Post Apocalypse: Jacthripper vs Hondo

@jacthripper:

• Holden Carver (Sleeper)
• Drake Sinclaire (Sixth Gun)
• Hei (Darker than Black)

@hondo_:

• Deadshot (Pre-52)
• Pointman (FEAR)
• Subject Delta (Bioshock 2)

Rules

• Death or KO.
• No BFR.
• Random Battle.
• Top Team is Red, Bottom Team is Blue.

Welcome to Water World. Unlike the dry wastes in other scenarios, your surrounded by undrinkable water in this one. Stuck on a floating fortress at sea, this man made island is nothing garbage, and shacks held together by desperate hope. To make matters worse is the giant Kraken in the middle. This thing lashing out and attacking anything that moves. Its not too hard to dodge though. Around 30 MPH at the last known spot your characters were at. That said, one good hit will squish ya, and forces you to keep moving. Best way to win this is throwing the other team in the pool dead or alive. Once the last team member is thrown in, the Kraken will be satisfied.

I don't know anything about my opposition but I'll just say this for now (Just to let people know I saw the thread)

My team consists of three forces

Range: Deadshot

Speed: Pointman

Power: Subject Delta

The environment is a double edged sword because Subject Delta won't be able to lay down all his fire power effectively but he can regenerate EVE which powers his abilities so it's a fair trade off.

Both pointman and Deadshot are good at shooting while gunning so it's not bad at all for them, really with out knowledge on my opponents team I will do what I expect in a random encounter and that is keep moving to not get hit by the Kraken and as well as trying to slow down my enemies by having Deadshot shoot their legs to slow them down and Subject Delta to use Insect Swarm to blur their vision/stun their movements.

@jacthripper

Holy Toledo Drake Sinclair is being used.

Tag.

@sirfizzwhizz: @hondo_:

Let's get along then...

The Harbingers

What are they harbingers of? Who knows, but folks will end up dead more often than not!

Gallery

The team, in all it's glory, is composed this match of three simple, but very much lethal, soldiers and assassins. First up is Holden Carver, the man who feels no pain.

The Conductor

Holden's rarely used codename, the Conductor, is rather fitting. Why? Holden has an artifact that fell from the Bleed that grants him his powers.

As you can guess, it's not all that pleasant. The artifact also grants him a minor healing factor, one based on damage inflicted rather than the lethality of the wound. For example, a head shot (that doesn't blow his head away) does less to stop him than a heart shot that would make him bleed out and stop functioning.

As can be seen here in this image cropped for CV standards, he's rather the perfect assassin, no nervousness transfers to his body, so he doesn't screw up, it helps his aim quite a bit as well, so even after getting shot multiple times in the chest, he is still able to fully function and react without mercy.

Next up, I'll talk about the Wild West Gunslinger with some very interesting weapons.

Drake Sinclair

The illustrious Mr. Sinclair is a former Confederate soldier who turned on his commanding officers, and now after killing them possesses four of the Six Guns, which together have the power to rewrite reality. To sum it up quickly, here's a few scans.

Wow, ain't that great! Super concise and saves me the trouble of having to explain it. Nonetheless, the guns will be vital to my team's victory here. And just in case Drake dies, they can be wielded by whoever picks them up next, or Holden since he is immune to pain. In my next posts, I'll get to how the guns have changed Drake, and show off his marksmanship.

But before I do that, let's get to Chinese-Electric-Batman, BK-201, the Black Reaper himself...

Hei

Hei is an assassin who possesses the ability of a contractor. He can administer electric shocks with impunity through direct contact or touching a conductor. He's also incredibly skilled and fast, dodging point blank gunfire effortlessly. To best show his abilities against a completely unknown assailant, here is a short video displaying his agility, skill, adaptability, and electric powers.

So with that, I'll get into my general stratagem.

The Plan

First, let's look at the map...

That's a pretty large map. Significant distance, and we don't know where the other enemy is exactly. This is also a random encounter, so our teams respectively don't know what they're up against. However, my entire team has in some way or form, tactical or military experience. Both Sinclair and Carver were military, Carver in Special Ops before he gained his powers, and Hei also worked with a special operations force before he gained his powers. Altogether, they know to keep out of the way of potential snipers, with Sinclair summoning a few clay dummies to move more normally, as to draw any fire from Deadshot. Now of course, they're prime to get smashed by the Kraken, but what better to throw your team off? So as this happens, my team will be moving as quickly as possible to engage yours.

