Disagreed on Round 2...Round 1 definitely Batman, but Deathstroke has already demonstrated that he's on par or even greater than Batman w/ prep and he has beaten regular Batman in H2H. Batman R1, Deathstroke R2
Disagreed on Round 2...Round 1 definitely Batman, but Deathstroke has already demonstrated that he's on par or even greater than Batman w/ prep and he has beaten regular Batman in H2H. Batman R1, Deathstroke R2
I don't see how deathstroke has demonstrated he is better than batman at prep, but he is still one of the best, not denying that. Batman is just a genius, plus his paranoid personality helps.
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
Thanks for clearing that up, and i agree batman would lose in h2h which is why i gave him the suit. In my opinion, in a battle other than pure hand to hand fighting, i think batman would win due to gadgets/resources and vast knowledge.
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
I feel like I should point out that Deathstroke never took out the JLA. If I recall correctly, he jabbed Zatanna in the gut and punched a few people, but was brought down in a group tackle.
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
I feel like I should point out that Deathstroke never took out the JLA. If I recall correctly, he jabbed Zatanna in the gut and punched a few people, but was brought down in a group tackle.
That was probably Deathstroke's best feat and it was still used to highlight that when there powers go out the window the JL will still fight tooth and nail. Overall Batman has much more to bring to the table when prep is involved, Jay is missing the point of this thread of course Deathstroke is better at Batman in a random encounter he is a well trained superhuman but as highlighted by the Insider Suit Batman has much better toys.
He prepped to take out there powers, cut up Green Arrows arrows but was taken out by the people themselves.
@Equonox: Batman actually beat Slade in once instance, it was a fight with multiple rounds. In their first fight, Slade barely bested Bruce. After that fight, Slade had to bandage his wounds from the battle and said that he would feel pain for days despite his healing factor. He also stated that Batman hits harder than most beings with superhuman strength. Finally, he said that if it had not been for his enhanced physicals, Batman would have won the fight.
After the fight, Deathsroke lost a fight to a man with little special training, because of his wounds. This would have probably been an easy fight for Slade if Batman had not severely wounded him before this.
Batman and Slade have been shown to be very close to each other in all fields, Batman probably edging in prepping, and Slade edging him in a straight up fight. With the insider suit however, DS is not match for Batman.
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
I feel like I should point out that Deathstroke never took out the JLA. If I recall correctly, he jabbed Zatanna in the gut and punched a few people, but was brought down in a group tackle.
That was probably Deathstroke's best feat and it was still used to highlight that when there powers go out the window the JL will still fight tooth and nail. Overall Batman has much more to bring to the table when prep is involved, Jay is missing the point of this thread of course Deathstroke is better at Batman in a random encounter he is a well trained superhuman but as highlighted by the Insider Suit Batman has much better toys.
He prepped to take out there powers, cut up Green Arrows arrows but was taken out by the people themselves.
Brilliant moment.
How am i missing the point of this thread? lol :) but i agree with your points, that batman has a wider variety of mental and technological attributes to bring to the fight
@jay_z94: I said on par or greater than, which I said in order to account for the inherently arbitrary nature of sizing up comic book characters against each other. Deathstroke was able to take down an entire JLA roster, so has Batman. I've heard some people claim Bats' prep is better, some say Deathstroke's is better, all citing similar examples. I do my best not to take a firm stance in such close debates/situations, because doing so is stupid, given how arbitrary much of it is. My point was simply that it is not a given that Batman is the better prep master, and that in H2H I'm pretty sure DS has won every 1 on 1 matchup between these two, thus in that regard I am willing to take a firm stance. That's all.
I feel like I should point out that Deathstroke never took out the JLA. If I recall correctly, he jabbed Zatanna in the gut and punched a few people, but was brought down in a group tackle.
That was probably Deathstroke's best feat and it was still used to highlight that when there powers go out the window the JL will still fight tooth and nail. Overall Batman has much more to bring to the table when prep is involved, Jay is missing the point of this thread of course Deathstroke is better at Batman in a random encounter he is a well trained superhuman but as highlighted by the Insider Suit Batman has much better toys.
