Iron Fist vs. Spider-man

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jashro44

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Peter's gonna lose this.

Since you sound so sure I'll ask you to explain why.

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deactivated-6241fa3a1cff5

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@jashro44: This is how I feel as Hawkeye lol:

Loading Video...

https://youtu.be/jD9h09ER-y4?t=2m27s

Either way, I think IF is too skilled, has more experience and can dish out much more damage than Pete. Web incap is not possible because Danny can burn through them with his chi.

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jashro44

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@llehdevil: Nothing showed up in your spoiler tab....As for your argument Danny is skilled but it has been shown he has issues with Peter's spider-sense and while Peter may not be as skilled as iron fist (obviously) his other powers are an equalizer. I mean his spider-speed makes him as fast as Danny, he is just as acrobatic and graceful as iron fist (arguably more so), and his wall crawling gives him better mobility on top of spider-sense which helps him telegraph moves and dodge. I mean what does Danny's skill allow him to do that spider-powers don't allow spider-man to do or counter? I am not saying his skill is completely irrelevant but its offset by Peter's powers.

How is Danny more experienced? Peter has been a super hero for nearly a decade now IIRC and as spider-man Peter has seen just about everything. What experiences has iron fist faced that will help him so much against spider-man? As for burning through webbing how hot can Danny's chi burn? Spider-mans webbing has resisted fire in the past.

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@jashro44: Updated now, it's irrelevant lol.

And fair enough... And Danny burned through T'Challa's armor, but that may be WIS, or the cause of kinetic force and not the cause of chi burning. I think Spidey can win though, thanks for the knowledge.

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jashro44

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@jashro44: Updated now, it's irrelevant lol.

And fair enough... And Danny burned through T'Challa's armor, but that may be WIS, or the cause of kinetic force and not the cause of chi burning. I think Spidey can win though, thanks for the knowledge.

No problem. Regarding Danny and Black Panther Danny punched the armor repeatedly to over load his vibranium suit. He didn't burn it.

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deactivated-6241fa3a1cff5

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@jashro44: So webbing can't be overloaded? That's my last card.

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jashro44

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@jashro44: So webbing can't be overloaded? That's my last card.

Well spider-mans webbing has limits and can be broken all though it can't be "over loaded" because it doesn't absorb energy like T'challa's vibranium suit. Danny can punch through spider-mans webbing and rip it with his chi. I did upload a scan of iron fist doing that all though he arguably couldn't have done it immediately since after Peter webbed him up it allowed Peter to explain the situation (all though you can argue that iron fist just didn't try to escape the webbing at that point). Regardless there are other uses for webbing even if Peter' can't use it for incapacitate like swinging iron fist around or just slowing him down.

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jay_z94

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#308  Edited By jay_z94

Spiderman.

His Super-speed and spider sense will negate Iron fist's skill if Peter is fighting seriously. And Spiderman's punches are gonna be doing some damage.

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Adam_Taurus

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jay_z94

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@llehdevil said:

Peter's gonna lose this.

Or you could reply to Visemoon and Jash's counter arguments, instead of just repeating that Iron Fist wins

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@jay_z94 said:
@adam_taurus said:
@llehdevil said:

Peter's gonna lose this.

Or you could reply to Visemoon and Jash's counter arguments, instead of just repeating that Iron Fist wins

I agree with the consensus that IF wins now. ;o

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#312  Edited By Adam_Taurus

@visemoon said:

@adam_taurus:

1st off, learn how to tag someone

Yes, Fist responded with this: "I held my own against him, but Spider Man is more dangerous than he looks."

Definition of holding your own: "retain a position of strength in a challenging situation."

I'm not saying Iron Fist won or lost, but this doesn't necessarily mean that Fist lost. Unless you actually have the battle scans, nothing can be made definite.

Who said Fist lost? NO one here said Fist Lost. Not trying to be rude, but are you even paying attention and reading what people are writing? He admitted he was unable to beat Spider-Man in the past...FACT!!!

Here are both fights (both of which BTW had a much weaker fist and fist was holding back a lot)

Spider-Man ALYWAYS hold back against people under his powerset. You're not proving anything that weak statement

That first fight, Iron fist didn't use chi except when he broke out of the webs, and that was a MINUSCULE percentage of his chi. He himself even admitted he shouldn't have gotten mad and thus stopped fighting. That shouldn't even be here

So? Is this suppose to mean anything? He was MAD and was the AGGRESSOR and said he was going to KILL Spider-Man. And did he beat Spider-Man?...NOPE!. In fact he was webbed up for a couple of minutes and Peter had the advantage at the end of the fight. Heck some people would argue that he won, because technically incapacitation is a win according to board rules.

As for the second fight, Iron fist delivered MUCH harder blows to Spider man. What is also impressive is the fact that he can successfully hide from Spiderman and even get an iron fist on him before he can react with the spider sense. They both got an even number of blows on each other, so I consider this a tie. It still shouldn't be here because, that was a much weaker fist.

Yep, and that's another fight he was unable to beat Spider-Man. In fact Peter had the advantage at the end of that fight as well

I'm not even going to bother wasting my time pointing out all your other flaws. I've proven my point, and Iron fist Stomps

LOL, only thing you have proven is your inability comprehend comics. You should spend your time learning the difference between hyperbole and fact. I'm pretty sure if someone told you "That man is cold as ice" or "That lady is smoking hot" or "that woman's smile is brighter than the sun" you would take them literally.

1) Knowing how to properly use a website has nothing to do with the validity of my claims. However, a forum on how to use the functions of this site ow

2) If you admit that fist didn't loose, and he didn't win, then that also means that Spiderman couldn't beat fist in that fight. AKA, a tie. THATS why it shouldn't be used.

3) Yep, and Iron fist holds back MUCH more. I made that very clear through the helicarrier scan. Also, use proper grammar for pete's sake.

4) Iron fist could've broken out of the webbing immediately. He didn't do it right away because Spider man wasn't a foe.

5) I'll talk about the two fights (both btw are obsolete since they both show weaker versions of pete and danny) in jash's counterclaim.

