Savage Opress vs Anakin Skywalker (AOTC)

Savage Opress

vs

Anakin Skywalker (AOTC)

Settings and Conditions

• Standard morals.
• Standard weaponry.
• No prep time.
• Location: Theed Hangar.

If Anakin is smart enough not to charge in recklessly like with Dooku I'd say he wins.

@darthduelist9@erkan12@alextheboss@wollfmyth209@themuser@zapan871@frankenmidget

Brutal fight, I'm leaning towards Savage.

Savage takes the majority.

Annie. :)

At this stage I'd honestly say Savage takes the win.

Savage should take the majority.

If we take the anakin pressed dooku version of the fight, anakin, if not, oppress

give anakin all his padawan showings however and...

Might go anakin

I'll go with Savage. AOTC Anakin failed to press Dooku while Savage actually managed to disarm him.

I don't find the Anakin pressing Dooku back version of the fight accurate because AOTC Anakin has failed to do this to Force users like Ventress such as in the OCW Cartoon. In that Cartoon which takes place after AOTC, Dooku stomps Ventress. However, in the same Cartoon Anakin failed to stomp Ventress and was stalemating her, he only overwhelmed her when he received a massive rage boost.

And that wasn't AOTC Anakin, that was a version of Anakin who was better than AOTC Anakin, Anakin's first fight with Ventress took place 3-5 months after AOTC, which gives him a significant amount of time to improve.

That only happened because Savage managed to get Dooku in a poorly positioned stance, but yet again, Anakin never managed to get Dooku in a poorly positioned stance...

@yousufkhan1212: anakin was beating ventress even prior to the rage boost and was clearly shown as more powerful(than ocw ventress) with him blasting him way farther than she blasted him and than him running through her force blast before blasting her. Ventress also chose the location of the fight and lengthened the fight through use of the environment which she had planned/prepped for. Padawan Anakin>ocw ventress.

and then his supposedly superior season 5 self was outclassed by pre prime kenobi, couldn't finish off an unarmed ventress, and was stomped by maul, that arc is a massive outlier

@kbroskywalker:

anakin was beating ventress even prior to the rage boost and was clearly shown as more powerful(than ocw ventress) with him blasting him way farther than she blasted him and than him running through her force blast before blasting her. Ventress also chose the location of the fight and lengthened the fight through use of the environment which she had planned/prepped for. Padawan Anakin>ocw ventress.

Uhuh... Too bad Star Wars Databank disagrees.

"Anakin followed Asajj through hyperspace to the ancient Sith temples of Yavin 4. Anakin continued his pursuit on foot, aided by clone troopers. Using the Force, Asajj whittled away the clone trooper guards, and then began a stunning lightsaber duel with Anakin. So skilled was she, Asajj even proved to be a challenge to the fabled Chosen One of Jedi legend. To defeat her, Anakin needed the edge granted by giving into anger. In a furious counter-attack, young Skywalker repulsed Ventress, who nevertheless survived." - Star Wars Databank

You can't disagree with that I'm afraid.

and then his supposedly superior season 5 self was outclassed by pre prime kenobi,

Because TCW Kenobi is physically stronger than Dooku. Savage's feat of throwing managing to get Dooku in a poorly positioned stance happened because of his hulking size and not giving Dooku much leverage. This technique won't work against a Soresu master like Obi-Wan.

couldn't finish off an unarmed ventress,

Because she was jumping around and more agile than Savage.

and was stomped by maul,

Because of Maul's use of TERAS KASI.

that arc is a massive outlier

No it isn't a freaking outlier, stop saying it's an outlier when it isn't. And it's not going to convince me regardless of how many times you claim it's an outlier.

True. But Savage did manage to contend TCW Anakin and Obi-Wan and It's been stated that it took all of Dooku's power to overcome an enraged Savage while Dooku "easily" defeated AotC Anakin.

Agreed. And Savage's feats in that Episode weren't even PIS. However, he was enraged when he achieved those feats, but also Pre Prime. I wouldn't rule out the idea of Savage contending with TCW S3 Obi-Wan & Anakin at the same time.