He prepped to take out there powers, cut up Green Arrows arrows but was taken out by the people themselves.
Brilliant moment.
Morpheus said that Deathstroke didn't have any power when he encountered the JLA in the scan above.
It's nice to see someone put Batman with the Insider suit being put up against someone other than Iron Man. Nicer still that it's actually a fair match. The Inisder Suit puts Batman on the level with High-end Street Levellers...Deathstroke is High-end Street Level.
Deathstroke has beaten Batman every single time he met 1v1. The only time batman won a match vs deathstroke is with the help of nightwing and robin. I agree that he could win with the suit for Round one, but round two, Batman has lost to Deathstroke multiple times, it is a far leap to say that Batman is going win. So round one Batman, it is a hugely unfair match up. It is like saying Batman vs green latnern no prep, then batman vs green lantern with no ring. You keep the same Deathstroke for both fights, the second matchup, Deathstroke has defeated Batman EVERY single 1v1 matchup they have done. Both have amazing prep feats so one cannot be argued to be better. So it comes down to those two factors. Better H2H, and better prep artist. They have almost equal prep achievements and Deathstroke is the better H2H fighter. So Deathstroke takes round two, but not easily. Batman quite easily takes round 1 because of the unfair match up.
Deathstroke has beaten Batman every single time he met 1v1. The only time batman won a match vs deathstroke is with the help of nightwing and robin. I agree that he could win with the suit for Round one, but round two, Batman has lost to Deathstroke multiple times, it is a far leap to say that Batman is going win. So round one Batman, round two Deathstroke. If Deathstroke is going to verse the insiders suit, you should give him some prep, i don't think batman uses the suit unless he has prep which would give him a reason to use it. It is kinda an unfair match with the insider suit, because you gave Deathstroke nothing, then you kept the same Deathstroke and put Batman to normal Batman. Seems you wanted Bats to win one.
I only gave bats the insider suit in a random encounter to even it out, since DS would beat batman h2h in a random encounter. Secondly, yes batman has been defeated by DS in RANDOM encounters (Batman beats him by sneaking up on him). Round two is a prep match, those defeats aren't proof of deathstroke being able to beat batman when both have prep time.
@jay_z94: I edited my statement before I read your reply. The insider suit is beyond street level, it would defeat Deathstroke with relative ease. Now to reply to your prep statement, Batman is a prepping God, but Deathstroke is as well, they both have insane prepping feats so one cannot be argued to be better. Batman is an amazing detective, while deathstroke is an amazing killer, that is how their prepping is different. Deathstroke is better H2H and is on par with Batman in prepping skills. He is also super humanly enhanced. So round one Batman fairly easily, round 2 Deathstroke rather exhaustively.
@jay_z94: I edited my statement before I read your reply. The insider suit is beyond street level, it would defeat Deathstroke with relative ease. Now to reply to your prep statement, Batman is a prepping God, but Deathstroke is as well, they both have insane prepping feats so one cannot be argued to be better. Batman is an amazing detective, while deathstroke is an amazing killer, that is how their prepping is different. Deathstroke is better H2H and is on par with Batman in prepping skills. He is also super humanly enhanced. So round one Batman fairly easily, round 2 Deathstroke rather exhaustively.
Deathstroke is only better at h2h due to him being physically enchanced, batman is no doubt more skilled. But i agree that they are both similarly amazing at prep, so round 2 is quite hard to decide. However, bruce does have more knowledge on science/inventions and has more resources, which could maybe tip it in his favor...
@jay_z94: I edited my statement before I read your reply. The insider suit is beyond street level, it would defeat Deathstroke with relative ease. Now to reply to your prep statement, Batman is a prepping God, but Deathstroke is as well, they both have insane prepping feats so one cannot be argued to be better. Batman is an amazing detective, while deathstroke is an amazing killer, that is how their prepping is different. Deathstroke is better H2H and is on par with Batman in prepping skills. He is also super humanly enhanced. So round one Batman fairly easily, round 2 Deathstroke rather exhaustively.
Deathstroke is only better at h2h due to him being physically enchanced, batman is no doubt more skilled. But i agree that they are both similarly amazing at prep, so round 2 is quite hard to decide. However, bruce does have more knowledge on science/inventions and has more resources, which could maybe tip it in his favor...