6) My own inability? Bud, you were the one saying Iron fist tanking Nuke level explosives is "hyperbolic" AFTER I posted the scan proving it.

@jashro44 said:
@adam_taurus said:

That first fight, Iron fist didn't use chi except when he broke out of the webs, and that was a MINUSCULE percentage of his chi. He himself even admitted he shouldn't have gotten mad and thus stopped fighting. That shouldn't even be here

Iron fist didn't spam chi because it taxes him (especially back than). Not sure what your point is about iron fist stating he shouldn't have gotten mad. That just makes the showing better for spider-man.

My point is that Iron fist didn't immediately break out of the webs (which he clearly could've) because he realized Spidey wasn't a foe. If you READ the comic, Fist is shown to have realized spidey was a friend.

@adam_taurus said:

As for the second fight, Iron fist delivered MUCH harder blows to Spider man. What is also impressive is the fact that he can successfully hide from Spiderman and even get an iron fist on him before he can react with the spider sense. They both got an even number of blows on each other, so I consider this a tie. It still shouldn't be here because, that was a much weaker fist.

The only reason he did from Peter's spider-sense is because it was busy warning him about the trap, we saw Danny can't hide himself from Peter's spider-sense when Peter dodged him in the dark. If Peter didn't have to worry about those traps Danny wouldn't have landed that hit and his ability to blend into his surroundings would have been irrelevant. So no stealth wouldn't normally be a factor. Danny landed his hits through cheap shots and by exploiting traps. He wouldn't have landed those hits otherwise.

Considering they got an even number of hits and iron fist had a bunch of advantages he wouldn't normally have should tell you something. As for iron fist being weaker spider-man has also improved since that showing.

So, what about when Fist used a diluted version of the iron fist to punch Pete into a building? He said something about Camo was about knowing when and where to strike. That was a much harder blow that what Pete delivered and it hit him head on. It even said that iron fist's chi wasn't at its best.

I agree Spiderman has gotten stronger. SO has Fist. Even more of a reason not to use those scans as fuel for your claims.

@adam_taurus said:

I'm not even going to bother wasting my time pointing out all your other flaws. I've proven my point, and Iron fist Stomps.

Keep telling yourself that.

No, respond to my FULL post. Not just the ones you want to.

I notice both you have only decided to attack me with those scans and no the other points I brought up. Care to explain why?

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jashro44

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@adam_taurus: Actually if you read the scan the narration states "it took him a couple minutes to realize he was caught, but good, and when I didn't do anything to him he must have realized I was telling the truth." So according to the narration iron fist stopped fighting back when he was webbed up and after a few minutes of Spider-Man doing nothing he realized his mistake. So based on the dialogue iron fiat was webbed up for a few minutes.

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jashro44

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@adam_taurus: As for the rest what did I not address? As for the second fight again your referring to the same moment I addressed iron fist used a trap to do that. Without the trap his camoflogue would t have worked and he wouldn't have lured Spider-Man into the air.

Both characters have gotten stronger but I have posted more recent and relevant scans showing The new avengers including iron fiat struggling with smythes spider slayer army because of there spider-sense. I can also make other comparisons like comparing both of there showings against shadowland daredevil.

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I don't recall voting here, so... Fist of Iron.

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visemoon

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#316  Edited By visemoon

@adam_taurus:

2) If you admit that fist didn't loose, and he didn't win, then that also means that Spiderman couldn't beat fist in that fight. AKA, a tie. THATS why it shouldn't be used

You don't want to used it due to the fact that Peter had the advantage of both fights. Danny was incapacitated in the 1st fight and in the 2nd fight Peter was ground pounding. Sorry that you don't like it

3) Yep, and Iron fist holds back MUCH more. I made that very clear through the helicarrier scan. Also, use proper grammar for pete's sake.

Oooo, Danny hit a large, slow moving object that doesn't hit back. Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense.

Iron fist could've broken out of the webbing immediately. He didn't do it right away because Spider man wasn't a foe.

And Peter could have caved Danny's head in with one punch....you know..since he got superhuman strength and all

6) My own inability? Bud, you were the one saying Iron fist tanking Nuke level explosives is "hyperbolic" AFTER I posted the scan proving it.

Lol. No amount of explosives on a train will equal that of a nuke. Not even close...unless the train was carrying a nuke, which it wasn't.

Hyperbole= exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally.

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visemoon

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#317  Edited By visemoon

@jashro44 said:

@adam_taurus: I can also make other comparisons like comparing both of there showings against shadowland daredevil.

WTF...you read my mind? Get out of my head

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algorhythm511

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@visemoon said:

@adam_taurus:

3) Yep, and Iron fist holds back MUCH more. I made that very clear through the helicarrier scan. Also, use proper grammar for pete's sake.

Oooo, Danny hit a large, slow moving object that doesn't hit back. Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense.

I think adam_taurus is trying to show the amount of force that Iron Fist is capable of producing. Which is an insane amount of force when you consider the mass of the Hellicarrier. He holds back quite a bit.

6) My own inability? Bud, you were the one saying Iron fist tanking Nuke level explosives is "hyperbolic" AFTER I posted the scan proving it.

Lol. No amount of explosives on a train will equal that of a nuke. Not even close...unless the train was carrying a nuke, which it wasn't.

Hyperbole= exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally.

I will have to agree with visemoon on this one. The bomb that destroyed Hiroshima was equivalent to about 15 kilotons (or 30 million pounds) of TNT. Most trains can carry up to 200 tons. That much TNT would put you a little over the Davy Crocket (the world's smallest nuclear explosive). You could argue the explosives had a higher yield per gram than TNT, but it would take extremely high yield explosives to even peak over 1 kilotons and that's assuming they're densely packed in each car.

However, even tanking an explosion at even 50 tons of TNT would be significantly more force than a punch from a 10-20 ton strength character. 50 Tons of TNT if hadn't absorbed most of the kenetic force would have killed his friends. This shows a how durable a Chi amped Danny can be.