While I don't know too much about Pointman, much of his abilities don't seem to be anything more than game mechanics, so you'll have to prove that those exist within the game lore (ie; is Slo-Mo a game mechanic or an actual ability). Additionally, you'll have to demonstrate what Subject Delta can do, because I haven't seen any of what it can do outside of CV, and I need a bit of a refresher. Because I don't really know what the heck you stated he's going to do.

@jacthripper:

First of all I want to thank you for providing so much information with good detail, I'll try to do the same to the best of my capabilities so please bare with me.

I suppose we all know who Deadshot is so I'll focus on the other two characters whom are from different video game universes (Note my specialty is on Bioshock so I may not be entirely accurate on Pointman)

Pointman

Short Bio:

The Point Man is a member of the U.S. Army's First Encounter Assault Reconspecial forces detachment, and is the main protagonist of the F.E.A.R. series, being playable in F.E.A.R.: First Encounter Assault Recon, F.E.A.R.: Extraction Point and F.E.A.R. 3. He has served in the US army since he was 18 years old as a test subject for Armacham Technology Corporation, and more specifically,Genevieve Aristide. Before he was transferred to First Encounter Assault Recon, he had served in many conflicts as a special forces operative.

Source is from the games cutscenes/scripted events/dialogue. His in game ability dubbed as Slow Mo is a canon ability that he has in lore but its specific limitations are not consistent.

But the way it works is that Alma (His Psionic mother) gave him the potential to have enhanced speed as well as reflexes (via supernatural power), the Armacham Corporation surgically enhanced him because well they wanted super soldiers and blah blah it eventually back fired on them (Not really relevant to tell the whole FEAR story at this point unless we're talking about his abilities)

WHILE yes most of Pointman's Slow Mo feats come from game play it still is a scripted action that the developers went through to animate and is a key essential ability Pointman has. (It's also mentioned in lore)

Don't fret though! I have trailers to show what he is supposed to be like from a lore perspective

Pointman does not have any solid accuracy feats I can use that are not based on gameplay unfortunately, however there are many instances in his three games where there's scripted events (A scripted event is a in game cutscene that is consistent and another way of gauging lore abilities) where he has to fight supernautral demon monsters that slaughter elite spec ops soldiers like they were fodder, he also on several occasions goes through countless elite soldiers as if they were fodder themselves.

So this is what I have for Pointman, not very informative I know so I'll try to add more next time

Subject Delta

Ah my favorite Bioshock character and one that I'm VERY informed about.

Subject Delta is a Big Daddy and their specialty is dealing with super powered mutants known as Splicers (For those of you who lack knowledge on Bioshock please click the spoiler for more information)

Subject Delta stands 7'1, don't let his size fool you. Subject Delta is more then capable of keeping up with super powered mutants known as Splicers who possess exotic abilities and super human physical abilities, in order to understand how impressive this is I have to show what Splicers can do.

The following scans below are weakened versions of Splicers (They are significantly weaker than the ones Delta fights)

Now here is further proof that the ones Delta fight are superior to the ones in the Novels

This type of narrative development trickles down into the types of encounters you can expect to experience while playing through. "The splicers are divided in two different ways. On the mechanical side, you've got the old generation splicers who are way tougher than anything you faced in BioShock 1…Rapture is much more dangerous because of those first-generation guys who have been splicing ever since. Then there are the newbies who've just gotten their first taste of Adam who survived or came from somewhere else, and those guys are just beginning to fall. Now they're also separated ideologically. There's the Rapture family who follows Sophia Lamb and who basically get their Adam distributed on the drip evenly between the people. And then there are the rogue splicers who have fallen off the wagon and who don't work with Lamb and will hunt down Little Sisters on their own and for whom the Big Sisters were created to hunt."

============

In terms of the tone of fear, as a Big Daddy there are lots of things in Rapture 10 years later that can destroy you. The Rapture in BioShock 2 is much meaner. For me, anyway, BioShock is as much tragedy as it is any kind of ghost story or tale of fear. What I'm targeting is more of a kind of moral horror, that as a Big Daddy with free will you're very different from Jack in BioShock 1 and we want to celebrate that free will and hopefully get you to look at your responsibility and have a moment of chilled introspection."

http://www.ign.com/articles/2009/12/01/rebuilding-rapture-in-bioshock-2

In the ten years that separate the end of Bioshock from the beginning of its sequel, the underwater city of Rapture has deteriorated. It’s not that the place has necessarily decayed, though the art deco signage and once plush 1930’s fixtures and fittings exhibit perhaps a little more wear, tear and gunshot wounds than before. Rather, it’s those inhabitants that roam its deep-sea corridors who have worsened with the passing of time, their hellish mutations accelerated yet further by another decade’s worth of substance abuse.

