giving her an opportunity to pinpoint the flaw in her TK. Prior to that, she had her arm broken fairly easily.

3. Shiki hasn't shown the capability to cut internal TK attacks AFAIK, such as pressure on her eardrums or brain. As shown against Asagami, Shiki needs time to pinpoint the flaws in telekinetic attacks. Cable only needs to affect her for a split second so that she can be turned into swiss cheese by the stormtroopers or Zazie.

4. Even if she can counter his TK, she has to do so and effectively dodge all the shots being fired upon her by the stormtroopers, Zazie and Cable even. I don't think she's capable of this level of multi-tasking.

His TP is countered by Caerula's vampiric eye and his TK is countered by Shiki's mystic eyes of death perception.

If this were a close range fight then you'd have a point, but remember we start at opposite ends of the map. You still have to find all of my members, whereas Cable and the stormtroopers can scan the battlefield to keep tabs on your team from the getgo. We're attacking first, and from a distance where you can't effectively counterattack.

As cool as that sounds, have they ever hit someone with actual decent reaction/combat speeds? I know that the movie versions are not exactly a true gauge of Stormtroopers, but you will need to show something to proof that they can fire and hit superhumanly fast opponents

This is my favorite part. First allow me to introduce Luke Skywalker.

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Luke at the time of ANH was capable of blocking blasterfire while blinded (keeping in mind how fast I've proven these rounds are), and dodging high powered darts through the Force.

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Yet a single stormtrooper was able to not only shoot a blaster out of his hand(quite a showing of accuracy) but also tag him right afterwards.

Luke dodged a barrage of fire, diving over a couch. He swore as one of the guards shot the blaster out of his hand, then activated his lightsaber, lashing out with the glowing beam. The stormtrooper darted out of his reach, then fired again. Luke grunted in pain and toppled backward as the laserfire blasted into his shoulder. Han rushed to help - then stopped, as he felt something sharp jab him in the back.

"Drop it," the guard's flat voice ordered.

Han raised his arms, letting his blaster clatter to the floor. Luke groaned and sat up - but a blaster in the face stopped him from going any further. The other two stormtroopers lay on the ground, unconscious or dead. Han grimaced - they'd almost managed to win.

But when blasters were involved, almost didn't count.

- Taken from Rebel Force 1: Target

If that weren't enough, Stormtroopers have been stated to be much better shots than Tusken Raiders by Obi-Wan's own admission.

And these blast points to accurate for Sand People, only Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise.

- Taken from A New Hope

Tusken Raiders themselves routinely shoot down Podracers going at speeds of up to 800 km/h and have been stated to have a high level of marksmanship.

No Caption Provided

Stormtroopers aren't hindered by moving at fast speeds themselves, as one was capable of shooting down Leia on a speeder bike.

No Caption Provided

Speeder bikes being capable of going up to 500 km/h

Speeder bikes serve as excellent scout vehicles because they can reach up to speeds of 500 kilometers per hour.

- Taken from New Essential Guide to Vehicles & Vessels

So yes, I'm more than confident in the 10 stormstroopers capabilities to shoot down any member of your team that comes their way.

Hei has repeatedly blitzed trained soldiers and reacted to someone capable of kicking at mach 1.

I highly doubt those soldiers are as well trained as stormtroopers. I also highly doubt he'll get that close to begin with.

Shiki has blitzed an opponent that an opponent capable of moving at high speeds.

Impressive, but Cable outreacting Wolverine in mid charge without the use of his telepathy speaks greater of him IMO.

No Caption Provided

James himself is fast enough to outreact speedsters like Speed Demon and run right into a hail of automatic gunfire while dodging each and every one of them in a way that amazes even the likes of Daredevil.

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I'm willing to bet that Wolverine is also head over heels more skilled than Lio, which is made more evident by the fact that he was more prone to using his skill and speed while wearing the brown and yellow costume as opposed to other lazier incarnations. Shiki might be faster than Cable in terms of raw movement speed, but certainly not in reaction time. And she certainly doesn't move faster than he can think, which has been sufficient to casually put up shields long after a bullet was fired such as in Cable and Deadpool #35.

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And that's all that matters as long as he stays at range.

Even the hand ninja should be sufficiently faster and more skilled than the storm troopers considering they can dodge bullets

Not only should those random thugs shooting at them might as well be blind if their marksmanship is to be compared to stormtroopers, but they're also shooting rounds that are much, much slower than that of E-11 blasters. Hand ninjas have been stomped by people in droves who are also bullet-timers (Daredevil, Elektra, Psylocke, Black Widow etc), so they shouldn't fare that much better against highly trained marksmans with guns shooting rounds they aren't fast enough to see coming let alone avoid.

Their weapons being fast are not going to change the fact that they are simply too slow for their opponents. As stated before Hei should be able to single-handily move through and kill them using stabs in the weak points of their armor or electrocuting them with taps.

Between the traps and marksmanship skill I've laid out for them, this scenario isn't very likely. Stormtrooper's armor is built to withstand electrical attacks sufficient to light up a human skeleton.

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Worse comes to worst, Cable picks up a gun and joins the fray which he very well would likely opt to do from the getgo.