None of this is to say that Danny wins or loses this. He would still need to overcome Spider-Man's speed and agility (which a case could be made), webbing (this would at least slow Danny down), and the Spider-Sense (which another case could be made, but I'm tired and going to bed.)

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#319  Edited By visemoon

@algorhythm511:

I think adam_taurus is trying to show the amount of force that Iron Fist is capable of producing. Which is an insane amount of force when you consider the mass of the Hellicarrier. He holds back quite a bit.

Oh, everyone's well aware of Ironfist damage output. But like you already mentioned, Danny has somewhat of a hill to overcome which is the point Jashro and I are trying to make. And I can tell you understand that as well

And goodnight :-)

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@jay_z94 said:
@adam_taurus said:
@llehdevil said:

Peter's gonna lose this.

Or you could reply to Visemoon and Jash's counter arguments, instead of just repeating that Iron Fist wins

I agree with the consensus that IF wins now. ;o

I was referring to Adam

Fair enough, I disagree

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christianrapper

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i don't understand these forums sometimes. hasn't peter already beaten ironfist? why should it be different because this is a battle forum?

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brucerogers

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i don't understand these forums sometimes. hasn't peter already beaten ironfist? why should it be different because this is a battle forum?

When did he do that?

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Spidey. He's faster than Danny, and although both can one-shot the other, spider sense and superior speed means that Soidey should be able to one shot Danny first.

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#324  Edited By BobTheBag

K'un-Lun isn't that big that a nuke is needed to destroy it:

No Caption Provided

And the hellcarrier was hardly damaged:

No Caption Provided

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Adam_Taurus

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#325  Edited By Adam_Taurus

@visemoon said:

@adam_taurus:

2) If you admit that fist didn't loose, and he didn't win, then that also means that Spiderman couldn't beat fist in that fight. AKA, a tie. THATS why it shouldn't be used

You don't want to used it due to the fact that Peter had the advantage of both fights. Danny was incapacitated in the 1st fight and in the 2nd fight Peter was ground pounding. Sorry that you don't like it

LOL, do you have scans of the actual battle to back this up?

First fight: Danny stopped because spidey wasn't a foe. He could've broken out easily as he demonstrated, but he didn't because Danny isn't a villain.

Second fight: Iron fist knocked Spidey into a building with a very diluted iron fist. Spidey wasn't ground pounding if it was two light hits.

Both fights were never finished.

3) Yep, and Iron fist holds back MUCH more. I made that very clear through the helicarrier scan. Also, use proper grammar for pete's sake.

Oooo, Danny hit a large, slow moving object that doesn't hit back. Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense.

Lets see...

Skaar was visibly hurt by the iron fist

No Caption Provided

Even before his insane upgrade, he was still capable of one shoting nightcrawler (who literally has the ability to teleport) and Colossus, who is easily 100+ tonner

No Caption Provided

Taking down a kinetic energy eating monster by taking out it's Achilles Tendon. (click that)

Any of those perhaps?

Iron fist could've broken out of the webbing immediately. He didn't do it right away because Spider man wasn't a foe.

And Peter could have caved Danny's head in with one punch....you know..since he got superhuman strength and all

WRONG! Danny's chi would've absorbed the impact or regenerated him. Also, what proof do you have that one punch can cave Fist's head in? Right here is a classic example of a baseless claim to make your argument sound valid.

6) My own inability? Bud, you were the one saying Iron fist tanking Nuke level explosives is "hyperbolic" AFTER I posted the scan proving it.

Lol. No amount of explosives on a train will equal that of a nuke. Not even close...unless the train was carrying a nuke, which it wasn't.

Hyperbole= exaggerated statements or claims not meant to be taken literally.

Exaggerated: represent (something) as being larger, greater, better, or worse than it really is.

Having a scan that clearly says "makes Hiroshima look like a sparkler" isn't exactly a hyperbole bud. Also, you're using TNT as an example. Realize this is the same universe where technologies such as the arc reactor, pym particles, and other insane inventions are present. In the marvel world, anything is possible.

Quoting something I saw earlier, "Sorry that you don't like it".

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#327  Edited By BobTheBag

@adam_taurus said:

@bobthebag: uh, ok?

(what does that mean?)

Train:

The power of the explosives is an hyperbole so the reader understand that the train is full of explosives.

Iron Fist is just shown going through the train like a bullet. We don't see him tanking the explosion and even less absorbing it.

The train explode and we see the full blast being too small to affect the people near but that's probably enough to destroy K'un-Lun regarding it's size.

Hellcarrier:

That means that the damage to the Hellcarrier's structure was too minimal to destroy it so the shockwave of the punch is what made the equipments ruling the Hellcarrier goes wrong.

There is a lof of tech' near the zone of the punch that can be attributed to the Hellcarrier's crash:

  1. Trim engines on each sides. Stopping 2 of them is enough to unbalance the HC and causes him to crash.
  2. Flight operation center
  3. Nuclear reactor
  4. computer center major memory
  5. anti-gravity generator synchronizer

There is more than enough stuff to damage to make the HC sunk without damaging it that much.

On top of that you pretend that the upgrade of Orson's Chi is permanent which is more than unlikely to happen.

Davos absorbed the Chi of countless minions and it only powered him up temporarily.

The logic would be the same for Danny.

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visemoon

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#328  Edited By visemoon

@adam_taurus:

LOL, do you have scans of the actual battle to back this up?

You've already seen the scans, but your bias and denial blinds you. I do find that adorable, though lol

First fight: Danny stopped because spidey wasn't a foe. He could've broken out easily as he demonstrated, but he didn't because Danny isn't a villain.

Just incase you missed this...make sure you read the words and not just look at the pics:

No Caption Provided

Fist was trapped for 2 minutes before he realize he was good a caught. 2 MINUTES!!! and Spidey just sits there and stares at him. I want you to get a stop watch...start it and then stop it at the 2 minute mark. That how long he was trapped like a fish in a net. Peter CLEARLY had the advantage and you not seeing this is quite funny. But please keep on ignoring this:) Oh, and board rules...incapacitation is a win;)

Second fight: Iron fist knocked Spidey into a building with a very diluted iron fist. Spidey wasn't ground pounding if it was two light hits

Keep telling yourself that, because you are the only one that seems to believe it. Fist was lucky the sign started to fall

Both fights were never finished.