ADAM, the curious, DNA-altering essence extracted from sea slugs and injected into the veins of Rapture’s bored and disillusioned citizens, has diversified and toughened the city’s monstrous population in terrible ways. If Bioshock was about the utopia project turned to dystopian ruin, then Bioshock 2 examines what happens when dystopias descend to hells. 2K Marin is quick to point out that Jack, the brawny but essentially human protagonist from the first game, simply would not survive in this cruel new world of heroin-chic splicers and ethically-bankrupt scientists.

So perhaps it’s just as well that this time around, you play not as a plane crash survivor who stumbles serendipitously into Rapture’s depths, but rather a prototype Big Daddy, one of the hulking creatures – part oversized diver, part portable drill bit – who plod its network of underwater tunnels. Known only as Subject Delta, your character has become separated from his little sister, one of the waif-like girls who accompany each Big Daddy around Rapture harvesting ADAM from its dead and dying citizens. Subject Delta has gained sentience and, importantly, a free will of his own. Unshackled from the whims of his creator, you’re free from the relentless task of hunting ADAM; free, if 2k Marin are to be believed, to become whoever you choose to become.

http://www.vg247.com/2009/12/21/hands-on-with-bioshock-2-in-london/

Oh also typically Subject Delta keeps his slow like juggernaut like actions because he's defending a little girl

Electric attacks won't do much damage to Delta considering as you see in the gif he's survived a shot before, here in the Rapture Novel

Rapture City Novel pg 280/369

"A man in front of Bill went rigid and jerked about like a marionette dangled by a palsied hand, electrocuted by a lightning throwing plasmid."

It can one shot a normal human no problem, also you may still think that Delta is too slow (Even though he tagged a Splicer in melee)

Here is another example that he can use his enhanced speed (but for short bursts)

Not only does he have impressive speed and strength for his size but his ace is his amazing durability,

Big Daddies are virtually immune to non-modified small arms (Killing a Big Daddy with just a pistol is game play mechanics, shotguns and above are require to harm and kill a Big Daddy) , the pistol the Splicer is using fires .38 rounds and the Big Daddy is completely unfazed by the gun fire and absolutely curbstomps the Splicer

And well for accuracy he shoots a two handed gun perfectly with one hand against five opponents and does not miss a single shot

I can provide more feats if it isn't sufficient.

P.S: Just wanted to add everyone on my team is highly skilled as well. Also what insect swarm does

It releases a swarm of augmented insects that can harm and even kill splicers, think insect generation and command but it is best used to obscure enemy vision and prevent them from accurately shooting.

@hondo_: Thank you for such a nice debriefing on your characters. And you are correct, I am quite familiar with Deadshot, though I might recommend posting a bit about him in your next post for the sake of those reading the debate. I'll have a post up shortly.

@sirfizzwhizz:

@hondo_: So with the information you've provided, we can now have a jolly good debate! To help set the mood, here's some listening music for those who indulge.

And with that... Let's get into it

Addressing Strengths, Weaknesses, and Counters

Pointman

Strengths

Pointman is fast. Wicked fast it seems, based on the gifs you showed. He's also skilled, and obviously possesses a heavy military background. This makes him a formidable opponent. Unfortunately for him, as far as durability goes, he seems to be pretty human. This means a well placed bullet will put him down more likely than not, or alternative means of death. Holden Carver makes an excellent opponent for Pointman. Why? Pointman shoots his target, then moves on, when he does so against Holden, he'll unfortunately find that Holden doesn't mind getting shot all that much, and quickly be shot in return. Like so

So he can definitely take a hit, and he can definitely hit back hard enough to put Pointman down, lethally or non-lethally. And as you can see from the scan, even being non-lethal is not very beneficial to Holden's opponents. This also show a bit of a nice speed feat, as after getting shot a few times, he effortlessly clears the distance between himself and his opponents disarms or and shoots the others before they can shoot him again.

Subject Delta

Delta is easily the strongest and most durable opponent my team has to face today, a genuine tank. He's difficult to put down, and he can dish out damage. His insect swarm seems dangerous.

