Ghost Rider VS Thor

@scathanapprover:

Thats cool and all and big rider fan myself but

lol at people saying ghost rider

Does Hellfire affect Thor?

@destinyman75

Hellfire doesn't harm Thor when Blaze is in control. Nobody knows what Zarathos can do at 100%. But, I'll still say it won't harm Thor. It might bother or blow him back, but I can't see it actually damaging him.

Thor's Odin endowed power/Mjolnir doesn't harm Ghost Rider or Mephisto with Zarathos behind the wheel. On 3 separate occasions, Mephisto handed Thor his butt on a silver platter and laughed the entire time.

Zarathos killed Mephisto with his bare hands. He outsped a Skyfather level being, broke his chest cavity with melee striking and tore his beating heart out...with his bare hands. No energy or Hellfire needed. No Pennance Stare needed. Again, GR shook Heaven with his battle so hard that other realms felt it and Thor was impressed by "Mighty Gods waging War".

@asgardianbrony

I am not out to get you. I am not out to hide scans or information from you. You are defending Thor, the guy beaten by Mephisto 3 times. I am defending Ghost Rider under 100% Zarathos control, the guy who ripped Mephisto apart.

The only way you win the CaV is if users who are voting don't read anything and don't look at the scans.

@destinyman75 said:

@scathanapprover:

Thats cool and all and big rider fan myself but

@scathanapprover: Just want point out Thor beat mephisto in his realm once and many times beat Hela who stalemated mephisto also. And Odin would stomp Zarthos or mephisto.

Having said that Johnny Blaze is my fav Rider

Mate, there are two continuities for Ghost Rider, you know this right? In his own Comic, the Christian GOD/TOAA is top dog with Heaven, hell and angels existing too. All the Marvel characters exist in that too. In the other, God, Satan and angels and heaven do not exist. Two separate continuities entirely. In one of them, GR cannot be killed by anyone but GOD himself and in his battle causes the pillars of Heaven to shake and the gates of Heaven itself to Fall. Thor and FIVE realms feel the battle. This feat is greater than anything Thor ever did.

Mephisto beats Odin? Mephisto danced with Galactus and kindly asked him to leave. Galactus had to cheat and try to eat his house and BFR him. Mephisto had enough of the game and asked him to go. He sustained no damage.

Mephisto battles Galactus so hard that he makes him Hungry. What does Galactus do? He BFR's Mephisto's entire realm and starts eating the walls.

Mephisto more than willing to keep going and realizes Galactus is boring. Decides to kick him out instead and let him leave because THE BATTLE WON'T BE FUN. This is Mephisto after a prolonged battle with GALACTUS.

Odin Ko'ed, bloody, needed to immediately go sleep and recover after his battle with Big G.

Based on feats, Mephisto won that. But, bias is bias and despite Odin being bloodied to a pulp and requiring immediately Odinsleep, despite Galactus requiring BFR to stop Mephisto and an all out battle, unable to take Silver Surfer and Nova by force from Mephisto and instead requiring Mephisto to willingly give them up, users will still come and proclaim Odin the superior.

That's called housing opinion that is not reflective of the scans.

Mephisto is dead. Melee'ed to death with a punch so strong it went into his chest and GR ripped his heart out. But ya guys, keep telling me that Odin is superior and totally ignoring how bad Mephisto wrecked Thor repeatedly. :P

@scathanapprover: lol

Thor beat mephisto in his own realm Hela has stalemated mephisto thor has beat Hela Odin with a snap of his fingers unbound mephisto power. Mephisto never destroyes galaxies as Odin has and even in. Weakened condition mephisto admits Odin would only gain a moderate amount of Victory. This battle is Zarthos who mephisto toyed with in the past. I don't see GR doing much harm to thor here seeing as his greatest attack has failed already and cureent thor dies have Thor force

Thor never beat Mephisto, not once.

- They have had 3 encounters in marvel history, Mephisto won all of them.

- Hela is not on par with Thor

- She manhandled him, Thor whacked her once with Mjolnir and sent her backward, she got up and owned him like no tomorrow

- Mephisto killing Hela. Hela vastly superior to Thor.

- "Weakeend condition Mephisto admits Odin would only gain a moderate victory."

So you agree. Weak Mephisto is required for Odin to win. By your own words.

- Zarathos is the spirit of vengence, controlling all the Riders. Blaze, Ketch, Alejandra, w/e. Zarathos under full control KILLED MEPHISTO. What do you not understand about this?

Refuted each point. I did the same to Asgardianbrony a bit ago in our CaV.

-Has thor ever shaken all the 9 realms? Nope. GR did.

-Can thor regenerate limbs? Nope. GR can, even his head.

-Is Thor faster? Nope. GR withtout Zarathos helping made a mockery of Thor's speed.

