Apocalypse (FOX) vs Superman (DCEU)

Morals on, Apocalypse has knowledge of Superman but has not prepped for this fight, Superman has no knowledge and has not prepped for this fight. Battle takes place in New York City.

I think Apocalypse, he can kill Supes like he killed those guys in Poland.

I'm just curious to know what makes people think Apocalypse can hurt Superman. I believe someone has to enter his mind first/there has to be a "special" connection between the two for Apocalypse to inflict telepathic damage. As he stated himself he cannot "invade" others' minds merely protect himself and others. The highest showing he has is turning a city into a pyramid-shaped building. That's very impressive, but I do not see how it could be argued that could take out Superman permanently. He didn't get any true offensive showing either besides against regular humans, no?

Merely asking because when I first went into the movie I figured it was going to be an obvious win for Apocalypse considering the comments which were made here. A lot of things were indeed as impressive as was claimed, but I did not see anything from Apocalypse I'd figure could take someone as durable as Superman out of the fight.

@cvdebater666: How can Supes take on Apocalypse(who has shields)

@js_the_beast

By the fact that he possibly has a higher output than what is currently known Apocalypse can shield himself from? The best thing he shielded himself from is Phoenix Jean and we don't know how far she had to reach into that force nor do we know the extend of its power. The next best thing he shielded himself from is Magneto's barrage of regular scrap metal objects which barely seemed to travel faster than 50MPH. Because of this it could be plausible to assume Superman has the damage output to break through his shield. And before you say I am a fanboy, I also believe Magneto could do it if he didn't put out such a dumb attack. Heck, he could've probably ripped out a part of the Earth's core and propelled it at Apocalypse with enough force to break his shield. We have no facts to believe he couldn't. Just like we don't know what the limits of Magneto's shields are as of now because we've only seen Quicksilver try to push through it.

Apoc knew full well about other high level mutants, he didn't care. Knew the army would try to nuke him, didn't care. One nuke took Superman out. Apoc got this all day long.

umm .. how is this even fair? apoc murderstomps.. take a look at this thread and the general conscience of it... :/

comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/civil-war-and-batman-vs-superman-against-apocalyps-1792461/

Apocalypse murder stomps.

Superman is not blitzing a guy who reacted to Fox Quicksilver.

Consensus*

yeah. my bad

Apocalypse should win with difficulty. He was extremely relaxed to nukes and to the x-men as everyone pointed, in the end he understimated the x men and was destroyed by phoenix.

Apoc low diff

So because I had some extra time today I decided to calculate what damage Superman could do with what he has shown as of yet. I already calculated Quicksilver's speed today so what the heck.

I did not know where else to put this so I just took the first thread I could find with him in it. And it is sort of relevant considering some people do not believe he can get through Apocalypse's shields.

I have calculated the damage of what a "bullrush" of him would do if you:

First we take his speed. As of yet we can't fully calculate it. However, we have a few consistent showings (see *): We'll obviously take his best which is when he flew from being healed to striking Doomsday. Let's say he was about a third the diameter of Earth removed from where he healed to where he hit Doomsday.

Diameter of Earth is approximately 7,917.5 miles and he flew that in roughly 1.5 seconds.

7,917.5 / 3 = 2,639.17 miles

2,612.78 / 1.5 = 1,759.44 miles / second

1,609.34 * 1,759.44 = 2,831,544.32 meters / second

2,831,544.32 m/s = 6,333,984.26 miles per hour

2,831,544.32 m/s = 8,320.97 times the speed of sound

Henry Cavill = 92 KG

1/2 (92) (2,831,544.32)^2 = 368,811,589,440,609.5 N

368,811,589,440,609.5 N = 88,148.09 metric-tons equivalent of TNT

³√88.148085430356004508 = 4.45

3.5 / 4.45 = 0.79 meter height at which a 1 kT TNT equivalent must explode for the same damage

0.79 height for a 1 kiloton bomb gives us a complete destructive radius range up to 310 meters at an overpressure of 10 psi as you can see in the graph below (10 psi in a massive explosion is about capable to topple larger buildings).

310 * 4.45 = 1,379.64 meters.

Ergo, Superman's punch--which is an 88,148.09 metric-ton equivalent of TNT--at a height of 3.5 meters (the approximated height of Superman's punch) will destroy everything in a radius of 1,379.64 meters thus within a diameter of 2,759.28 meters literally everything will get destroyed (including skyscrapers and the like). Within a radius of 7,788.29 meters (or a diameter 15,576.59 meters) it can kill people.

If Superman were clever enough and wanted maximum destruction he should deliver that punch ~200 meters above ground level to maximize the destruction, to everything getting destroyed within about 3,511.81 meters (or 2.18 miles). The total blast radius lethality range will have a diameter of 25,655.56 meters (or 15.94 miles). And yes he can easily survive that case in point is the nuke which weakened him due to ionizing radiation (it weakens Superman) yet he was at the exact center of the blast... and of course flying through the World Engine.

Obviously, this doesn't actually happen in the movie because of reasons... the same ones why Superman is allowed to fly that fast in the first place without killing everyone within a considerable radius (or why Flash can unleash an IMP on Earth with minimal destruction), and the list could go on and on. Besides the 2 clashes between Zod and Superman shows he does have such destructive physical output.