However, in spite of his bull-rush capabilities, Delta isn't that fast, and the area is open, meaning he won't be getting the drop on anyone here. Additionally, we don't know how strong his insect swarm is, at that's an in game buff, meaning that it could do little more than distract, or conversely eat people alive. It's capable of devastation, but considering that it's use is a player based decision rather than a lore one makes it unlikely to be of great effect.

The best answer to his is of course Drake Sinclair, since we're starting at a range One nice thing about the Six Guns is that they don't run out of ammunition. This means that while they do still fire like a normal revolver, they never have to be reloaded. This of course means that Drake can sit back and use the Fourth Gun, which summons clay bodies for the spirits of the dead, in order to slow him and his teammates down, and then can use the first gun to simply blow Subject Delta away piece by piece. He can take a cannon shot perhaps, but can he take 6? 8? 20? He'll just be blown into submission and then smithereens.

Deadshot

Strengths

We're all familiar with the famous Deadshot, impeccable marksmanship, cool gadgets, and a cold heart. However, he's met his match in Hei, who can effortlessly dodge gunfire, wears a bulletproof coat, and is inhumanly fast. Here's a perfect example of how fast and agile he can be. He should be able to (similarly to how Batman does it) engage and take out Deadshot. It's even easier because Deadshot has to worry about the clay dummies swarming the field.

The Random Factor

Now of course, I've written my post as if my characters have full knowledge, when that is simply is not accurate. However, as we begin to engage, it will quickly become obvious what each character is capable of. This is where the importance of my team's abilities and skills comes into play. Drake's abilities are flashy and visible, making him the immediate target, however, the moment that my other two team members are forgotten, even if only for a moment, they are at their most lethal. Hei has at multiple points moved at rates faster than most humans can react to. Holden is never above using his ability for dirty tricks, such as playing dead to gain an advantage. They're both incredibly lethal, and based on Hei's speed and Holden's sustainability, they aren't in too much danger.

Conclusions

My team as a whole is better suited to facing down unknown opponents, and is easily able to take advantage of the element of surprise/mystery to eliminate your team. While your team may seem more powerful to some, their capabilities quickly become obvious, while my team's abilities, especially Holden's and Hei's) are a bit more difficult to notice until it's too late.

Okay will do, oh also I want to apologize for not replying sooner. Really sorry!

Counter Argument

I completely agree with 90% of what you said lol (The other 10% being that you'll win although it can go either way)

This battle is one of rock paper scissors TBH, our characters can each hard counter the other

Subject Delta v Drake

Pointman v Holden

Deadshot v Hei

Are all battles that are the best in your favor because they can hard counter my characters with their own abilities, but the good thing is since this is a team battle and mine are together it means that they don't need to necessarily engage on that term.

My set up would attempt to be

Subject Delta v Holden

Deadshot v Drake

Pointman v Hei

In that set up my team ends up having the highest chance to win, I'm quite unaware of Drake's accuracy feats but I'm making the assumption that Deadshot is the best to counter him via faster firing weapons and better accuracy

If your team adapts to work around my team I will attempt to do the same but I believe my team would have higher chance to succeed because Deadshot v Drake is not a battle that will last long due to his amazing accuracy and speed which is only helped by his exotic ammunition

I'll give Drake credit because of the environment which is really far (And I don't know about any very long distance shots DS has performed) but I do know that the odds of Deadshot taking out Drake before he bogs down my team are high because of exotic ammunition.

Sure Deadshot may not get a good bead immediately but his incendiary rounds can serve as a area of effect so even a near shot can effectively take out Drake if he does not have any form of super durability, also if he's taken out by incendiary rounds that means if he has his guns on his possession that'll make them hard to get because he's on fire and thus reduce your teams chance of bogging mine down.

Subject Delta v Holden is another set up that is a massive edge turner, Holden's one trump of being resistant to damage and immunity to pain can come back as a double edged sword. Subject Delta is the heaviest equipped and does the most damage out of everyone in my team and should he engage Holden I doubt he can last more than a few seconds, why you ask?

Well because of his weapons, primarily the amazing 50.cal

The 50.Cal is a heavy weapon that Subject Delta wields with one hand!

A 50.cal is incredibly power as it can even delimb a person with a single shot if aimed at the right place!

As you can see here a single 50.cal shot just goes through four pieces of steel and sends it flying, Subject Delta's 50.cal is fully automatic can he contains (Ammo Piercing,Anti Personnel,Regular)

Delta can carry up to 360 regular rounds and an additional 360 mix of armor piercing/anti personnel which means he has a total of 720 rounds which is mooooore than plenty to rip apart some one who isn't more durable than a human but lets say that Delta misses a few times

He has access to a rocket launcher similar in design to the rumblers, the yield is unknown but its presumably at least grenade level or better considering that Big Daddies always carry heavier weapon equivalents to counter the ones that Splicers have.