-Is Thor stronger? Nope. GR without Zarathos manhandled Thor so severely, he had to take a seat and reflect on the battle in a fit of depression.

-Can Thor's magic hurt Ghost Rider? Nope. GR actually laughed at Odinforce endowment and considered it feeble, all without Zarathos in control

Refuted. On each case. And I didn't use my opinion once. Not even once. I go 100% based on the scans, I did not embellish, I did not generate my own opinion. All fact. All 100% right off the scan. GR wrecks house on Thor. So based on empircal data and scans, GR is superior to Thor even before Zarathos takes over. In the biased minds of Thor fans, Thor would win.

@scathanapprover: You do realize though that Thor has literally stalemated Mephisto twice in his own realm and Warlock(90's version w/ soul gem) also defeated him? A bloodlusted Mephisto also wouldn't even try to fight Warlock or Thanos on neutral ground in Infinity Crusade. Black Panther also has a win over him with tech. More often than not Mephisto isn't portrayed as being that powerful, even in his own realm. I'll also look up the issue numbers when Thor stalemated him if you really want me to(there is no added context or anything else to him doing so).

Yep, would love the scans. They don't really do anything but contradict the other times Mephisto wrecked him, or the times Mephisto wrecked the other characters that wrecked Thor.

The amount of Thor wrecked outweighs the Thor wrecking others. lol

Sorry, Thor is not on par with the Christian God, nor actual angels and divinity. No matter how much people hold their breath and turn blue saying otherwise, GR fights angels and shakes Heaven while Thor actually stood under it and was in awe of it.

@scathanapprover: yes Thor did beat mephisto And in his own realm used to own the issue used the purity of his soul to cause mephisto to almost cry. Hela Thor also beat Hela when he got angry were she could not touch him and had to retreat. And I said a weakend ODIN not mephisto its when Odin woke up kicked Loki's behind and decided to let mephisto keep Loki's soul for punishment. And Zarthos gr never exibted half of what I've seen so far. And for the record he only temp beat Hela she's not dead she is death

@scathanapprover: I don't see Mephisto doing any wrecking of Thor above that you posted. Also, there was a precedent set for Thor being able to fight on equal terms with Mephisto long before that. What constitutes something being an 'actual angel' and the power level of said angels is also something that I've never seen set in concrete terms in the MU. Regardless, I don't have scans but the two battles I am referring to above happened in Thor 205 and Thor 310. In Thor 205 they have an extended battle and Thor ends up burying him beneath rock. In Thor 310 they fight in hell for mortal souls and Thor beats him back and Mephisto admits its a stalemate between them and so releases the souls he had taken.

To those saying hellfire doesn't work on Thor, you do know that scan is outdated and GR had his powers vastly changed since then right? GR's abilities work based on sin now..Anyone who's capable of sin are capable of being vulnerable to GR's powers. Thor couldn't stop Zarathos in the Uncanny Avengers Annual

Odin vs Mephisto was a non canon issue. Canonically, Mephisto said he was a galaxy wrecker, so did Odin. You are factually incorrect. Stop being selective about your scans, Thor was bested by Hela numerous times. You are only used the much lower count of Thor comparing to Hela with Mjolnir strikes. Without Mjolnir, she owned him severely. Mjolnir is endowed directly by Odin, of course its going to harm Hela, Nothing else Thor did hurt her. Nothing.

Mephisto Slagged mjolnir to molten metal, Mephisto stopped Mjolnir in his tracks, Mephisto laucnhed Mjolnir so fast as Thor he couldn't stop it and was grounded by it, Mephisto took Thors soul and trapped it, Mephisto back hands Thor to the ground.

Again, your argument is the same as Brony's, that GR besting angels and shaking 9 realms with his battle is an inferior feat to Thor. Thor was beaten by Hulk how many times? Are you saying Hulk can strike hard enough to shake Asgard, Midgard, Hell and other realms at the same time, that he can take on divine angels and that he can beat the catholic GOD? Are you guys serious right now?

This is absurd. With scans of all this, none of you want to look at them and read them. Why bother debating if you guys aren't going to read them and look at the scans of Mephisto wrecking house on Thor or Zarathos killing Mephisto? Seems a dead argument now that multiple users are taking the brony approach and making up their own feats that disregard the text.

I go by scans. Not opinion. Scans say something other than your opinion.

Scans > opinion

@scathanapprover: Well, you shouldn't go stating things that are untrue then. You stated above they had only fought 3 times and Mephisto won all 3 times without even knowing about two times where it was a stalemate or it could actually be argued Thor won the first fight. The fact is Thor stalemated him at least once in his own realm(I think the first fight was actually in his realm as well). Nothing I said was opinion either, it was an exact depiction of what happened or was directly stated in the comic(s).

