who do you like more: Batgirl or Batwoman?

Batgirl

Batgirl far more.

batwoman

Batwoman. Kate is more interesting as Batwoman than Babs as Batgirl.

This. But Babs was better as Oracle.

@the_kidd: Exactly.

Batwoman

I like Batwoman more than all the Batgirls combined. But I like all the Batgirls, too.

Batwoman. Unless it's ma girl Cass!

Both... but Batwoman like little more than Batgirl !!!

Somehow have feel that Batwoman still dont get her full form of character and persona !I see her like some minor Batman villain, who after some cross paths with him change side and become vigilante. Rough one !!! Sth like Pagan-Red Hood.

If we speak about Barbara-Batgirl... idk what to say... if she gonna to be in wheelchair. then Oracle - if she can walk, then Batgirl. If will she gonna to >>walk again<< , then will love to she become sth new... new mysterious dark vigilante of Gotham City.

Depends on when and where really:

• New 52 Launch: Batwoman, she was a more interesting character and just seemed more human while Simone buried Barbara under a ton of PTSD angst. Barbara's case wasn't helped when Lobdell decided to follow in Simone's groove and turn up the 'jackass' in Barbara when she ran into the Teen Titans.
• DC You: Barbara because Batwoman had all but vanished into some bs vampires and werewolves story, and Barbara got the fun and intellect back.
• DC Now: Barbara since she is still fun... and I have to admit, I am not a fan of Batwoman as an instructor to the likes of Cassandra Cain and Tim Drake, because I regard those two far more experienced than her.

I would say Batwoman, not really a fan of the current writing for Batgirl and haven't read much of her Simone run to compare her previous interpretation as batgirl. Would need to read more spoiler and Cass before I comment on those two.

I like Barbara Gordon more as a character and Batwoman more as a superhero. If Babs was still Oracle, she would win hands down.

@outside_85: I think you might be conflating publication history with skill level. Batwoman is the youngest character on the 'Tec team right now in that sense, but the others don't have their prior history intact like she still does. Particularly Cass.

Babs. Kate is pretty much a rip off of Babs anyway and I prefer the original characters. Not to mention that Babs is kinda a feminist icon that deserves more respect for it than she gets.

@kiba: Can you explain? Kate and Babs have completely different personalities and backstories. How is Kate a ripoff?

@caivu: both have hero fathers they tried to follow into legitimate government service, police or military, but couldn't for reason out of their control so after being inspired by Batman turned to vigilantism as an alternative, copying his methods and gimmicks but standing apart and independent from him and his allies. Even Kate's outfit was originally designed for Babs but DC shelved the design because they didn't want her to continue as Batgirl. While there are certain differences I find them mostly minor and shallow.

I also dislike Kate's convenient and coincidental relation to both Bruce and Kathy Kane. The world isn't that small. As well as the concept of the military policy of "don't ask, don't tell" being internal to her origin. That policy no longer exists and hasn't for a while.

@kiba:

"both have hero fathers they tried to follow into legitimate government service, police or military, but couldn't for reason out of their control so after being inspired by Batman turned to vigilantism as an alternative, copying his methods and gimmicks but standing apart and independent from him and his allies."

When you generalize like that, I agree they sound similar. But that's ignoring their motivations, which are different. It's glossing over the events that prevented them from following their initial dream, which were *substantially* different. It's ignoring that Barbara was a pupil of Batman while Kate never was. It ignores that Kate's initial vigilante work didn't involve her adopting any kind of bat imagery, while Barbara's did. And it still ignores both characters' personalities, which are entirely different.

"Even Kate's outfit was originally designed for Babs but DC shelved the design because they didn't want her to continue as Batgirl."

Why is this relevant? It not like that suit was ever officially used for Barbara, so it can't really be said to be a ripoff in Kate's case, just a repurposing at most.

"While there are certain differences I find them mostly minor and shallow."

Well, you're mistaken, quite frankly. Personalities. Motives. Methods. Skillsets. All substantially different between the two.

"I also dislike Kate's convenient and coincidental relation to both Bruce and Kathy Kane. The world isn't that small."

Sure it is. Besides, that idea didn't come out of nowhere. She'd been speculated as some sort of relative to Bruce for years due to being a Kane. It was only confirmed relatively recently. It's hardly coincidental. No more so than Barbara just happening to be the daughter of Gotham's police commissioner.

"As well as the concept of the military policy of 'don't ask, don't tell' being internal to her origin. That policy no longer exists and hasn't for a while"

DADT was still in effect at the time Elegy was written, though, so your reasoning here puzzles me. Kate's history mostly stayed intact for the New 52 reboot, so of course that stayed around too. DADT was struck down after her solo series started, so I'm not sure why this bugs you.