Peter had the advantage. This is clearly evident

Lets see...

Skaar was visibly hurt by the iron fist

*Posts scan of Fist punching Skaar*

*cut and paste* "Oooo, Danny hit a large, slow moving object that doesn't hit back. Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense."

Even before his insane upgrade, he was still capable of one shoting nightcrawler (who literally has the ability to teleport) and Colossus, who is easily 100+ tonner

*Posts another out of context scan*

I have and idea...how about you stop googling Iron Fist pics and posting them without knowing the contexts. If you had read the story, Pitor and Night Crawler were NOT one shotted. They were both up still fighting on the very next page. You are really making yourself look bad and not helping Danny's case at all

Taking down a kinetic energy eating monster by taking out it's Achilles Tendon. (click that)

Any of those perhaps?

*Cut and paste* Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense"

But,I think we already know the answer to that, don't we?...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
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Dang....the evidence is overwhelming, isn't it? Just take it all in

WRONG! Danny's chi would've absorbed the impact or regenerated him

Evidence of this? And not your normal out of context scans you are accustom to posting

Also, what proof do you have that one punch can cave Fist's head in? Right here is a classic example of a baseless claim to make your argument sound valid.

Are you kidding me right now? I starting to believe you don't understand how strong Spider-Man is...

No Caption Provided
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When Hercules had Spider Power, This is what he thought about it...

No Caption Provided

Are you familiar the story ARC Shadow Land? This is when Daredevil was possess by a demon and was seriously amped. Here is a fight with Danny and Shang Chi Vs Daredevil

No Caption Provided
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Man, that new absorbing power you gave Fist would have came in handy, Huh? :)

Here they are admitting defeat...

No Caption Provided

Let see how Spidey did by himself...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
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Dang, There's the Spider sense again. Spider by himself did what both Fist and Shang were unable do. Peter brought him down and the other heroes were able to dogpiled him (Momentarily). Peter clearly did better than both Shang and Fist

Oh, and for extra reading this what Shang had to say when he had Spider-Powers

No Caption Provided

Having a scan that clearly says "makes Hiroshima look like a sparkler" isn't exactly a hyperbole bud. Also, you're using TNT as an example. Realize this is the same universe where technologies such as the arc reactor, pym particles, and other insane inventions are present. In the marvel world, anything is possible.

Quoting something I saw earlier, "Sorry that you don't like it".

*cut and paste* "Keep telling yourself that, because you are the only one that seems to believe it." Everyone else has the common sense to know what hyperbole is. But keep on trying lol

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#329  Edited By BobTheBag

@visemoon: Good job.

If I remember correctly, Spidey was only a 10 tonner at times when he kicked Arno Stark's ass.

Now Peter is a 25 tonner and he learned Kung-Fu.

I think that Peter would win over Danny 9,5 times out of 10.

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@visemoon: Good job.

If I remember correctly, Spidey was only a 10 tonner at times when he kicked Arno Stark's ass.

Now Peter is a 25 tonner and he learned Kung-Fu.

I think that Peter would win over Danny 9,5 times out of 10.

One issue with your thought process on this, the OP lists a specific version of Spidey, which is Back in Black, and was prior to his learning Spider-Fu. When making a consideration on this battle, you need to look at Spidey from that era, not as he currently stands.

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Wyldsong

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I do have to say, hate reading the downplaying of each of these great characters from both sides...

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@wyldsong said:
@bobthebag said:

@visemoon: Good job.

If I remember correctly, Spidey was only a 10 tonner at times when he kicked Arno Stark's ass.

Now Peter is a 25 tonner and he learned Kung-Fu.

I think that Peter would win over Danny 9,5 times out of 10.

One issue with your thought process on this, the OP lists a specific version of Spidey, which is Back in Black, and was prior to his learning Spider-Fu. When making a consideration on this battle, you need to look at Spidey from that era, not as he currently stands.

Yep

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GODKINGTHOR

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spiderman because of his durability

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#334  Edited By Wyldsong

Just some quick thoughts as someone who knows each character very darn well. Current Spidey, all things considered, operating at his best, would take a majority against the current Danny, although he is going to work for it. You have to consider current Danny has the combat speed to keep up, and he has AoE potential, plus in this setup, he wouldn't be holding back. Remember, current Danny has had a fairly big jump in power since his olden days (and so has Pete). Back in Black Spidey versus current Danny, in this setup, could go either way, each has the potential to one shot the other. Back in Black Spidey versus Danny as he was 6 years ago when this thread was made, Pete takes the slight majority there.

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christianrapper

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#336  Edited By christianrapper

back in black spidey is far above danny. he is basically kaine with a spider sense. back in black spidey would destroy danny. danny has lost to the regular spiderman.

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Wyldsong

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#337  Edited By Wyldsong

@christianrapper said:

back in black spidey is far above danny. he is basically kaine with a spider sense. back in black spidey would destroy danny. danny has lost to the regular spiderman.

Not sure why you removed me from your quote, since I can still see I was tagged...but, there is one thing I was mistaken on. I did forget about the Other amp that was going on in Back in Black. Danny 6 years ago versus Back in Black Spidey, I'd give Pete a heavy majority with that in play. Versus current Danny...each have feats where they have outreacted a bullet before it could leave the barrel of a gun...Pete for the majority still with a bit of difficulty dependent upon AoEs and the like.

As for losing to regular Spider-Man...they have each had up and down showings over the years, but older losses and wins do not hold any real water when each have been upgraded in various ways over the years. Characters change and improve over time, so you can't really hold older showings over their heads, not unless either side hasn't improved...which both sides have. You have to take into account how each side has improved to decide how they would fare...you can't be stuck in the past with older showings.

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I think the only reason Pete wins this is Spider-sense, and lose morals.

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@visemoon said:

@adam_taurus:

LOL, do you have scans of the actual battle to back this up?

