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#1 Posted by Shadow_KingOf Killers (583 posts) - - Show Bio

Daniel Ketch Vs Johnny Blaze  who wins and why? and who's the better ghost rider?

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#2 Posted by the creator (8561 posts) - - Show Bio

Well it looks Like Marvel will actually be making them clash soon in comics so we should know soon.

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#3 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

JB for sure.

Current Johnny Blaze is about as powerful as Ketch late in his series.

Old school Ketch was hurt by Blaze's hellfire shotgun.  All versions of Blaze as Ghost Rider can shoot hellfire.  That's a problem for Dan.

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#4 Posted by Shadow_KingOf Killers (583 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"JB for sure.

Current Johnny Blaze is about as powerful as Ketch late in his series.

Old school Ketch was hurt by Blaze's hellfire shotgun.  All versions of Blaze as Ghost Rider can shoot hellfire.  That's a problem for Dan."

cool.  
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#5 Posted by King Saturn (220478 posts) - - Show Bio
I gonna go with Johnny Blaze here...
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#6 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"JB for sure.

Current Johnny Blaze is about as powerful as Ketch late in his series.

Old school Ketch was hurt by Blaze's hellfire shotgun.  All versions of Blaze as Ghost Rider can shoot hellfire.  That's a problem for Dan."
danny can also shoot hellfire, i think it will be a stalemate because penance stare wont work hellfire projection wont be any good there both immune to physical attacks i can't see a winner.
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#7 Posted by TheDrifter (24811 posts) - - Show Bio
the creator said:
"Well it looks Like Marvel will actually be making them clash soon in comics so we should know soon."
We're gonna know really soon
We're gonna know really soon
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#8 Posted by King Saturn (220478 posts) - - Show Bio
TheDrifter said:
"the creator said:
"Well it looks Like Marvel will actually be making them clash soon in comics so we should know soon."
We're gonna know really soon
We're gonna know really soon
"
Ah Very Nice
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#9 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"JB for sure.

Current Johnny Blaze is about as powerful as Ketch late in his series.

Old school Ketch was hurt by Blaze's hellfire shotgun.  All versions of Blaze as Ghost Rider can shoot hellfire.  That's a problem for Dan."
danny can also shoot hellfire, i think it will be a stalemate because penance stare wont work hellfire projection wont be any good there both immune to physical attacks i can't see a winner."

Depends what version we go with.  In Ghost Rider 14, Ketch was very much vulnerable to hellfire.

With the new version of Ketch....well, we'll just have to see :-)
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#10 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio

iv made up my mind its danny because of the fact he is bound to noble kale

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#11 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

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#12 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong
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#13 Posted by lboy (583 posts) - - Show Bio

Blaze!!!

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#14 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
lboy said:
"Blaze!!!"

why
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#15 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally.
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#16 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel
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#17 Posted by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos.
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#18 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos."

would this explain why johhny can use the penance stare?
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#19 Edited by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos."

would this explain why johhny can use the penance stare?"
Being the fire that rains down from Heaven? Yes, plus it makes alot of sense for all of them. But also, Vengeance was also able to use the penance stare and both he and Noble Kale were fragments of Zarathos. So whatever they can do, he should be able to do... and more, which he does. He displayed powerful magical abilities in his appearance against the Midnight Sons. He has also displayed magic in the current Ghost Rider series aswell, such as levitating a cross and crushing someone with it or transmuting things.
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#20 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos."

would this explain why johhny can use the penance stare?"
Being the fire that rains down from Heaven? Yes, plus it makes alot of sense for all of them. But also, Vengeance was also able to use the penance stare and both he and Noble Kale were fragments of Zarathos. So whatever they can do, he should be able to do... and more, which he does. He displayed powerful magical abilities in his appearance against the Midnight Sons. He has also displayed magic in the current Ghost Rider series aswell, such as levitating a cross and crushing someone with it or transmuting things."
but in vicious cycle when johnny first uses the penance stare on doctor strange he says thats he has never been able use it before
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#21 Posted by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos."

would this explain why johhny can use the penance stare?"
Being the fire that rains down from Heaven? Yes, plus it makes alot of sense for all of them. But also, Vengeance was also able to use the penance stare and both he and Noble Kale were fragments of Zarathos. So whatever they can do, he should be able to do... and more, which he does. He displayed powerful magical abilities in his appearance against the Midnight Sons. He has also displayed magic in the current Ghost Rider series aswell, such as levitating a cross and crushing someone with it or transmuting things."
but in vicious cycle when johnny first uses the penance stare on doctor strange he says thats he has never been able use it before"
I believe he said he learned it from Danny Ketch.
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#22 Posted by Shadow_KingOf Killers (583 posts) - - Show Bio

whatever happan to vengeance? is he still around in the comics?