Where are your stalemate scans? Never saw them and was never aware of 2 more encounters beyond what I provided. Even so, you've got 3 fights Mephisto won hard, 2 that Thor thinks he stalemated. Did that come from Mephisto? I'm betting not, since he was having a giggle at GALACTUS in his battle.

But, I'll trust you on it that there are two other battles they had. Stalemates aren't wins. Wins are wins and mephisto has 3 of them.

@scathanapprover: Thor doesn't think he stalemated him. Its portrayed quite plainly in the comics and in the second case Mephisto admits defeat then calls it a stalemate and releases the souls he had taken. Warlock also beat him in his own realm back in the 90's and BP also beat him with some help from a tech device. The fight with Galactus could easily just be seen as an outlier for him given his actual history in comics and how he is portrayed. Even then all he did was remove him from his realm. I also don't see anything in the scans you posted which show a clear win for Mephisto. I mean I have no problem saying he did beat him if its actually shown but that's not what I see in those scans. He took the soul of an incapacitated Thor with some magic bag and after that we see them fight without much of an outcome. You also bring up Hela as being vastly superior to Thor when she is not at all always portrayed that way in the comics. I don't think you have actually read many Thor comics and instead just post scans you have seen. Thor has fought Hela on equal terms multiple times. The one thing she has on him is her touch of death otherwise I would say he is actually more powerful. She also aged him once.

Ok, that's fine. I believe you, I still want to see the scans because I wasn't aware they existed. Toss me a message if you can grab em' for me.

I still need to see Thor shaking 9 realms entirely with his battle, going toe to toe with legitmate angels and where TOAA says that only he can defeat Thor. If nobody can come up with those pieces of proof, you've got no argument and GR takes this battle based on feats and scans with empirical data supporting it. No opinions. I don't care what theories are or what other users think that means. I go by scans and what the text says. :)

@scathanapprover: I wasn't making an argument for Thor beating GR in the first place nor have I stated any opinions. I was addressing Thor's power level relative to Mephisto's. I may get around to making some scans of their battles or maybe someone else will since I posted the issue numbers.

Thor beats Blaze Rider Probably.

Gets rekt by Zarathos

@scathanapprover: to be fair avengers Thor is much weaker then solo Thor about the annual. And Everything I said is true just on a phone can't post but will soon as I can

I believe you mate, I truly do. It is just that posting those scans will conflict with the ones I've already posted. So what do you do with that much inconsistency? This is why I hate debating Thor, he is soo wonky and one of the most difficult to keep consistent feats with, he's all over the place.

I've come to this thread pretty often and I generally think GR would win against Thor. But it won't be a cakewalk.

@scathanapprover: l I know friend I know it is hard with Thor with so many different writers going in so many different directions. Personly I still see Walter Simonson's run as bar non the best. And I never said GR can't win I'm just looking at it as more of a 50/50 depending on the scenario. I am a GR fan too you know lol. Anyways I miss theold run of GR in the 90's when the Zarthos thing all started that was a good story with Lilith also.

Sigh back when marvel had good writers

Good fight but I would give it to Thor, if ghost rider didn't Penance Stare him

Yep, that is how vs debates work. If someone is defending Thor, they will ignore all the times he was bested by Mephisto. Then, they'll justify all that with one scan of Thor stalemating them, that one time a new author came in and said screw Marvel history. Those three times Thor got his butt handed to him? Pfft, here is one time Thor won that fight so that means Thor is better. Of course, once is better than three.

That is the logic of a fanboy, worse yet in the case of Thor who has some of the biggest inconsistencies in Marvel comics. GR ripping Mephisto apart and Mephisto shredding Thor three times? Nope, not good enough. Thor is still better. Ghost Rider laughing at how slow Thor is? Nope, not good enough. Thor is still faster. You'll notice that no scans are ever posted to prove it, it's all 100% fan bias.

You can't beat a extreme fans of a character, and in brony's case, you can't beat someone who nope, Mjolnir was sick that day. That's the one day Mjolnir was tossed slower than ever before.

@scathanapprover: well all I do know is the writer's need to get it together yeah cool go a different direction but keep the core of a character the same.

Jane foster face palm

For anyone who knows:

1) is Zarathos bonded with Ghost Rider again?

2) if not, who is?

3) how powerful is he now?

4) why the hell is Zarathos always brought up if he's not a part of GR anymore?

@sirfizzwhizz said:

@bones309 said:

@sirfizzwhizz said:

@bones309: lol re read the comic. The issue was Zarathos broke free of Mojo's mind control. Same mind control that enslaved Thor, Strange, and ManThing I might add. Then to stop Zarathos Strange said to seperate Blaze from the Spirit which Santana failed to do, but Rogue did. That plan did not work as only Blaze can control the Rider.