Batman has been beaten by him, to say he is more skilled even though he lost is wrong info, Deathstroke said he wouldn't want to fight him without his enhancements, but that in no way says anything about who is better. As far as hand to hand, deathstroke has defeated Batman, Nightwing, and a bunch of other amazing fighters. Enhanced or not he is an amazing fighter non the less. To say he isn't as good without his enhancements skill wise is wishful thinking. Have you seen Deathstroke with prep? He is in no way at the mercy of Batman with prep, batman is an amazing prepper but so it Deathstroke. It comes down to who is better overall, and Batman can't keep up in a fight.
People are, as usual, ridiculously overrating the Insider Suit(for round 1), but while it does give Batman a better chance, it's not enough to give him the win against Slade.
The Insider Suit puts Batman at, maybe, high-end Street Level, but no more than that.
People are, as usual, ridiculously overrating the Insider Suit(for round 1), but while it does give Batman a better chance, it's not enough to give him the win against Slade.
The Insider Suit puts Batman at, maybe, high-end Street Level, but no more than that.
So gl ring, heat vision, flight, invisibility and access to speed force puts him on high-end street level?
The Insider Suit doesn't give him "GL ring", nor is there any indication that it gives him "access to Speed Force".
It has "Will Power Mode", and I quote: "Inspired by the Green Lantern rings, the suit possesses a finger-mounted energy weapon that mimics an Oan power ring's ability to fire a concentrated blast of energy at an opponent."
I'm not really seeing anything close to a "GL ring" here. Just a glorified energy blaster. Similar to his Heat Vision mode, only out of his finger, instead of his eyes.
As for "access to Speed Force". And I quote again: " Inspired by the Flash, the suit gives the wearer limited access to the Speed Force, accelerating their movements beyond human speed."
So much for "access to Speed Force". In essence, it allows him to move at enhanced speed for a short burst.
Yes, for those of us that actually know that capabilities(and limitations) of the Insider Suit, it puts him at high-end Street Level(if that).
People are, as usual, ridiculously overrating the Insider Suit(for round 1), but while it does give Batman a better chance, it's not enough to give him the win against Slade.
The Insider Suit puts Batman at, maybe, high-end Street Level, but no more than that.
Which is all he needs. Batman is more skilled than Deathstroke, and DS only beats him because of his enhancements. Slade has admitted as much. So when you give Batman amped durability, better versatility, and a solid amount of added offensive power, I don't see why Batman can't take Slade. Is it a stomp? No. But Bats suddenly gets access to invisibility, speed bursts, and energy blasts, in addition to the skill that lets him give Slade tough fights.
@Esquire: I never said that Deathstroke wins easily. But from what I can see, there is nothing in the Insider Suit, that definitively gives Batman the edge needed to win.
Every single time they have fought one on one, Deathstroke has won easily. Batman would require a relatively large boost in order to win, and having the boost of the Insider Suit, simply isn't enough. If he was not restricted to using 1 'power' at a time, then I would agree that it would be enough. But as it is, not so much.
@Esquire: Every single time they have fought one on one, Deathstroke has won easily. Batman would require a relatively large boost in order to win, and having the boost of the Insider Suit, simply isn't enough. If he was not restricted to using 1 'power' at a time, then I would agree that it would be enough. But as it is, not so much.
That's not how I've understood them. Batman has put a beating on Deathstroke such that Slade got beat up by the next character he encountered, even though it was a moderately skilled normal human with his hands tied together. Batman has more than once shown to be able to give Deathstroke a good fight, and he has far better durability than usual, which I think is the biggest advantage. Speed bursts will also be very helpful, invisibility can let Bats get a couple extra hits in, energy attacks add another dimension to Bruce's strategy, especially from a distance, and iirc he can also go intangible. Is the Insider Suit as good as many people make it out to be? Not even close. But I've always seen Batman's fights against Deathstroke to be hard-won by Slade, so the multitude of improvements to Bruce should allow him to at least hold his own.