You've already seen the scans, but your bias and denial blinds you. I do find that adorable, though lol

Nice. So where are the scans of that fight where Iron fist said he couldn't beat spidey? Thats what I was asking for.

First fight: Danny stopped because spidey wasn't a foe. He could've broken out easily as he demonstrated, but he didn't because Danny isn't a villain.

Just incase you missed this...make sure you read the words and not just look at the pics:

No Caption Provided

Fist was trapped for 2 minutes before he realize he was good a caught. 2 MINUTES!!! and Spidey just sits there and stares at him. I want you to get a stop watch...start it and then stop it at the 2 minute mark. That how long he was trapped like a fish in a net. Peter CLEARLY had the advantage and you not seeing this is quite funny. But please keep on ignoring this:) Oh, and board rules...incapacitation is a win;)

Hmm, yep he was. BUT, you forgot to mention a few things:

1) Spidey didn't do anything while iron fist was webbed. You can't even call that a fight because Iron fist realized spidey didn't want to fight, and being the good person he was, stopped fighting as well. Thats why he didn't break out. READ.

2) I wouldn't call that "incapacitation". Especially when this happened:

No Caption Provided

Hmm, whoa! Are those spider's webs? They ARE!! And... Iron fist broke out EFFORTLESSLY? he DID!!!

Nice try bud :)

Second fight: Iron fist knocked Spidey into a building with a very diluted iron fist. Spidey wasn't ground pounding if it was two light hits

Keep telling yourself that, because you are the only one that seems to believe it. Fist was lucky the sign started to fall

Of of coarse. He was "lucky". Am I supposed to believe the oldest excuse in the book? Lets look at Iron Fist's attack shall we?

No Caption Provided

Sure, there was the trap, but peter is supposed to have his magical "spider sense", right? In that case, why didn't he just dodge the attack? Also, if you look at the thought bubble in that last square, it clearly shows that Iron Fist's power wasn't even remotely close to it's full potential.

Both fights were never finished.

Peter had the advantage. This is clearly evident

AHAHAHAH, no.

fight 1) They were on even ground. TBH it wasn't a fight as much as it was a misunderstanding. Danny didn't use chi except when he broke out of the webs, and Pete didn't use the full range of his abilities.

fight 2) Iron fist landed MUCH harder blows on pete. Don't try to make up an excuse as to why. That one goes to fist.

Lets see...

Skaar was visibly hurt by the iron fist

*Posts scan of Fist punching Skaar*

*cut and paste* "Oooo, Danny hit a large, slow moving object that doesn't hit back. Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense."

Skaar? Lets see...

Superhuman strength? Well, he's a hulk, so check.

Superhuman speed? Again, he's a hulk. Check.

Agility? Not so sure about that (hulks aren't the most agile), but there's another scan with fist hitting someone more agile than a hulk. Nevertheless, Hulks have insane speed and durability, which compensates perfectly. Check

Ability to think on the fly? Skaar can fight well, so he can. Check

Pre cog sense? no, not really. Still, 4/5? That's valid stuff.

Even before his insane upgrade, he was still capable of one shoting nightcrawler (who literally has the ability to teleport) and Colossus, who is easily 100+ tonner

*Posts another out of context scan*

I have and idea...how about you stop googling Iron Fist pics and posting them without knowing the contexts. If you had read the story, Pitor and Night Crawler were NOT one shotted. They were both up still fighting on the very next page. You are really making yourself look bad and not helping Danny's case at all

So then, if Night Crawler and Wolverine weren't beat, then why did Colossus explicitly state,

No Caption Provided

"You have BEATEN my comrades"?

Then he got hammered into a wall.

Fun fact: I actually read the comics. Iron Fist did end up in colossus's grip, but that was because Storm used her winds. I can post scans if you'd like.

Maybe you should take your own advice and read, eh? :D

Taking down a kinetic energy eating monster by taking out it's Achilles Tendon. (click that)

Any of those perhaps?

*Cut and paste* Let me know when he hits someone or something that has superhuman speed, strength, agility, the ability to think on the fly and has a pre cog sense"

But,I think we already know the answer to that, don't we?...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Dang....the evidence is overwhelming, isn't it? Just take it all in

What evidence? All you did was post something you've posted many times before! Also, we're talking about current immortal iron fist. As in the one with his upgrade, and the power of another iron fist. He got powers like what he wished in those upgrades.

WRONG! Danny's chi would've absorbed the impact or regenerated him

Evidence of this? And not your normal out of context scans you are accustom to posting

Ill finish posting tomorrow. I'm tired. Expect a part 2 in 24 hours.

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#340  Edited By visemoon

@adam_taurus:

Nice. So where are the scans of that fight where Iron fist said he couldn't beat spidey? Thats what I was asking for.

If you can't keep up in a debate than you really should stop right now. You asked:

"2) If you admit that fist didn't loose, and he didn't win, then that also means that Spiderman couldn't beat fist in that fight. AKA, a tie. THATS why it shouldn't be used"

My response:

"You don't want to used it due to the fact that Peter had the advantage of both fights. Danny was incapacitated in the 1st fight and in the 2nd fight Peter was ground pounding. Sorry that you don't like it"

Your response:

"LOL, do you have scans of the actual battle to back this up?"

My Response:

"You've already seen the scans, but your bias and denial blinds you. I do find that adorable, though lol"

But hey, if you wish to go backward instead of forward, I'm fine with that...I really love repeating myself (or int this case repeating what someone already told you":

*cut and paste* @jashro44 said:

The question that was asked by Vic was which super hero did iron fist fight and couldn't defeat:

No Caption Provided

Danny than responded talking about spider-man:

No Caption Provided

If was able to beat spider-man in there fights why would he tell Vic this? You could argue Danny said he wasn't able to beat spider-man in the past and never said he couldn't beat spider-man however. I think that would be fair. *end cut and paste*

Hmm, yep he was. BUT, you forgot to mention a few things:

1) Spidey didn't do anything while iron fist was webbed. You can't even call that a fight because Iron fist realized spidey didn't want to fight, and being the good person he was, stopped fighting as well. Thats why he didn't break out. READ.