Batgirl

What DC shoold do is a title centered on girls. And in each issue have multiple stories about each girls of gotham: Batgirl, Batwoman, Harley Quinn, Poison Ivy, Rene Montoya and Catwoman. It would simplify the number of titles.

Batgirl easily.

@jb681131: Even though those characters have wildly varying tones as far as storylines and personalities go? It would be a complete mishmash.

I don't think companies do those kind of anthology books anymore. There were a few of them 10 or so years ago with JLA Classified and a JSA and Batman book, but they must not have sold because DC dropped that idea. I suppose comic fan prefer books where they know for sure who will star and who will work on it.

In my idea, each issue would have a story from each mentionned girls each time. Of course the stories/chapters would be a bit short or maybe there should only be 3 girls (Batgirl, Batwoman, Harley Quinn).

I didn't say they all have to be in a comon story. Each would have her own story. And having different tones wouldn't matter at all ! I don't see the probleme in shipping stories with different tone in a magazine !? They still have lots in common: They recide in Gotham, They are girls, They like to fight, They all know Batman.

@jb681131:

"I didn't say they all have to be in a comon story. Each would have her own story."

I figured that. That's why it's a bad idea. Even if people like all three of those characters, would they really be willing to pay $2.99 to get bite-sized stories for each of them? And that's assuming the current DC price point would hold for such a book. And what about readers who only like one of those characters? You'd be asking them to pay $3 for 7-8 pages. Yeah, that'll sell well, I'm sure.

"And having different tones wouldn't matter at all ! I don't see the probleme in shipping stories with different tone in a magazine !?"

Because the tones in question are extremely different to the point they'd clash, and to the point that it wouldn't be unreasonable for readers not to be fans of all three. Harley is quirky, comedic, and has more cartoonish violence. Batwoman is very dark and has more realistic and bloody violence. Batgirl is sort of a combination; relatively realistic violence but also with lighter elements.

"They still have lots in common: They recide in Gotham, They are girls, They like to fight, They all know Batman."

None of those reasons are compelling enough to create an anthology book like you're talking about. There needs to be a common theme, or storyline, or tone. Something deeper. And those characters have more differences than similarities anyway.

@caivu: I don't find your arguements convincing, most comics readers like multiple tones and different heroes. I would buy it and so would many I believe. I also don't think they each deserve their own title. Their are way too many titles nowadays and we have to skip so many interresting titles.

@jb681131:

"most comics readers like multiple tones and different heroes."

Not all in the same book. That's why there are seperate solos and why these type of anthology series aren't really made anymore.

"I also don't think they each deserve their own title. Their are way too many titles nowadays and we have to skip so many interresting titles."

Are... are you seriously arguing that these three characters (who are all well-loved) don't deserve solo series because it would mean there are *too many* series out? Or because you wouldn't be able to afford all of them? Please tell me I'm misinterpreting what you're saying, because that's ridiculous. Plus it's outright igoring that all three characters have held down financially and/or critically successful solos.

It depends on the Batgirl. If it's Cass or Steph than I like them more than Kate but if we are talking about Barbara as Batgirl then I would choose Batwoman.

That makes no sense ! People by them because titles with multiple heroes don't exist

Yes I am seriously arguing so ! We all love all successfull DC heroes. But there are too many of them. No one reads them all. But many would like to. To have the full picture.

@jb681131:

But it doesn't make sense to combine a bunch of relatively unrelated characters into a single anthology book to do that. You'd be short-changing the characters by not giving them adequate panel space to develop in a reasonable amount of issues, and you seem to be overestimating the number of people who want to read up on *every single character*. There's not a large enough audience to support such a book, I don't think. Which again is why these sort of titles don't exist much anymore.

Besides, there are other, legal ways to read up on and get a good picture of every single character without purchasing each title they're in. Heck, even right now we're on a site that's dedicated to that very thing. I honestly don't understand the "too many titles" arguement.

Batgirl

Babs

Batwoman...Babs was better as Oracle the rest were meh.

Batgirl. Don't like how they diverse characters and make them gay to gain more sales

@devildog8774: That's not what happened, and even if it was, she's way past that point now. The fact that Batwoman is a lesbian, while important, is one of the least interesting things about her.

Ever since the biggining of time until late 2011 : Batgirl - from late 2011 until now : Batwoman.

Which Batgirl? If its Babs, then I like her more than Batwoman. Same with Cassandra Cain. I like Batwoman more than all of the other Batgirls.

Cassandra Cain and Kate.

Barbara easily.

Batgirl (Babs) over Batwoman (Kate), but I grew up on Batgirl. (I was maybe six years old when Batgirl was introduced to the Batman TV show in the 1960s and have a couple of her early appearances I got as a kid.)

And when it comes to Batwoman, I have a soft spot for the original version (Kathy) over Kate (who wasn't introduced until I was . . . much older).

Batgirl by a landslide for me lol