Hei alone has dealt with trickier and more dangerous opponents like the magician who could phase through Hei's attacks. With the Hand ninjas there to help it should be a breeze for him to mow through them and then disable Zazie.

Honestly, Hei is lucky if he doesn't get blown to pieces by the detonators around the area surrounding our position.

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For point of reference, this is how powerful one detonator can be.

That doesn't include the net traps and claymores courtesy of Zazie. Between those traps and stormtroopers taking shots at your team from a safe distance, I doubt most if any of your team makes it the warehouse in one piece.

Most of that is negated by either Caerula's ability to literally see all of your team's actions, Shiki's ability to negate TK, and Hei's ability to disable guns.

Most of these require your team to be near mine, and there are several strategies I've laid out to prevent that from happening.

To Summarize

  • My team has the advantage of knowing your team's moves at all times throughout this encounter, allowing them to fight based on what we all know they'll do. Courtesy of Cable's TP, everyone on my team will know of this information.
  • Your team is composed of all glass cannons with very little in the way of defensive options besides trying to dodge, and every member of my team has the means to oneshot them with gear more advanced than anything they've had to face.
  • I have two soldiers with decades of combat experience fighting a myriad of opponents more powerful than them leading 10 soldiers who are also highly trained. The most skilled person on your team mainly has skill and experience fighting in CQC, not leading a team into a fight like this.
  • Your raw speed advantage in Caerula is offset by Cable's TK throwing her off and Zazie's comparable reaction time. The next fastest member on your team is at best as fast as Cable, and certainly not faster than he can think to use his powers.
  • We essentially control the battlefield with carefully laid out traps and long ranged options. Your team's only option is to walk right into our line of sight only to be bombarded with all manner of explosives and nets. And assuming they all survive that, there's still 12 highly trained marksmen mowing them down.
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Primez0ne

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#20  Edited By Primez0ne

@juiceboks: I may be ready for votes if you are.

Counters

Caerula's senses allow her to feel the air molecules shift in her immediate surroundings and scan a person's body, but that isn't the same as say Daredevil's Radar Sense which allows him to detect hidden traps and such. Both examples you posted are of Caerula scanning someone she can already see, and noticing someone she can't by their movements through the air. That's how her Neural Pulse Flow works, by sensing the shifts in air molecules and giving her all the information about the things she can sense through that.

Not only are we starting at a far enough distance to where her senses won't be of immediate use, but she hasn't shown the capability to sense stationary and hidden objects ie thermal detonators and net traps buried underground. Her Neural Pulse Flow will certainly aid her in evading the traps as soon as they are activated, but she won't know about them until that point.

While she was scanning someone she could already see, there is no reason why she would not be able to scan the ground in the same manner. Rakan does not have the same sensory abilities as Caerula and if she can detect differences in the movements in the air, shrapnel patterns, etc, a trap would not be any harder to detect. Most of these traps could easily be dodged by Caerula, Shiki, or Hei considering their feats shown earlier if need be anyway.

You're right, Zazie couldn't beat Alita without her legs. Of course, this was in a zero g environment and Alita was in a space suit engaged in h2h combat. Zazie never fought with her legs, and utilized her space suit to move around. Alita's lack of such limbs shouldn't have been much of a hindrance as they fought with their hands and arms the entirety of the fight. It's also important to note that this was h2h combat, where Alita's specialty lied and yet Zazie was beating her up until she had a PIS moment and remembered a move she was taught a long time ago.

In the end Zazie was still unable to beat a hindered Alita, who was not able to make full use of her usually agility, speed, or abilities like plasma manipulation while Caerula easily handled Alita in a fight. Calling PIS for her to remember a move that she learned some time ago does not invalidate her winning. Even with PIS allowing Alita to survive her fight with Caerula, she would have lost if Caerula did not allow Alita to win.

She won't be able to predict anything from long range. The only "prep" Zazie did was in mid combat, she didn't go into the battle knowing anything about him. Against Caerula, it's likely she at the very least has an idea of who she is either from her own knowledge or anything Alita told her. If not, anything she won't learn from the first shot can be passed on by Cable's mind scan.

She can see the bullet(s) coming as seen from the feat we both have shown from Caerula. My team will be closing onto your team, so being at long range will not make much of a difference. Caerula has also watched the ZOTT final match, which would mean that Caerula would also have knowledge of Zazie.

And yet Nathan still opted to use it because he saw it necessary. That's not the only time he's used his TK to disrupt an enemy's internally, hell in the scans I posted of Cable #91 he used it twice.

In that same scan you posted he said that "telepathy and telekinesis used right act as terrible weapons". He could have been using telepathu. I just feel that there is context you are missing in this. Against opponents he has no history against and someone who can cancel his TK, there is no reason he cannot be taken out before Caerula or Shiki can take him out.

1. Asagami is not more powerful than Cable, not when Cable has been stated and shown to be a more powerful psychic than Charles Xavier and Jean Grey but usually holds back due to keeping the T.O virus from consuming his body. She's also definitely not more skilled than Cable, who has used his TK in a wide variety of applications from amping his guns firepower to turning off mutants powers.