* In MoS when he first learned flying he flew from the poles to what I presume to be some African country so that's probably halfway around the world. We're not shown the time but we can assume there isn't much. He once again flies halfway around the world again from the World Engine back to Metropolis (both machines were at opposite ends of the world) in what could be presumed to be little time as well if you consider the point at which the World Engine starts working and he flies through Zod's ship (like the World Engine, which feat I calculated which is a far far higher showing). In BvS he rescues Lois, which is also probably halfway around the world. So he does this several times.

That's the last calculations I'm going to do for a while because no one seems to read or appreciate these anyways. Kind of a waste of time.

Heh, I just noticed after being done with that post that I calculated Fox's Quicksilver to be at roughly the same speed (within margin of error). And here I went telling in one of my first posts that the road from human-level to omnipotence is infinite and we'd thus rarely ever see stats between character of fictional universes that could come close to each other. So Quicksilver could do the same, if he had the durability to survive it that is.

Superman. Apoc was unimpressive.

@jashro44

http://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/fox-magneto-vs-dceu-superman-1792151/

This is an Apocalypse thread. That thread has Magneto.

ohh my bad, sorry

Apocalypse wins. I just watched the movie and basically he had all the mutant powers besides someone like Xavier, and of course Jean Grey. Superman has no chance against Apocalypse's TK on a city level degree, probably even higher. Also the only way Apocalypse was killed was from inside his mind against the Phoenix. Superman will not stand a chance.

@cvdebater666: Good calc, I appreciate it. Calcs are always essential. I do them when I can but it's true, nobody seems to appreciate them and often base their opinions on conjecture even when presented with (somewhat) empirical data like this. But I wouldn't include so many digits for each number, (e.g. 2,137.3429348921...) - my eyes glaze over when I read it and I can't even read the most important part (that it is 2,000 something, for that example). You have to be much clearer. Also, you only had two significant figures to work with, if that, with the 1.5 seconds and had a very rough estimate of the distance. That level of precision, the number of digits you use and present, is both inappropriate/inaccurate and unnecessary.

@teefurtree Thanks. I'll take note of what you said about insignificant figures and can totally understand. Thing is it simply saves time (can copy paste numbers). But will do it differently in the future.

I'd go with Superman here. Apocalypse has Hax, but it isn't enough to counter-balance Superman's raw overall power.

Superman.

Apocalypse wins! Superman is not getting past his shield. Also apocalypse has more powers at his disposal. He can transmutat Clark or control his mind, he was able to control Xavier with cerebro.

So what I am getting out of this is Apocalypse tanked several 1 kiloton punches to the face in a fraction of a second without injury.

The only way apoc reacted to quicksilver was because he tapped into quicksilvers speed when he hit him. I am unsure if superman could hurt him. Magneto was planetary in terms of his power and apoc didn't have a problem with him. I mean Superman could blitz and probably kill him. How many times out of 10 would superman do that? Who knows. Plus we don't know how durable his armor was....

hmmm a difficult fight to judge imo.....

Supes

You can't just assume his disintegrating things will apply to Kryptonian physiology. And as others have already stated, Apocalypse does NOT have TP. He took over Xavier's while they were 'connected'.

@jt_gh:

What physically got through his shields before Dark Phoenix mental attack? I don't think you can assume the upper limit to Apocalypse's blunt force damage soak. He was hit by several kiloton punches to the face and wasn't bleeding or fazed. I think it's within reason to assume he could survive a bull rush and get his shield up.

Apocalypse murderizes

I don´t know!!!! my head hurts!!!!

Who was delivering these kiloton punches precisely?

Just watched the movie. Apoc should win without a ton of trouble.

If you go by cvdebater666's calculations above? This guy.

So cvdebater666 calculated Quicksilver's (travel) speed to be about 2,976,000 m/s.

I believe people punch faster than they can actually run and so I'm going to say his punches are going 5952000 m/s or so.

According to a quick googling you should use the mass of 2-4 kg for the weight of the fist and part of the arm for a punch so I am using 4kg since I am arguing for QS.

So .5(4)(5952000)^2 = 70,852,608,000,000 Neutons!

= 16 934.18 tons of TNT!!!

(Also he kicked him once)

Apoc too powerful shields, durability, and healing. Also he has powerful TK and matter manipulation.

- 55 wins and counting. 3 tournaments.

Superman has no chance here. This is close to spite imo. He'd get embarrassed by the likes of Apocalypse.

Superman would be a herald of Apoc.

Such good arguments for both... I honestly don't know

Apoc stomps and turns Supes into a horsemen.

Apoc slaughterstomp Fox quicksilver is faster than DCU supes and apoc stopped him in his tracks, supes gets disintegrated, or beheaded.

Apocalypse wins.

He did not "react" to QS. He tagged Quicksilver after getting hit many times by Pietro. Superman can do far more damage to Apocalypse before Apocalypse knows what's happening.

He HAD to react to be able to tag him. And yes, he most certainly did react, it shows his eyes moving and finding Quicksilver, then they glow and he traps Quicksilvers leg. He doesn't react to the first hit, but he does react to him.

Atleast Superman would do more than storm & the other horsemen combined lol.

Fox Apocalypse stomps as once Apocalypse increases his combat speed as he'll have no problem tagging Superman.

I was going through all the calcs (those are appreciated), but then went back to the OP and figured that BFR is on, that seems to be one of Supes go to moves when dealing with big baddies. Supes can BFR Apoc into space. If it works then Supes should take a good majority, if not... Then probably Apoc 6/10.

Even if it worked(doubtful) what good would it do? Apocalypse teleports.

That was Magneto doing it for him IIRC.

Nope, that was Apocalypse. Magneto didn't start in until after the Pyramid was done.