LMAO...You're really not good at this. And the irony of what you wrote makes it even sweeter.

2) I wouldn't call that "incapacitation". Especially when this happened:

No Caption Provided

Hmm, whoa! Are those spider's webs? They ARE!! And... Iron fist broke out EFFORTLESSLY? he DID!!!

Nice try bud :)

Oh my...I do love your responses. I have nice chuckle every time I read them. He broke out of them 2 MINUTES LATER.2 minutes of being stuck in webbing while Spidey sits there staring at him. Yeah, eventually he did get out of it just like and opponent that is knocked out eventually regain consciousness. But hey according to your logic, If a person is knocked unconscious, they're really not unconscious because they wake up later.

Of of coarse. He was "lucky". Am I supposed to believe the oldest excuse in the book? Lets look at Iron Fist's attack shall we?

No Caption Provided

Sure, there was the trap, but peter is supposed to have his magical "spider sense", right? In that case, why didn't he just dodge the attack? Also, if you look at the thought bubble in that last square, it clearly shows that Iron Fist's power wasn't even remotely close to it's full potential.

*Cut and paste* @jashro44 said: The only reason he did from Peter's spider-sense is because it was busy warning him about the trap" "Danny landed his hits through cheap shots and by exploiting traps. He wouldn't have landed those hits otherwise."

AHAHAHAH, no.

fight 1) They were on even ground. TBH it wasn't a fight as much as it was a misunderstanding. Danny didn't use chi except when he broke out of the webs, and Pete didn't use the full range of his abilities.

fight 2) Iron fist landed MUCH harder blows on pete. Don't try to make up an excuse as to why. That one goes to fist.

*Cut and paste*Peter had the advantage. This is clearly evident" You are the only one arguing otherwise

Skaar? Lets see...

Superhuman strength? Well, he's a hulk, so check.

Superhuman speed? Again, he's a hulk. Check.

Skaar is NOT Hulk, nor does have speed feats to suggest he even close to his daddy. The answer is no

Agility? Not so sure about that (hulks aren't the most agile), but there's another scan with fist hitting someone more agile than a hulk. Nevertheless, Hulks have insane speed and durability, which compensates perfectly. Check

Agility...*cut and paste*"The answer is no"

Ability to think on the fly? Skaar can fight well, so he can. Check

LOL..*cut and paste*"The answer is no"

Still, 4/5? That's valid stuff

LMAO...your math is terrible.*cut and paste*"The answer is no"

So then, if Night Crawler and Wolverine weren't beat, then why did Colossus explicitly state,

*Post out of context scan again*

"You have BEATEN my comrades"?

Then he got hammered into a wall.

Fun fact: I actually read the comics. Iron Fist did end up in colossus's grip, but that was because Storm used her winds. I can post scans if you'd like.

Maybe you should take your own advice and read, eh? :D

No, you said Danny oneshotted both Kirk and Pitor. They both were still conscious and fighting on the very next page. He didn't oneshot anyone. So you either lied and hoped someone didn't call you out on it or you post the scan without knowing the full context

What evidence? All you did was post something you've posted many times before! Also, we're talking about current immortal iron fist. As in the one with his upgrade, and the power of another iron fist. He got powers like what he wished in those upgrades.

The evidence that you constantly choose to ignore and deny. It's apparent to everybody that you are extremely bias. And current Iron Fist means the current Iron Fist of the time this thread was create (6 years ago)

But just out of curiosity, what does current Fist (right now) have that can compete with (or overcome) Peter's spider sense?

Ill finish posting tomorrow. I'm tired. Expect a part 2 in 24 hours.

Well, if it's anything like you what have been posting lately then I'm sure myself and everyone who's been reading this thread will be quite entertained. I look forward to another chuckle

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@visemoon: Good job.

If I remember correctly, Spidey was only a 10 tonner at times when he kicked Arno Stark's ass.

Now Peter is a 25 tonner and he learned Kung-Fu.

I think that Peter would win over Danny 9,5 times out of 10.

Thank you and welcome to the vine

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@visemoon: Thanks :)

I don't get what the guy above is trying to sell but that's not the Iron Fist from the comics.

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@wyldsong said:
@christianrapper said:

back in black spidey is far above danny. he is basically kaine with a spider sense. back in black spidey would destroy danny. danny has lost to the regular spiderman.

Not sure why you removed me from your quote, since I can still see I was tagged...but, there is one thing I was mistaken on. I did forget about the Other amp that was going on in Back in Black. Danny 6 years ago versus Back in Black Spidey, I'd give Pete a heavy majority with that in play. Versus current Danny...each have feats where they have outreacted a bullet before it could leave the barrel of a gun...Pete for the majority still with a bit of difficulty dependent upon AoEs and the like.

As for losing to regular Spider-Man...they have each had up and down showings over the years, but older losses and wins do not hold any real water when each have been upgraded in various ways over the years. Characters change and improve over time, so you can't really hold older showings over their heads, not unless either side hasn't improved...which both sides have. You have to take into account how each side has improved to decide how they would fare...you can't be stuck in the past with older showings.

both have improved. spidey is still written above danny. spiderman has learned nijutsu and way of the spider. he also has armor. spiderman still out stats danny by a lot.

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Wyldsong

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#344  Edited By Wyldsong

@christianrapper said:
@wyldsong said:
@christianrapper said:

back in black spidey is far above danny. he is basically kaine with a spider sense. back in black spidey would destroy danny. danny has lost to the regular spiderman.

Not sure why you removed me from your quote, since I can still see I was tagged...but, there is one thing I was mistaken on. I did forget about the Other amp that was going on in Back in Black. Danny 6 years ago versus Back in Black Spidey, I'd give Pete a heavy majority with that in play. Versus current Danny...each have feats where they have outreacted a bullet before it could leave the barrel of a gun...Pete for the majority still with a bit of difficulty dependent upon AoEs and the like.