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#23 Posted by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
Shadow_KingOf Killers said:
"

whatever happan to vengeance? is he still around in the comics?

"
Hopefully we find out.
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#24 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"DEADPOOL said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"

But it's Blaze's book, so in the end, he'll probably win. :-p

But Noble Kale merged Ghost Rider is pretty powerful.  Blew Blackheart right off the map.

"

thats what i mean danny is just to strong"

I haven't seen any Daniel Ketch feats that have outshined the ones we're seeing Blaze and the Spirit of Vengeance accomplish these days, personally."

noble kale is the angel of death in marvel"
That seems to have been retconned, possibly with everything else. Noble Kale for instance was a fragment of Zarathos, but now it turns out they're both angels that deliver God's wrath. I'm interested in seeing how much is retconned, the Ghost Rider series is 10x more convoluted than Spider-Man's Clone Saga.

As for my choice, I pick Johnny Blaze/Zarathos."

would this explain why johhny can use the penance stare?"
Being the fire that rains down from Heaven? Yes, plus it makes alot of sense for all of them. But also, Vengeance was also able to use the penance stare and both he and Noble Kale were fragments of Zarathos. So whatever they can do, he should be able to do... and more, which he does. He displayed powerful magical abilities in his appearance against the Midnight Sons. He has also displayed magic in the current Ghost Rider series aswell, such as levitating a cross and crushing someone with it or transmuting things."
but in vicious cycle when johnny first uses the penance stare on doctor strange he says thats he has never been able use it before"
I believe he said he learned it from Danny Ketch."
ill quote the him "i know what this is i've seen this before, the kid danny ketch he used to do this when he was ghost rider, this is the penance stare, its not somthing that i've used before, not somthing i knew i could even tap into, but then again im not calling the shots right now" the quote is from vicious cycle
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#25 Edited by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
blade hunter said:
"ill quote the him "i know what this is i've seen this before, the kid danny ketch he used to do this when he was ghost rider, this is the penance stare, its not somthing that i've used before, not somthing i knew i could even tap into, but then again im not calling the shots right now" the quote is from vicious cycle"
Well that explains it, Zarathos used it, not Johnny. Danny Ketch technically never used the Penance Stare either, Noble Kale was always in control. 
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#26 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

For the billionth time.  Zarathos isn't a part of modern Ghost Rider.

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#27 Posted by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"For the billionth time.  Zarathos isn't a part of modern Ghost Rider."
The current Ghost Rider series takes place after the Hammer Lane mini-series where Zarathos reforms himself inside of Johnny and they make a truce, which led to Road to Damnation where Johnny tries to escape from Hell by making a deal with an Angel... which turned out to be a lie and he returned to hell, only to finally escape in his new series.
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#28 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm pretty sure Hammer Lane and Road to Damnation aren't cannon.  There's a lot of inconsistancies.

In fact, as told in Life and Death of Johnny Blaze (not even that good of a story mind you but certainly cannon as it takes place during the current series), Johnny never regained the power of the Ghost Rider until he was sent to hell.  His powers in Road to Damnation were also completely different than the ones he currently wields.

His powers are well beyond anything Zarathos has ever done.  That's not Zarathos.  It's the spirit of vengeance.

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#29 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"

I'm pretty sure Hammer Lane and Road to Damnation aren't cannon.  There's a lot of inconsistancies.

In fact, as told in Life and Death of Johnny Blaze (not even that good of a story mind you but certainly cannon as it takes place during the current series), Johnny never regained the power of the Ghost Rider until he was sent to hell.  His powers in Road to Damnation were also completely different than the ones he currently wields.

His powers are well beyond anything Zarathos has ever done.  That's not Zarathos.  It's the spirit of vengeance.

"

are u saying noble kale?
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#30 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

Nah, more like God's vengeance.  It's stupid but it is what it is and it ain't Zarathos.