@Esquire: Every single time they have fought one on one, Deathstroke has won easily. Batman would require a relatively large boost in order to win, and having the boost of the Insider Suit, simply isn't enough. If he was not restricted to using 1 'power' at a time, then I would agree that it would be enough. But as it is, not so much.
That's not how I've understood them. Batman has put a beating on Deathstroke such that Slade got beat up by the next character he encountered, even though it was a moderately skilled normal human with his hands tied together. Batman has more than once shown to be able to give Deathstroke a good fight, and he has far better durability than usual, which I think is the biggest advantage. Speed bursts will also be very helpful, invisibility can let Bats get a couple extra hits in, energy attacks add another dimension to Bruce's strategy, especially from a distance, and iirc he can also go intangible. Is the Insider Suit as good as many people make it out to be? Not even close. But I've always seen Batman's fights against Deathstroke to be hard-won by Slade, so the multitude of improvements to Bruce should allow him to at least hold his own.
The Insider suit could beat Deathstroke, though this is biased for Batman from the start. To go to a really strong Batman aka (insider suit), then to a normal version, while keeping the same Deathstroke is biased. Deathstroke has to be given something in compensation.
@Esquire: I don't suppose you have some scans actually showing Batman giving Deathstroke a challenge, without help?
I know that Batman has given Slade a beating a few times, but IIRC/AFAIK that has always been with assistance(like having the help of both robin and nightwing). So I'm actually curious about your claim.
The Insider suit could beat Deathstroke, though this is biased for Batman from the start. To go to a really strong Batman aka (insider suit), then to a normal version, while keeping the same Deathstroke is biased. Deathstroke has to be given something in compensation.
I don't understand how this is biased towards Batman. We know that Slade defeats Batman in a random encounter, as has been demonstrated several times. Batman needs an amp to give him a chance, so he gets one. If anything, it's biased against Bruce because the amp is then removed, even though we know he needs it to keep up with Slade.
@SirMethos:
I don't have scans of Infinite Crisis, which is when Bruce, Dick, and Tim took Slade down together. I'm not sure if these are all of Batman and Deathstroke's one-on-one fights, but I don't know of any others.
Gallery
Batman goes back and forth with Slade for the first couple of pages, then Slade beats him down, although Batman gets back up and attacks again. Slade wins, but he says that he'll be feeling the blows for days, and he'd hate to fight Batman without his enhancements. That indicates to me that it wasn't an easy fight for Slade.
Gallery
Batman gets the jump on Slade while DS is waiting to shoot someone. Bruce gets some shots in, keeps Slade off-balance, but Deathstroke manages to recover and then beats Batman down. This one is a pretty good showing for Slade, I'd say.
Gallery
Similar to the fight above, Batman messes up Slade's shot, gets some hits in, and then gets beat down.
Gallery
Batman messes up Slade's shot one last time with a batarang, Deathstroke attacks him, and Batman knocks him around before taking him down by smashing him with a gun.
Although Slade wins the first three fights, Batman is able to get in several hits in all three of them. In none of them does Batman get any outside help. Slade admits that Batman is "better than the best" and that he hurt Deathstroke severely after their first fight, and Batman demonstrates that he can beat Wilson in their last fight. I see no reason to say that Deathstroke has "beaten Batman easily" each time they fought.
@Esquire: Giving Batman a suit that can use heat vision and fly and turn invisible vs Deathstroke is a bit biased. He can fly and stay out of range of Deathstroke while landing on buildings to shoot at him or even encase him in his will power ability. It is biased because Deathstroke isn't compensated for anything for the fight.
batman has beaten slade with prep and slade has already mentioned that his speed and strength is the only thing that gave him the edge on bruce he has admitted bruce is more skilled batman wins here.
1. without prep he will surly win due to insider suit
2. round 2 because we have seen many times that always villains attacks first in comics i.e they are the only one with a lot of prep but this time if both of them will be knowing that they are against one other i think batman will take as a strategist.
Batman both rounds. Insider suit wins for reasons stated above
Round 2, with superior resources and having more money because he's a multi billionaire, Batman takes round 2. Most likely, Batman brings an army of Hellbats and Deathstroke can't do anything about that
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