The RL doesn't have a lot of ammo but it does have heat seeking rockets which once again in combination with all of Delta's weapons should make short work of Holden or outright incapacitate him, now lets say even worst worst case scenario that Delta runs out of ammo he can still use the Incinerate Plasmid which is canon and scripted (So he definitely has it)

A single shot is more than enough to incapacitate Holden by melting his face off :O (I posted the scan in my previous post) even if he jumps into the water as soon as he's on fire he won't be able to see anymore so he's a lower priority

Hei v.s Pointman?

Well these two are pretty much opposite sides of the same coin, I don't have much to say other than Hei is a agile beast but Pointman with his automatic weapons should be able to keep Hei at bay (forcing him to avoid gunfire) long enough for Delta and Deadshot to take out their respective peers before tripple teaming on Hei who's probably going to be the biggest threat because of his insane agility.

Things might not go to plan

Well as we both said our guys are going to be running and gunning, your group is more agile but 2/3's of my team are protected by armor and shots won't incapacitate them (I respect Holden's pain immunity but if some one shot say his bone that would make his body move less effectively mean while anyone that shoots Delta/Deadshot wouldn't slow them down until the armor is broken)

Drake's biggest ace is going to be his heavy hitting canon gun, Pointman and Deadshot are skilled and fast enough to avoid his aim consistently so the one that is in trouble is Subject Delta.

However he has sufficient durability that I'm confident that he can last long enough to wipe one or two enemy team members before expiring, an interesting twist however is his Drill

(Pardon some of the game mechanics)

The Drill has an upgrade called reflector and its described as

• Reflector Plate

A large electromagnetic dynamo is powered by the Drill's rotation.

This upgrade causes every shot and projectile to be reflected back at the attacker when spinning the Drill

Now it is obviously hyper bole that it can redirect any or every projectile but it is with in reason that it can reflect bullets due to a visible magnet shield, as you can see in the video around the 0:25-0:50 mark its a valid tactic for Delta to use the drill to reflect ranged projectiles and close in or continue evading attacks.

Also (Can't find the video) Delta has a high tolerance to penetration and explosive trauma, a Big Sister's syringe is powerful or sharp enough to penetrate the glass of Rapture City which is in canon bullet proof and explosive resistant.

That's when the explosion came. The doors exploded inward, knocking three constables like ragdolls into the center room. Bill shoved their table over for partial cover, pushed Elaine to the ground behind the tabletop, and covered her with his body.Machine-gun rounds ricocheted from the bullet proof windows to slam through tuxedos, to wound squealing women in their glittering finery. Elaine was screaming something about Sophie. Another bomb flew into the room and detonated --- body parts spun overhead spraying blood.

-

Rapture City Novel pg 306/369

another bomb, which blew up on a table under which three men in tuxes crouched --- their tuxedos and their flesh mingled wetly in the blast.

Bill hoped to God the rogue splicers had the common sense not to throw too many bombs near the windows. The windows were supposed to be blast proof, but they could only take so much.

In canon Delta's suit never gets penetrated by anything despite having to fight enemies in such scripted events, in the end he does die but from massive upon massive amounts of TNT explosives at near pointblank and still survives for a few minutes before expiring.

Prior to his death however (early game) he withstands a submarine torpedo almost at point blank (to be fair he had a moderate amount of metal as cover but it still knocked him out of the sub.

2) The pestilence gun won't do much trouble because Delta is in air tight armor which protects him from the pressure of the bottom of the sea

3) The undead clay, I don't want to seem downplaying so are there any more feats of them?

I'm making the assumption that Point Man and Deadshot are too agile to be bogged down by them and the Kraken would kill them naturally so the only one who's in danger is Delta but he can use a Iceplasmid to instantly incapacitate any clay monsters infront of him and then he can drill dash past them.