Essentially he still is not able to employ TK on the level of Asagami anyway?

2. Shiki was able to see her TK lines and cut them after Asagami literally spammed it against her. Shiki even thanks her for using it so much and giving her an opportunity to pinpoint the flaw in her TK. Prior to that, she had her arm broken fairly easily.

Shiki saw TK once, so her being to be able to react even better to the ability this time makes sense. That was the first time she ever encountered a TK user. There would be no evidence that she would need to see it spammed again.

3. Shiki hasn't shown the capability to cut internal TK attacks AFAIK, such as pressure on her eardrums or brain. As shown against Asagami, Shiki needs time to pinpoint the flaws in telekinetic attacks. Cable only needs to affect her for a split second so that she can be turned into swiss cheese by the stormtroopers or Zazie.

Stormtroopers would be killed fairly easily and Zazie's weapons can be disabled.

4. Even if she can counter his TK, she has to do so and effectively dodge all the shots being fired upon her by the stormtroopers, Zazie and Cable even. I don't think she's capable of this level of multi-tasking.

As you said your team will also be battling against my team. Shiki does not need to dodge from all of the stormtroopers and Zazie as they will be preoccupied/killed by Hei and the Hand ninjas.

Yet a single stormtrooper was able to not only shoot a blaster out of his hand(quite a showing of accuracy) but also tag him right afterwards.

This Luke Skywalker was between books 4 and 5. He was not as skilled as he later became and only had one formal lesson with Obi-Wan. It is not surprising he could not take blaster shots from a numerous stormtroopers. Also I am not sure if that is a consistent showing for Stormtroopers.

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Not only should those random thugs shooting at them might as well be blind if their marksmanship is to be compared to stormtroopers, but they're also shooting rounds that are much, much slower than that of E-11 blasters. Hand ninjas have been stomped by people in droves who are also bullet-timers (Daredevil, Elektra, Psylocke, Black Widow etc), so they shouldn't fare that much better against highly trained marksmans with guns shooting rounds they aren't fast enough to see coming let alone avoid.

Stormtroopers would also get stomped by any of those people.

Hand ninja have also hurt Iron Man and pushed Luke Cage off a building:

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Honestly, Hei is lucky if he doesn't get blown to pieces by the detonators around the area surrounding our position.

Hei can dodge mach 1 kicks and Caerula will detect any traps.

That doesn't include the net traps and claymores courtesy of Zazie. Between those traps and stormtroopers taking shots at your team from a safe distance, I doubt most if any of your team makes it the warehouse in one piece.

Most of these require your team to be near mine, and there are several strategies I've laid out to prevent that from happening.

Considering the level of prep you are trying to say your troops will have, there is little chance of spreading traps around a building, and then coordinating themselves into a safe position in time. This will take planning and more coordination than a group of people who have never met each other would be willing to do. My team is not just going to sit there either and there is plenty of cover on the way to your side of the map. Even with a telepathic link, it would be unrealistic to work this fast. Your plan depends on a lot on chance. My team not getting there before yours sets up a whole defense perimeter, them being deciding to use traps and the traps actually working. Shiki has already dodged explosions, those nets are pretty ineffective, Caerula can see through the traps.

Conclusions

  • My team has the advantage of knowing your team's moves at all times throughout this encounter, allowing them to fight based on what we all know they'll do. Courtesy of Cable's TP, everyone on my team will know of this information.
  • Your team is composed of all glass cannons with very little in the way of defensive options besides trying to dodge, and every member of my team has the means to oneshot them with gear more advanced than anything they've had to face.
  • I have two soldiers with decades of combat experience fighting a myriad of opponents more powerful than them leading 10 soldiers who are also highly trained. The most skilled person on your team mainly has skill and experience fighting in CQC, not leading a team into a fight like this.
  • Your raw speed advantage in Caerula is offset by Cable's TK throwing her off and Zazie's comparable reaction time. The next fastest member on your team is at best as fast as Cable, and certainly not faster than he can think to use his powers.
  • We essentially control the battlefield with carefully laid out traps and long ranged options. Your team's only option is to walk right into our line of sight only to be bombarded with all manner of explosives and nets. And assuming they all survive that, there's still 12 highly trained marksmen mowing them down.
  • Not much of an advantage since my team is headed straight for yours anyway.
  • I could say the same for yours. All of them would go down to bladed weapons.
  • Hei has experience fighting in a war filled with people capable of using powers while not having any powers, Shiki fights supernatural threats all the time, Caerula is the chairman of the Stellar Nursery Society, who are actually filled with martial artists. She is leading a team of swordsman(Shiki), martial artists and ninjas.
  • Shiki can easily disable Cable's TK advantage and Hei can disable Zazie's guns. My whole team still generally has better raw speed and skill. If it comes down to it Caerula can take them out by simply throwing her knives at the Storm Troopers. Considering her skill level she should be able to aim for their armor's weak-points.
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  • This is offset by the fact that your team would demolished in close range, you are overestimating how effective those traps will be, and their offense can be neutered.

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mickey-mouse

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Tag me when yall ready for people to vote...

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DeathHero61

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@lukehero said:

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