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#31 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio

we don't really know yet, with the new origin and everything and we don't know what zarathos can do at full power but i get ur point

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#32 Posted by TheDrifter (24811 posts) - - Show Bio

I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......

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#33 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
TheDrifter said:
"I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......"
well noble is the angel of death which is pritty much the same thing
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#34 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio
TheDrifter said:
"I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......"

Then why is he such a bad guy?
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#35 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"TheDrifter said:
"I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......"

Then why is he such a bad guy?"
zarathos dose what is best for him and if thats being the bad guy then he will do it but with johnny he's kind of an anti-hero, so what im saying is he dose what benafits him the most
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#36 Edited by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"

I'm pretty sure Hammer Lane and Road to Damnation aren't cannon.  There's a lot of inconsistancies.

In fact, as told in Life and Death of Johnny Blaze (not even that good of a story mind you but certainly cannon as it takes place during the current series), Johnny never regained the power of the Ghost Rider until he was sent to hell.  His powers in Road to Damnation were also completely different than the ones he currently wields.

His powers are well beyond anything Zarathos has ever done.  That's not Zarathos.  It's the spirit of vengeance.

"

You mean Zarathos as Ghost Rider? In the original series, Zarathos was very weak from being trapped in the Soul Crystal and Johnny was able to remain in control, but didn't have knowledge of what power he possessed. As Zarathos slowly regained his strength though, Johnny found it harder to remain in control until Zarathos was split from Johnny, willingly entering the Soul Crystal to wage an eternal battle with his mortal enemy Centurious.
When Zarathos later returned in the Midnight Sons, he possessed powerful magic and could even control all the elements, not just fire and Hellfire. And since at full power he rivals Mephisto, I don't think we've ever seen Zarathos' true power.

In the Life and Death of Johnny Blaze, he was shot shot in the head and killed by Satan's Earthly servants as he was attempting to transform into Ghost Rider. Since Johnny can die, they went to Hell. However this was a part of Satan's plan to escape, since what Johnny didn't realize was that he's bonded to an Angel and can leave whenever he wants. This would explain Johnny's sudden entrapment in Hell at the beginning of Road to Damnation.

In Road to Damnation, Johnny mentioned learning some "tricks" during his time in Hell.
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#37 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio

Right, tricks like spitting hellfire 100 feet or shooting flaming chains out of his mouth, things he's never done before or since.

blade hunter said:

"Zoom said:
"TheDrifter said:
"I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......"

Then why is he such a bad guy?"
zarathos dose what is best for him and if thats being the bad guy then he will do it but with johnny he's kind of an anti-hero, so what im saying is he dose what benafits him the most
"
Did you read Seige of Darkness?  The guy's evil with a capital E.
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#38 Posted by blade hunter (1917 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"Right, tricks like spitting hellfire 100 feet or shooting flaming chains out of his mouth, things he's never done before or since.

blade hunter said:
"Zoom said:
"TheDrifter said:
"I always thought Zarathos was God's Vengeance......"

Then why is he such a bad guy?"
zarathos dose what is best for him and if thats being the bad guy then he will do it but with johnny he's kind of an anti-hero, so what im saying is he dose what benafits him the most
"
Did you read Seige of Darkness?  The guy's evil with a capital E."
yeah but thats what evil people [in this case demon] do they do what benifits them the most
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#39 Edited by DEADPOOL (2945 posts) - - Show Bio
Zoom said:
"Right, tricks like spitting hellfire 100 feet or shooting flaming chains out of his mouth, things he's never done before or since."
Well Johnny learned them in Hell, so of course he never used them before. And I believe I recall him spitting fire in the current series.
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#40 Posted by Zoom (14751 posts) - - Show Bio
DEADPOOL said:
"Zoom said:
"Right, tricks like spitting hellfire 100 feet or shooting flaming chains out of his mouth, things he's never done before or since."
Well Johnny learned them in Hell, so of course he never used them before. And I believe I recall him spitting fire in the current series."
He's thrown fire.  He's exploded.  Never spat it, though he did it 2 or 3 times during Road to Damnation.
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#41 Posted by ghost rider 109 (2 posts) - - Show Bio

jonny blaze will so win and please be my freind

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#42 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio

JB except for movie version
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#43 Posted by NightFang3 (11945 posts) - - Show Bio

Johnny Blaze should win.