In fact a qoute from Strange. "Santana you are our only hope. You must seperate the Spirit from Blaze to reset the curse."

So....

Honestly, I can't reread it. First off, I can't remember the title to look it up (it was an Avenger's Annual I believe)and second I no longer have Marvel Unlimited. I don't get how seperating Blaze from Zarathos would have helped anything. Again, Blaze is what keeps him in check by your own admission. So your saying Strange's plan to stop a crazed Zarathos was to separate him from the only person/thing that keeps him in check? Maybe your right thought. To be fair it's been a bit since i read it and this issue was really dumb. It's one of the worst comics I've read in a while.

Here ya go.

As highlited. Pry the spirit from the host. Seperate the SoV from Blaze. All stated.

Rogue pulls the Spirit out of Blaze.

This is true….I was going to post this myself but you beat me to it. Don't let it be said I'm not one to admit I'm wrong. Really, as I've said, this wasn't my point. We got nothing when it comes to answers to this fight. It's best just to let it go for now. All the theories has been addressed but no real answers have been established.

ghostrider

Zarathos

@scathanapprover: Exhibit A: Thor clearly whipping Mephistos ass,(In Mephistos own realm)

It was Zarathos who beat Mephisto regardless of the false Bullshit Asgardian Brony wishes to spew out of his liars mouth.

Alejandra's use of of power and scale of power is stated something Blaze could do, but chose to never explore.

Stated that the power used by Alejandra is Zarathos, and she always holds the power back.

Stated that the power to wipe out earth is all Alejandra's own power, none of it Adams.

Stated again that Adam is not the power, just makes Alejandra use Zarathos full power.

Again Adam only shows the ability to force Alejandra use Zarathos full power when she does not want to.

Again stated plain as freaking day that the Power is Zarathos own, not Adam's and Adam only controls her, the host in using it. Nothing more nothing less.

Here is why Alejandra needed Adam's help. Not for a power up but to force Zarathos power out. As stated the mission Alejandra wanted to do against Mephisto was something Zarathos would not like.

So Alejandra force Adam to unlike the power in her yet again this time willingly on Alejandra's part to fight Mephisto at full strength. Zarathos strength.

Once again Asgardianbrony is a god dang liar, and ignorant to the GR lore to low ball however he can. Its pathetic.

thor outclasses him in every single aspect

No opponent of ghost rider realized ever that they can avoid the penance stare by not looking at his eyes?

@scathanapprover: Exhibit B: Thor clearly whipping Mephistos ass, for the second time. (Again, in his own back yard) lol. Stalemate? I beg to differ. In the final panel of the first page, MEPHISTO CLEARLY SAYS HE GOT HIS ASS KICKED.He immediately says that HE CANNOT DIE. And that is Mephistos idea of a stalemate. lol. He sounds like a butthurt sore loser. Later in the same comic, he realizes he can only survive by keeping Thor's hammer away for 60 seconds. It should be noted that aside from delaying Thor from reaching his hammer in time, Mephisto's HellFire has ABSOLUTELY NO EFFECT ON THOR, AND NEITHER DID GHOST RIDERS WHEN HIM AND THOR FOUGHT YEARS AGO. Thor has not had the 60 second limitation in many years. Thor by violent hammer blows to the dome. Nuff said.

@freefa11: Stalemate? lol. Its not a stalemate just cause Mephisto said so. Thor whipped his ass and Mephisto clearly admits it in the final panel. Nice scans.

Epic Fail at trolling lmao.

Gallery

@goldcreole: " Ghostie didnt even use his chain or penance stare" Yea, but Thor didnt use his lightning or God Blast. Whats your point? This was more of plot device battle to show how strong Zarathos is. For the record, I dont think that chain could hurt Thor and I dont think the Penance stare would have a great effect on a Gods soul.

I will concede Thor got beat here, but this doesnt mean Zarathos/Ghost Rider wins this fight 100% of the time. Its like any other fight between two hardcore combatants, like Ali vs Frazier or Conor McGregor vs Nate Diaz. They might split the fights. For example, the first time Thor fought Gladiator, he got beat fair and square. Thor proceeded to kick his ass the next 3 times they fought.

I have only read a couple of ghost rider comics and in them rider always look very closely to the eyes of their enemies, i dont see the point in that if he can simply shoot it, anyways, thor is unaffected by the penance stare , so dont really matters, but well, i learned something new here, im glad for it

Why would Thor be unaffected by the penance stare?

When they fought and ghost rider used his penance stare against thor, thor was compltely unaffected, and said that that was a terrific power and that is no wonder mortals wither, but he is mystic too, and cant be affected by that