As for losing to regular Spider-Man...they have each had up and down showings over the years, but older losses and wins do not hold any real water when each have been upgraded in various ways over the years. Characters change and improve over time, so you can't really hold older showings over their heads, not unless either side hasn't improved...which both sides have. You have to take into account how each side has improved to decide how they would fare...you can't be stuck in the past with older showings.

both have improved. spidey is still written above danny. spiderman has learned nijutsu and way of the spider. he also has armor. spiderman still out stats danny by a lot.

These aren't points I entirely disagree with, but the consideration we have to make here is that there is a specified version for Pete, not so much for Danny. Back in Black Pete didn't have the martial arts knowledge, nor his more recent tech upgrades. If we considered Pete with the Other amp, martial arts, his recent tech upgrades, and the slightly morals off of the Back in Black storyline...that would be a sick combination. As for outstating Danny...eh, depends on the era, though Pete will have the better durability and strength. What matters with Danny is combat speed (which is not outside of Pete's range), his insane striking force, and overall versatility with his chi (chi healing, AoE attacks, and so on). We aren't entirely in disagreement, but I think our ideas of degrees of separation between the characters is a bit different.

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Adam_Taurus

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The long awaited part two. Work and school got in the way, as well as some personal affairs.

@visemoon said:

WRONG! Danny's chi would've absorbed the impact or regenerated him

Evidence of this? And not your normal out of context scans you are accustom to posting

This has to be a joke... My first scan on this thread was demonstrating the absorbing capability of chi.

Here is Iron fist absorbing the kinetic energy of a speeding electromagnetic train carrying enough explosives to make "hiroshima look like a sparkler". Whether that statement is a hyperbole or not is irrelevant. Just the head of a maglev train rushing at you at even half their max speed generates well over 100 tones of force, and i'm not even considering the power of the explosives OR the mass of the passenger cars.

Destroying a train with enough raw explosives to, "make Hiroshima look like a sparkler". He also absorbs some of the kinetic energy of the blast. (click that)

Here is iron fist using chi to absorb enough radiation that would normally kill a human. Keep in mind: this was BEFORE his insane upgrade.

No Caption Provided

Here is Danny using chi to absorb energy from Nitro. In the process, Iron Fist gets KO'd, but nitro's hand is vaporized in the process. Keep in mind, Nitro wasn't holding anything back.

No Caption Provided

No Caption Provided

Also, Notro has vaporized wolverine with the exception of his skeleton. That should give you an idea of how strong he is.

Here is Danny absorbing Olson Randal's chi, which amped him up by a lot. Keep in mind, there was also the iron fist book.

No Caption Provided

As far as regeneration, here ya go:

No Caption Provided

Just to name a few. Make sure you don't just automatically assume everything I say is either a lie or out of context. K? :)

Also, what proof do you have that one punch can cave Fist's head in? Right here is a classic example of a baseless claim to make your argument sound valid.

Are you kidding me right now? I starting to believe you don't understand how strong Spider-Man is...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Never said Spider Man was weak. I just said that Spidey can't cave Iron Fist's head in with one blow, like you claimed here:

If Danny can tank a Maglev train moving at near max to max speeds while also carrying lots of explosives, and can tank hits from a pissed off Nitro, then how in the hell can Spidey, who is a 10-15 tonner, cave Iron Fist's head in with one punch? ESPECIALLY if Danny isn't holding back?

Also, Iron man wasn't trying to fight spidey. He was trying to talk to spidey. Nice try though, A for effort at least! :D

Might as well give a few of Danny's strength feats. Here is Danny one shooting a huge mech with his chi.

No Caption Provided

When Hercules had Spider Power, This is what he thought about it...

No Caption Provided

Hmm, do you realize how strong and skilled Hercules already is as the son of Zeus? His blows are comparable to Thor's and he has fought WWH when the Hulk went nuts. Giving Herc the spider sense is like giving Superman the 100 million (or 1 million whatever) prime power. It's un necessary. Give herc chi and he'll say the same thing.

Also, since we're at the topic of herc, I might as well show you this:

No Caption Provided

Has Spidey ever KO'd Hercules before, much less one shot him? I don't think so! You know who has? Iron fist! :)

Are you familiar the story ARC Shadow Land? This is when Daredevil was possess by a demon and was seriously amped. Here is a fight with Danny and Shang Chi Vs Daredevil

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Man, that new absorbing power you gave Fist would have came in handy, Huh? :)

It really would've. Unfortunately for your case, Iron fist and Shang wasn't actually trying to fight Daredevil because they didn't want to. Shang even explicitly said so.

Here they are admitting defeat...

No Caption Provided

Yes. They ALL admitted defeat, Spider man included. See him saying "ow"?

Let see how Spidey did by himself...

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Dang, There's the Spider sense again. Spider by himself did what both Fist and Shang were unable do. Peter brought him down and the other heroes were able to dogpiled him (Momentarily). Peter clearly did better than both Shang and Fist

LMAO, that whole thing was one big contradiction.

You said "Lets see how Spidey did by himself".

The you said "the other heroes were able to dogpiled him".

You make it sound like Spidey fought Matt to a 1v1 here. That's not true. I don't thing Shang, Danny, Luke, and Elektra count as Spider man.

Also, Pete just webbed up Matt and tackled him so that him and the other 4 could hold him down.

By the way, that's a nice shot of Spidey getting lassoed in the ankle and kneed in the face.

Next time, please try not to contradict yourself. It makes you sound even more ridiculous than you already are. K? :)

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Adam_Taurus

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@wyldsong: wait a sec, what amp are you referring to?

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visemoon

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#347  Edited By visemoon

@adam_taurus:

This has to be a joke... My first scan on this thread was demonstrating the absorbing capability of chi.

You did?!...have yet to see it

Here is Iron fist absorbing the kinetic energy of a speeding electromagnetic train carrying enough explosives to make "hiroshima look like a sparkler". Whether that statement is a hyperbole or not is irrelevant. Just the head of a maglev train rushing at you at even half their max speed generates well over 100 tones of force, and i'm not even considering the power of the explosives OR the mass of the passenger cars.