@yousufkhan1212: Star wars data bank doesn't override the actual source material itself:

Anakin is very clearly winning by this point at 3:56

-force blasting her all the way into the temple

-4:39 ventress attempts to ambush anakin and is driven back(ventress is an offensive duelist)

-4:45 ventress throws pillar and anakin hits her with it

-4:51 ventress tries to force push anakin and anakin resists it not eve breaking his stride, then anakin force blasts ventress again clearly showing his superiority power wise(ventress couldn't even get him to stop running)

-5:27 ventress after being steadily driven back disarms anakin only to immediately lose that advantage with anakin disarming her via strength

-Anakin gets enraged at 5:42 after he's shown numerous times he's >ocw ventress

Furthermore the rage argument doesn't work because anakin's rage amp wasn't circumstantial at all. anakin gave it to himself, so oppress will also be facing this.

Furthermore regardless of how oppress was able to force choke a comparable force user+a superior one(and yes i think its partially pis), its not something oppress is replicating in a 1 v 1 fight

Because TCW Kenobi is physically stronger than Dooku.

Kenobi took down oppress via skill, dooku has shown he is clearly rots maul's superior in unarmed combat let alone his tcw counterpart. Dooku completely outclassed kenobi unarmed(who had anakin as back up) as late as season 6. Dooku was simultaneously edging anakin+kenobi in unarmed fighting

Because she was jumping around and more agile than Savage.

Dooku is faster than ventress, dooku is also a far more skilled unarmed combatant

@kbroskywalker:

Star wars data bank doesn't override the actual source material itself:

It didn't override the actual source, it's the truth. You don't get to decide.

Anakin is very clearly winning by this point at 3:56

-force blasting her all the way into the temple

-4:39 ventress attempts to ambush anakin and is driven back(ventress is an offensive duelist)

-4:45 ventress throws pillar and anakin hits her with it

-4:51 ventress tries to force push anakin and anakin resists it not eve breaking his stride, then anakin force blasts ventress again clearly showing his superiority power wise(ventress couldn't even get him to stop running)

-5:27 ventress after being steadily driven back disarms anakin only to immediately lose that advantage with anakin disarming her via strength

-Anakin gets enraged at 5:42 after he's shown numerous times he's >ocw ventress

Ventress wasn't retreating, she was leading him to a location of her own choice.

Furthermore the rage argument doesn't work because anakin's rage amp wasn't circumstantial at all. anakin gave it to himself, so oppress will also be facing this.

It was circumstantial because Anakin was getting beaten up, battered and bruised up. And that wasn't AOTC Anakin, that fight took place several months after AOTC.

Kenobi took down oppress via skill,

Jar Kai skill. Dooku doesn't use Jar Kai, he admitted in The Jedi Path he only used Makashi.

dooku has shown he is clearly rots maul's superior in unarmed combat let alone his tcw counterpart.

Lol, don't you mean Obi-Wan? And how is Dooku Obi-Wan's superior in unarmed combat? Landing a kicks and punches doesn't make him a better hand to hand combatant. Dooku landed a kick on Obi-Wan in the ROTS Comic Book because Obi-Wan left himself exposed to counter attack due to using a version of Ataru that is predictable to Dooku.

Dooku completely outclassed kenobi unarmed(who had anakin as back up) as late as season 6.

That wasn't an unarmed combat skill, that was Dooku taking advantage in the lapses of Obi-Wan's use of Ataru, or careless offensive approach.

Dooku was simultaneously edging anakin+kenobi in unarmed fighting

No he wasn't.

Dooku is faster than ventress,

I never brought up speed.

dooku is also a far more skilled unarmed combatant

Based on what is Dooku more skilled in unarmed combat than Ventress?

Sadly, as much as I despite Oppress, he should take this. AOTC Skywalker was just awful. So much potential, but far, far too arrogant. Getting his arm lopped off by Dooku is what made him a better Jedi. It humbled him.

Savage wins 7/10.

@yousufkhan1212:

It didn't override the actual source, it's the truth. You don't get to decide.

It contradicts the source, anakin was clearly winning prior to being enraged

Ventress wasn't retreating, she was leading him to a location of her own choice.

This is based on what exactly?

It was circumstantial because Anakin was getting beaten up, battered and bruised up.

Not when he got enraged, ventress wasn't beating up anakin in anyway whatsoever

Jar Kai skill. Dooku doesn't use Jar Kai, he admitted in The Jedi Path he only used Makashi.