(Can't get the scans right now but Iceplasmids can in canon freeze people solid in a instant)

4) Depending if you want to take Bio2 Tonics as canon he should have resistance to flame based attacks and its debatable if the Freeze plasmid can put it out or mitigate the damage

Ending

So to sum it up for those who don't want to read through all of that,

If my team does not adapt and switch members to deal with the others I'm fluffed like a pancake but realistically speaking my team is more than capable of adapting to take out the other team

Delta v Holden

Holden's greatest advantage of pain immunity can not deal with Delta's over whelming fire power and Delta surpasses Holden in durability too so he does not have much over Delta (But he does have a smaller profile which is itself a good advantage)

Deadshot v Drake

Well if Drake does not have some awesome evasion feats than Deadshot should be able to tag him and if he gets just a single shot with incendiary ammo he's toast lol

Poitman v.s Hei

They're pretty much equals, fortunately the skill sets of Pointman's team mates better suit each other and the fact that they have armor is a nice bonus. Pointman just needs to hold off Hei long enough for Delta or Deadshot to finish off their counterpart.

This is my opinion of my plan/tactic,

Your turn :D

(Also apologies in advance if I came out rude/ignorant/downplaying)

@hondo_: No worries, a thoroughly enjoyable post. I'll have something up soon.

@jacthripper: @hondo_: so far so good

@hondo_: Apologies for the delay.

Continuation

I completely agree with 90% of what you said lol (The other 10% being that you'll win although it can go either way)

Fantastic, it's nice to have people agree.

This battle is one of rock paper scissors TBH, our characters can each hard counter the other

Subject Delta v Drake

Pointman v Holden

Deadshot v Hei

Are all battles that are the best in your favor because they can hard counter my characters with their own abilities, but the good thing is since this is a team battle and mine are together it means that they don't need to necessarily engage on that term.

My set up would attempt to be

Subject Delta v Holden

Deadshot v Drake

Pointman v Hei

In that set up my team ends up having the highest chance to win, I'm quite unaware of Drake's accuracy feats but I'm making the assumption that Deadshot is the best to counter him via faster firing weapons and better accuracy

Now this is where my key portion of my characters strategic abilities come into play. They each are constantly in situations where they are pitted against unknowns, yet still overcome them. Because of this I predict that my outcome is more likely. For example

• Holden would know not to engage Subject Delta. Why? Because Holden's power requires skin contact, and he's going to be able to tell that Pointman is the only one he can touch, and the other two are armored.
• Hei is more likely to go after someone he can likewise sink a knife into, again, not Subject Delta.

• Drake is used to fighting large monstrosities

The Gatling Gun

While the Gatling Gun is indeed a fearsome weapon, it's also one that will hinder Subject Delta, especially if he's holding it in one hand. It's pretty massive, and the recoil from it is enough that it has to be mounted for use (this seemed to be the real world equivalent, .50 caliber, 3 barrel, etc.).

Now why is this important? It matters because if he's using this gun he's moving pretty slow; which is definitely a no go in this situation. Why?

Probably the very large Kraken sitting in the middle of them map

To make matters worse is the giant Kraken in the middle. This thing lashing out and attacking anything that moves. Its not too hard to dodge though. Around 30 MPH at the last known spot your characters were at. That said, one good hit will squish ya, and forces you to keep moving. Best way to win this is throwing the other team in the pool dead or alive. Once the last team member is thrown in, the Kraken will be satisfied.

So how does this change the strategy? Neither team can stay still, or really move slow. Fizz didn't provide us an interval for the tentacle smashing, but presuming it's every 30 seconds or so (@sirfizzwhizz) busting out a siege weapon is not the greatest plan. Additionally, that's the importance of the 4th Gun-- Cannon Fodder. It's not so important for the purpose of actually killing you, but it's great for slowing you down. If you have to turn and target every enemy, you're going nowhere fast. As far as feats for the souls, they pretty much have human capabilities, they just don't die. For example, one of Drake's friends is killed by the gun, but when summoned, he is just as capable in combat, though he may no longer communicate.

Which allows them to be totally capable against something like a wolf while unarmed, which would rip most folks faces off.

In Addition

While I don't want to be a prick about it, Subject Delta seems to be a bit too durable for this tournament. I need to check, but I'm fairly sure that bulletproof was the limit, whereas he seems pretty close to being a walking tank.

Conclusions

• My team is more likely to engage in a battle favorable to themselves, based on the knowledge of their own abilities and the visual appearances of their opponents.

An Aside

On the topic of how many posts we want to do, after this one, does one more round of counters sound good? Then we can run some final conclusions and wrap it up. If you want to debate more or less than that, it's fine, I just don't like dragging out debates.

@sirfizzwhizz: Is this still ongoing?

@jacthripper: @hondo_: Voting needs to start roughly in 2 weeks from now.

@sirfizzwhizz: How long is this going?

I meant more in terms of the whole tourney.

@hondo_: @jacthripper: Voting in one week.