Destroying a train with enough raw explosives to, "make Hiroshima look like a sparkler". He also absorbs some of the kinetic energy of the blast. (click that)

No...Fist allowed his chi to flow into the electro-magnetic field of the train. No where on the comic did is say he absorb anything. You are giving him abilities that he has never displayed. He is NOT Bishop...He is not Strong Guy. So let us stick to things that he has actually shown he could do and NOT your made up version. Your version does not exist

Here is iron fist using chi to absorb enough radiation that would normally kill a human. Keep in mind: this was BEFORE his insane upgrade.

*post scan that DOES NOT say Danny use Chi to absorb*

That's nice...now where in that scan does it says he use Chi to absorb radiation? in fact what does radiation have anything to do with absorbing someone physical attack? You are purposely trying to avoid debate and steer it in another direction. Stay on topic. You said Fist could absorb Spider-Man's attack...

No Caption Provided

That's Ironman's face plate. Once again you said:

"Danny's chi would've absorbed the impact or regenerated him" Either provide evidence to support this or concede that you are making stuff up

Here is Danny using chi to absorb energy from Nitro. In the process, Iron Fist gets KO'd, but nitro's hand is vaporized in the process. Keep in mind, Nitro wasn't holding anything back.

*Post another scan that DOES NOT say Danny use Chi to absorb*

Yeah, see comments above

Here is Danny absorbing Olson Randal's chi, which amped him up by a lot. Keep in mind, there was also the iron fist book.

I not trying to insult you in anyway, but you are a terrible debater. WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH absorbing Spider-Man's attacks?

As far as regeneration, here ya go:

So, he healed superficial wounds by meditation?...Oh, I see...If Iron fist is injured his opponents going to allow him to sit on the ground meditated to heal him self? LOL

For other posters that is reading this... Can we get someone else to argue in Danny's behalf? This guy's really not helping Danny's case. Only thing he is good for is a chuckle

Never said Spider Man was weak. I just said that Spidey can't cave Iron Fist's head in with one blow, like you claimed here:

No Caption Provided

Yep

Also, Iron man wasn't trying to fight spidey. He was trying to talk to spidey. Nice try though, A for effort at least! :D

Ironman's durability>>>>Iron Fist durability. Nice try for trying to downplay that.

Hmm, do you realize how strong and skilled Hercules already is as the son of Zeus? His blows are comparable to Thor's and he has fought WWH when the Hulk went nuts. Giving Herc the spider sense is like giving Superman the 100 million (or 1 million whatever) prime power. It's un necessary. Give herc chi and he'll say the same thing.

During that time, Herc lost is god status. He was normal, meaning No strength, durability or immortality. When Herc was infected with Spider powers (strength, speed, agility and spider sense), he felt that would put him back in god status

Also, since we're at the topic of herc, I might as well show you this:

*post another out of context scan*

Has Spidey ever KO'd Hercules before, much less one shot him? I don't think so! You know who has? Iron fist! :)

LMAO, another out of context scan?! My goodness, posting a scan of Danny Knocking out and inebriated Hercules?! Thank you for the chuckle. We see context means nothing to you

It really would've. Unfortunately for your case, Iron fist and Shang wasn't actually trying to fight Daredevil because they didn't want to. Shang even explicitly said so.

I love your stubbornness. It really does make me happy. Please keep telling yourself that

Yes. They ALL admitted defeat, Spider man included. See him saying "ow"?

I knew you were going to say that. You're really are predictable. I see you haven't read the story. Peter saying "ow" wasn't from his fight with Demon Devil. But Shang Chi and Danny admitted Matt whooped that bottom

LMAO, that whole thing was one big contradiction.

You said "Lets see how Spidey did by himself".

The you said "the other heroes were able to dogpiled him".

You make it sound like Spidey fought Matt to a 1v1 here. That's not true. I don't thing Shang, Danny, Luke, and Elektra count as Spider man.

Also, Pete just webbed up Matt and tackled him so that him and the other 4 could hold him down.

By the way, that's a nice shot of Spidey getting lassoed in the ankle and kneed in the face.

Bottom line: *cut and paste*Spider by himself did what both Fist and Shang were unable do. Peter brought him down and the other heroes were able to dogpiled him (Momentarily). Peter clearly did better than both Shang and Fist. *end cut and paste*

What did Danny and Shang do? They admitted defeat. And you know what's funny? Danny was really shocked and impressed what Demon Devil did(Jumped in the air and smash the ground). Peter has down the same exact thing before

Next time, please try not to contradict yourself. It makes you sound even more ridiculous than you already are. K? :)

This coming from the guy who constantly post out of context scans and giving Danny abilities he has never displayed before?!? LOL, yeah ok.

Please don't take to long in your next response. Your posts are cringe worthy gold that I look forward to reading

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Spidey wins due to stats, webs and Spider-sense (precog).

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BobTheBag

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@adam_taurus: Maybe you would like to challenge me in a CAV ? Iron Fist Vs another martial artist. :)

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Adam_Taurus

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@visemoon: ok, this is not my rebuttal to your latest post. I only need a few things answered clearly to get some things straight. Please, try to lay off the sarcasm in this one response. Just a simple yes or no answer will do unless I said to say more.

1) The scans where Shang and Danny fought Matt that you posted are from the 2010 Arc shadowlands, right? The ones from September-December 2010?

2) The scan I posted where Fist KO'd a drunken Hercules: was that or was that not when Hercules lost his god powers? Please provide some evidence to your response here (such as the volume maybe, you seem to know your comics)

3) What do you consider as a superficial wound? Again, no sarcasm please. Just a simple answer will do.

4) Whose level would you say Rhino is on? I say below colossus and thing, but I want your input.

5) Whose level would you say Scorpion is on?

6) If someone lost a fight the first time around because they didn't know what they were up against, would you say that the second time around they will do much better or at least last longer? Just a simple yes or no answer.

Again, this is in no way, shape, or form a rebuttal. I just need to get some things straight. Any insults or sarcasm posted on this will show that you are immature.