Kenobi incapped oppress the first time via unarmed combat, jar kai was because kenobi had to deal with two opponents(which led to him sacrificing the use of his primary style) dooku does not need jarkai to replicate what kenobi did in a 1 v 1 vs oppress.

Lol, don't you mean Obi-Wan? And how is Dooku Obi-Wan's superior in unarmed combat? Landing a kicks and punches doesn't make him a better hand to hand combatant. Dooku landed a kick on Obi-Wan in the ROTS Comic Book because Obi-Wan left himself exposed to counter attack due to using a version of Ataru that is predictable to Dooku.

I misspoke. Dooku in the novel left kenobi "bonelessly limp" with a kick after kenobi switched to soresu. Dooku in the comic oneshotted kenobi with a kick.

And vs tcw kenobi, he launched him several feet in the air via a kick, and then picked up and threw kenobi whilst dealing with anakin who he staggered with his kicks twice. Kenobi has been shown twice to clearly be less skilled with unarmed combat

@kbroskywalker:

It contradicts the source, anakin was clearly winning prior to being enraged

Not really.

This is based on what exactly?

Based on the fact that she's a tactical fighter.

Not when he got enraged, ventress wasn't beating up anakin in anyway whatsoever

I wasn't saying she was beating him, I was saying Anakin was getting bruised because he got slammed by trees and Force blasted a few times which likely made him angry/frustrated.

Kenobi incapped oppress the first time via unarmed combat,

When?

jar kai was because kenobi had to deal with two opponents(which led to him sacrificing the use of his primary style) dooku does not need jarkai to replicate what kenobi did in a 1 v 1 vs oppress.

But Jar Kai was still important.

I misspoke. Dooku in the novel left kenobi "bonelessly limp" with a kick after kenobi switched to soresu. Dooku in the comic oneshotted kenobi with a kick.

Yeah I mentioned the Comic Book. But how was that a H2H feat?

And vs tcw kenobi, he launched him several feet in the air via a kick, and then picked up and threw kenobi whilst dealing with anakin who he staggered with his kicks twice. Kenobi has been shown twice to clearly be less skilled with unarmed combat

That's not a H2H feat, unarmed combat is when people fight each other without using any weapons, Dooku and Obi-Wan used lightsabers when they fought.

@yousufkhan1212:

Based on the fact that she's a tactical fighter.

So? What tactical benefit was there to her being driven back? Why would she let herself be driven back? How do you tanke anakin ddriving ventress back to mean that ventress was controlling the fight? Unless some source says ventress was controlling the fight, its a baseless claim.

When?

Here:

oppress was still recovering here:

But Jar Kai was still important.

Because it was a 1 v 2, in a 1 v 1, its not, and this is a 1 v 1. In a 1 v 1, kenob using jarkai would be a hindrance for kenobi

Yeah I mentioned the Comic Book. But how was that a H2H feat?

Because it came via unarmed combat. As this is a lightsaber duel, not a h2h fight, these feats are what are relevant here. And the boneless limp was in the novelization.

That's not a H2H feat, unarmed combat is when people fight each other without using any weapons, Dooku and Obi-Wan used lightsabers when they fought.

Picking up and throwing someone with one hand is a unarmed feat, kicking someone into the air is an unamred feat. The fact he is doing this when there are lightsabers present just makes it more impressive.

a. Makes it more relevant to this battle

b. More impressive because he's incoperating these unarmed techniques while in the midst of a saber duel/

So you guys think Anakin can't take a club swinging barbarian. Alright.

@jeditraining101: that barbarian has contended with and even beat council masters. While anakin obviously stomps oppress, this isn't anakin, this is aotc(aka massively pre prime) kenobi who was toyed with and stomped by dooku, and inferior to kit fisto even post aotc

@kbroskywalker:

So? What tactical benefit was there to her being driven back? Why would she let herself be driven back? How do you tanke anakin ddriving ventress back to mean that ventress was controlling the fight? Unless some source says ventress was controlling the fight, its a baseless claim.

Aren't you the same guy who claimed Ventress chose the location of the fight? It's plausible she was trying to control the fight,

Here:

He was already kicked in leg multiple times.

oppress was still recovering here:

It took a few seconds for him to recover.

Because it was a 1 v 2, in a 1 v 1, its not, and this is a 1 v 1. In a 1 v 1, kenob using jarkai would be a hindrance for kenobi

No it's not a hindrance for Obi-Wan.

Because it came via unarmed combat. As this is a lightsaber duel, not a h2h fight, these feats are what are relevant here. And the boneless limp was in the novelization.

Unarmed combat is H2H combat.

Picking up and throwing someone with one hand is a unarmed feat, kicking someone into the air is an unamred feat. The fact he is doing this when there are lightsabers present just makes it more impressive.

a. Makes it more relevant to this battle

b. More impressive because he's incoperating these unarmed techniques while in the midst of a saber duel/

Kicking or throwing other Lightsaber wielding opponents is not impressive in terms unarmed combat

@yousufkhan1212:

Aren't you the same guy who claimed Ventress chose the location of the fight? It's plausible she was trying to control the fight,

Her trying to control the fight =/ she was controlling the fight

He was already kicked in leg multiple times.

By kenobi, the kicks from adi galia clearly did nothing but piss him off, the kicks from kenobi actually drove oppress back. made him jump, and brought him on his knees.

It took a few seconds for him to recover.

It would only take a few seconds for kenobi to take down oppress, oppress only stayed in the fight because maul was there to save him

No it's not a hindrance for Obi-Wan.

Kenobi not using his best style because he's in a 2 v 1 fight is a hindrance for kenobi.

Unarmed combat is H2H combat.

Unarmed combat can be incoperate din non h2h situations, otherwise uanrmed combat would be irrelevant in this fight

@kbroskywalker:

Her trying to control the fight =/ she was controlling the fight

OK? What are you trying to prove?

By kenobi, the kicks from adi galia clearly did nothing but piss him off, the kicks from kenobi actually drove oppress back. made him jump, and brought him on his knees.

Except the difference is that Obi-Wan's kicks didn't do jack shit, and it took multiple kicks in the same leg for Obi-Wan to actually hurt Savage, and Savage quickly recovered from that kick.

It would only take a few seconds for kenobi to take down oppress, oppress only stayed in the fight because maul was there to save him

It took a few seconds for Obi-Wan to kick down Savage after he had already kicked him in the exact same leg multiple times earlier.

Kenobi not using his best style because he's in a 2 v 1 fight is a hindrance for Kenobi.

What you call a "secondary style" is actually called Jar Kai, which is designed to fight multiple opponents. How is that a hindrance? If Obi-Wan opted to use his best style, he wouldn't have made it out there alive.

Unarmed combat can be incoperate din non h2h situations, otherwise uanrmed combat would be irrelevant in this fight

Why are we bringing up unarmed combat again?

This is tough. Savage is a powerhouse. At this time, though, Anakin has a lot of raw power as well. But then we saw Savage:

1) Immediately earn the respect of Tyranus, who didn't hesitate to offer Savage a secret apprenticeship, whereas he never gave Ventress the time of day in regards to becoming a Sith much less an apprentice.

2) Savage was able to hold his own against Ventress and Tyranus.

Both of those things happened at the beginning of his introduction to Tyranus. At that time, Tyranus said that Savage was growing more powerful in the Force daily. If Tyranus was this impressed by Savage this early on, then there is no telling how powerful he was by the time he found his brother and ended up with the double bladed saber.

This contest is between two Force powerhouses. Both are still in training. Savage has an edge with using the dark side, but Anakin would surely get ticked off if he began losing to Savage, especially if Dun Moch is employed by Savage. I'm not so sure S would waste his time with that, though. He just barrels through and wipes out everyone in the landscape, lol.

If Anakin does not get angry, then I'm not sure he'd win.

If Anakin does get angry AND allows it to control him, then I can't really say. I can't make up my mind. I think that Anakin would win more times than he loses, but I think that Savage would also win a few times as well.

Savage with little trouble, 10/10. He's better in every regard: Much stronger physically, has a much larger force might and has better saber showings. Opress even defeats AoTC Skywalker and Kenobi in a 2v1.

Savage goes from thrashing Dooku, Dooku + Ventress and contending with Anakin + Obi Wan to being unable to stomp random council members without a prolonged fight.

Good day Savage wins easily, Bad day Savage wins with lots of trouble.

Savage is inconsistent in performances but on average he should beat padawan Anakin.